Information to the International community

[Michel]

In answer to a topic about invites for Worlds outside the USA on PUI's forum, Mike Liesik, OP Coordinator at Pokemon USA Inc posted :

Its up to the international community to earn more invites for themselves. Organize more leagues. Run more tournaments. Get more players. Don't fight your distributors, work with them.

This is an answer to many questions of players outside the USA.

You don't deserve more because your POP results in terms of leagues, tournaments and players are not good enough.

Work harder guys, you're sleeping !!!

BTW, in many countries, if the Pokemon community didn't fight their distributors, there would be no POP at all.
Working with distributors, without fighting to make them move, means sleeping with them :biggrin:

Everything you do for Pokemon in your country or area as League Leader, Judge or TO, the time, energy and sometimes even money you put in POP, you do it FOR FREE.

But if you want more prizes that don't cost a single dollar to PUI or to the local distributors like invites, work harder for POP ...

What would happen to POP and Nintendo/PUI/distributor's sales without these people who don't work hard enough ? :nonono:

You guys in Germany, England, Italy, ... you have the answer. Like they have it in Holland.

 

[Marcello-Milord]

LOL Michel...

We are not working harder?
And what about carrying Packages for 2 Prereleases today from the warehouse of the delivery service to the store (the other side of Milano) on foot?
What about having always fights with distributor?
What about hearing from it to a guy who want to start his league "I suppose you'll need some League kits"?

And after all I do for OP, people think I'm the real OP manager, and think that if something doesn't work, it's my fault.
If only I was the OP Manager, down there there was 1 League for each City -_-

And the same for every single counrty in Europe.

It's not about "Work harder = get more", we're already working more than requested.
It's about "Give us more freedom and support = we'll get more OP, more players, and more sells"

 

[Rainbowgym]

I can't believe what I'm reading.



Dear Mike,

When are you going to make me LL and send me around 100 books and badges?
WE have 6 potentional locations ready to go.

Oh, you can't, why?
Ask the distributor? huh.

Oh, you mean that same distributor who doesn't want to work with us?
That same distributor that knows the local market and managed to get 1 league up and running since november 2003.
We are told they don't need us, they are the superpower, so what do you mean with organize more leagues?


Run more tournaments?

What kind of touraments do you want?
Do you mean some more of those illegal not following the floor/tournament rules tournaments?
In that case contact our local distributor, they are experts in sanctioning those.

O you didn't mean illegal tournaments, you must be kidding. That's the standard overhere.

Or did you perhaps mean City Championships and Prereleases?
When do you make me PTO? I will have 2 CC's and 1 Prerelease in 3-4 weeks with more attendance than most US ones. Just send me the contract and proper support.

Oh, you can't why?
Ask the distributor?

Oh, you mean that same distributor who doesn't want to work with us?
That same distributor that knows the local market and managed to get ZERO CC's en ZERO prereleases up and running since June 2004.
We are told they don't need us, they are the superpower, so what do you mean with organize more tournaments?


Get more players?

Why? There are enough players and they are all waiting to get league, CC's and more.
But as long as some people not get the change to become LO/LL/TO start sanctioning and get those players in the rankings, they stay invisible for you. But I know they are there.
Oh forgot I'm not the one with the market knowlegde, what am I talking about.

Don't fight your distributors?

What are you talking about?
Who is fighting distributors?

Most old fossil TO's/Profs in Europe tried to help when PUI POP started and they were told to shut up. (by PUI and LD)
Their help and knowledge was not needed.
The road to follow to get a steady growing playersbase and with that OP was perfectly clear for some LD. The fossils stepped aside and waited to enter that road.
So if you like to call, stepping aside and wait for what is offered to you from those very superiour OP providers, fighting. Well then you are right.

Or perhaps do you mean that giving feedback and reporting deviations of guidelines and rules is fighting.
Meaby I'm getting old, but I do remember PUI asking us to report.
And Mike if you don't like those reports/feedback because they are to many times negative, don't accuse the messenger of fighting.
Oh again forgot, you asked for clearification at the concerned LD and they gave you the answer that we are lying in our report.
They even provided you some background information about the behaiviour of those messengers.
For myself I got accused from some very interesting things.
The most beautifull one reached me a few days ago.

- You are selling TCG product before the release -
I almost peed in my pants
I'm not a TO/LL/LO/PTO/prof. and I have acces to TCG materials before the release date? Wow.
I responded on that acc. with the following words:

Yes xxx, I'm the wicket bwitch of Aalsmeer didn 't you know that.
1. I look in my Crystal ball and find out how the new Pokemoncards look like, run to my secret backyard laboratory and print those, wrap them and sell.
2. I Buy boxes from Psgames before release for a very high price so that they have more profit and I can sell them expensive because I'm having them before the release date.
3. I steal them from any distribution center and sell them.
4. I earn them as prizes on a prerelease and sell them.

Whaatttt? You expected a serious answer on that?
I can't even imagine that anyone would take that kind of acc. serious.
Because if this was true, than somebody in the official distribution chain is quilty.
Again I had to disappoint somebody, for not being able to do the things I'm accused of.

Work with them?

Typo Mike?
You probably mean work for them.

How on earth can I work with somebody if they don't want to work with me?
I think each of the fossils is willing to work WITH their LD.

But working for them is something different.
We did worked FOR our LD.
We did many many tournaments in the 2003-2004 season.
We maintained a playersbase of around 100 persons.
WE worked for FREE, we never ever asked something for ourselves.
The only thing we asked was leaguematerials and those so called tournament (pokeball) promocards to give away to the players.

And you know what we got.
NOTHING.

No that's not true, we did got something.
We were accused of obstructing OP.

It's amazing that a few people can be accused of obstruct a whole country's OP.
It's more amazing that an OP SUPERPOWER with all the tools they have available (promo's badges, booster, goodies) is not even able to set up a proper playersbase.
1,5 year after the start of international OP, some countries LD are telling that 1 or 2 persons are the reason that they don't have a playersbase.

So dear Mike, instead of throwing the ball to the international community, you better put your time in finding sollutions. That's what PUI is telling us all the time, so use that advice for yourselve too.
I gave some possible solutions, because I'm a very constructive person.
Now it's your turn.


With love from Holland
Li@

 

[PIKA-PIKA]

i think that PUI should do a detailed report on the distributors and it staff to see if there are enught manpower to have a OP team which will handle all the OP stuff in the country..

the thing to improve the OP internationaly is to
- define what OP even stands for (1 cc, 2 prereleases and a nc in a year do not do it JMHO )
- define the minimum of CC, prereleases, NC.. to say a country has an OP
- define the minimum prize structure for those events
- demad from distributors to fullfil this minimum for OP

and than and only than PUI can ask the INTL players, professors and TO to give more than we are giving now

 

[Prof Donphan]

I repeat to the infinity and.... beyond....

PUI must stop distributors that don't do POP and break contracts. (Holland is a valid example. Why not tournaments after 4 months?)
Give powers to international TO & Professors that would treat directly with PUI.
We don't get any money to do this work.... it's only love and that is all (Beatles song)...

 

[NoPoke]

its nice when you know you can't fail

even better when someone else will get the blame.

-----

but seriously surely none of us are surprised at this statement???????? Complain and be told to 'get behind the dutch' *shrug*

 

[NoPoke]

Lia surely you have realised by now that you are 100% to blame for ALL the ills in the Netherlands? That you and you alone are single-handedly responsible for the collapse of OP in your country? If you keep on complaining I'm sure you will bring down the government!

In all honesty I don't know what went wrong in the Netherlands. but reading what our cousins have said it seems obvious that all problems are caused by any who actually complain. Notwithstanding their prior effort and commitment to the game. Yes we can complain but noone is listening :nonono: rather than hear the justified complaint even small mistakes by us are pounced upon and used as evidence that we are totally destructive. I am sadened that PUI's response when faced with a dificulty is always to blame their VOLUNTEERS.


Now where did I leave those rose coloured spectacles and Soma tablets......

 

[pokeguru]

I am sadened that PUI's response when faced with a dificulty is always to blame their VOLUNTEERS.

Here, here NoPoke. In the UK, we don't have the best distributors (The Place For Games. EX Team Rocket Returns Prerelease. Don't ask...) but they do attempt as far as possible to do what's best for the Pokemon TCG players. But, PUI and POP seem to make it always a little more difficult for us to do what we wish to do. We had our City Championships some time ago (about a month ago now). POP only mailed us the appropriate prizes (medals, goodie bags, badges) this week. Now, I see that POP is at least trying, but it doesn't seem as though they are making it easier for us. WE are the ones that look after the kids interested in the game. WE are the ones that offer help on a regular basis. WE are the ones that do all the paperwork, all the admin, all the event booking, all the organisation. And WE are the ones that get respected for doing so and we get NOTHING for it. We do it because we and they (the competitors) love the game, but we can't do that without POP's support. If they can't give us good help, effective communications and fairer rights for the INTL people, then they are not doing their job and they don't deserve to be in charge.

 

[Martin]

Yeah, we all know about the extra trouble you players in outside countries go through in order to run a tournament scene, and don't think you aren't respected for it. I am amazed at how much initiative you people take to keep the game going, it is admirable and many of us here from the states can learn from it. Keep doing what you gotta do, and I wish you the best.

 

[Prof Donphan]

Thanks Martin....
I hope to see you in San Diego for Worlds......

 

[Rainbowgym]

All I know is that the accusings are becoming funnier and funnier.
Actually the word accusings is not the correct one.
It's more : LD "explaining" PUI why they don't want to work with us.
and poor attempts to put us in a bad daylight.
And the "quality" of those explanations (or call it defense) vary from "not to prove" untill the level of "wetting your pants of laughing".


I didn't have so much fun lately, as when I read that last one about me selling boosters before the release date.
I couldn't even give serious reply on that one (see post above), because every time I tried to write I bursted out in laughing.

I'm pretty sure about the next move:
Anybody is going to organize a CC, but they will not call it a CC. this tournament will not occure in the tournament locator untill played. So that we and our players are not able to attend.


What went wrong here?
Meaby that superiour programme layed down by the LD to get a stable playersbase is not doing well. (or worse not doing anything at all)
So what easier than to accuse 2 people, which you denied acces to that programme, of sabotaging that programme.

 

[Daddiursa]

About the situation in Holland... might I ask... In whose interest is it to have NO or POOR OP? As you know the playerbase are in it for the fun, PUI is in it for the fun & the money (it's their work)...and the distributor.... what are they in it for? Many are in it for the fun... BUT... your distributor... why can't he be in it for the money at least...? Doesn't he think OP gives any boost in sales? I can't understand why your distributor isn't aware of the possibility of making more money...

Here in Norway I really don't care too much if the distributor is having fun or not as long as he's doing the things that makes pokemon as popular and widespread as it can be in our Country (and that means leagues whereever there is a sufficient playerbase, more premier events, pre-releases on all series, proper prize support and a national championship, to mention the most important stuff).

 

[Rainbowgym]

It would be speculating if I say anything about interests, i don't have inside information about the benefits for a LD when they are running OP.

 

[TheDancingPeanut]

it is impossible for anyone who wishes to openly show support for the international movement to do so at this time - with that said, the first and formost goal of the international community should be to determine not what PUI says but rather why they say it. Until we understand the stances and positions of all parties involved and the reasing thereby, we cannot even begin to comprehend negotiating a solution.

 

[Michel]

Yeah, we all know about the extra trouble you players in outside countries go through in order to run a tournament scene, and don't think you aren't respected for it. I am amazed at how much initiative you people take to keep the game going, it is admirable and many of us here from the states can learn from it. Keep doing what you gotta do, and I wish you the best.

Thanks Martin.

You're right, some people in Europe have done incredible things to keep the game alive and even to make it grow.
Most of the time it was against distributors who thought they knew everything better, didn't care about POP, ...

If Pokemon is still played in Europe, it's thanks to these people, not thanks the distributors.

Now we read 'don't fight your distributor'. :biggrin:

Honestly, when I see official reactions (PUI and distributors), I believe it would be time to think about what has happened since PUI's POP started and look at the results the community has now in terms of support, prizes, organization, ... and compare that with the time, energy, money, ... involved by the LL's, TO's and Profs.

I've worked for Pokemon with Wizards for quite a long time. In front of me, hanging on the wall, I have a document called 'Certificate of appreciation presented to our Pokemon Professors'.
Do you remember that document Wizards sent us at the end of the license ?

PUI is not Wizards, they've already said it many times ... sure there is a difference between 'Thanks for the job you've done with us' and 'Work harder free if you want more for your players' :tongue:

People should never forget that without these people who don't work hard enough and who ask for equity in the game, PUI and Nintendo may forget POP and their markets outside USA and Japan. :nonono:

 

[Rainbowgym]

LOL

After Worlds 2004 I stopped fighting my distributor and see what happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No modified tournament untill today, going back from 4 leaguelocations till 1.
playersbase dramaticly reduced.

I will sit down and wait, hard work in the 2003-2004 season was not enough to get a single card support.
So meaby things are going to change when I do nothing.


Relaxed and Positive waiting on that moment we all can enjoy the full glory of international OP.

 

[Bullet]

Thanks Martin.

You're right, some people in Europe have done incredible things to keep the game alive and even to make it grow.
Most of the time it was against distributors who thought they knew everything better, didn't care about POP, ...

If Pokemon is still played in Europe, it's thanks to these people, not thanks the distributors.

Now we read 'don't fight your distributor'. :biggrin:

Honestly, when I see official reactions (PUI and distributors), I believe it would be time to think about what has happened since PUI's POP started and look at the results the community has now in terms of support, prizes, organization, ... and compare that with the time, energy, money, ... involved by the LL's, TO's and Profs.

I've worked for Pokemon with Wizards for quite a long time. In front of me, hanging on the wall, I have a document called 'Certificate of appreciation presented to our Pokemon Professors'.
Do you remember that document Wizards sent us at the end of the license ?

PUI is not Wizards, they've already said it many times ... sure there is a difference between 'Thanks for the job you've done with us' and 'Work harder free if you want more for your players' :tongue:

People should never forget that without these people who don't work hard enough and who ask for equity in the game, PUI and Nintendo may forget POP and their markets outside USA and Japan. :nonono:

I think PUI and Nintendo have done better with the game then what WOTC done in its last year.

But now Pokemon can be if not bigger then this so called yugioh if one thing was to stop, and thats people mainly the card shop owners who run tournaments and other people thinking Pokemon aint popular, I think alot of the big owners of stores and shops is keeping the Pokemon TCG down, but let it out, you got a huge frachise bigger then any card game out there right now, you dunno how many people there is whos has quit because the tournament scene in a area has vanished because they think can make more money off yugioh or some other game, I know thats how it is locally with shops, Pokemon is one of those games that wont necessarily bring in large money to business'es, its because its a balanced game from nearly all angles and yuo dont need spend tons of money for this game, so it dont bring in money, business'es aint dont want something that dont bring in enough money to them, I think thats the only reason yugioh triumph'ed over Pokemon was because of that, so my advice is getting everyone you can find and find a shop and ask for Pokemon, hassle them till they fall under the pressure to host a league or tournament, this way its part of working harder ain getting newer players, the player and fan base is there but the tournament scene aint, thats what needs to go down is more tournament locations opening up.

Pokemon fanbase and popularity will never die I dont think, not as long as PUI and Nintendo keeps things going, but the only problem with keeping the game alive is the greed and money, because games like yugioh, VS, and all brings in so much money with people trying to find what they want out of those games with the rarity of cards and all and plus the idea parents is why yugioh stays alive and UDE's huge payoff prize for VS is keeping its fans alive with selling more boosters and all, the store owners and managers rather gain all that money off that then host pokemon tourneys, I seen it too much already, their maybe is like 8 people joining a yugioh tournament at a time and 25 people join a Pokemon tourney at a time, and they will always keep the yugioh going because the money people spend then Pokemon because you dont need to spend much, thats what it all comes down to in keeping the game up and alive is eliminate all that out of peoples minds, I think us players and all do our job and helping, store owners is another story.

 

[jesschow12]

i wonder why this topic exist in my life cos i would like to point out 1 thing

Work harder guys, you're sleeping !!!

how in the earth are we gonna work hard if the printing of the cards in TRR and deoxys are so bad tat all over the world are complaining?? We cant even introduce them new cards when they see the RH or watsoever foil is peeling off,are we introducing a new rarity called "stickers"?

What would happen to POP and Nintendo/PUI/distributor's sales without these people who don't work hard enough

same thing as above but u lose lots of money if this problem will not be solved,if this happen again during the next set,tat means u better work harder instead of telling us to work harder :frown:

 

[Bullet]

Thats like a totally different thing, introduce it to them mint or not, thats where I stand, just because a card aint mint you shouldnt introduce it to people? Although I understand the complaints coming in about it, I only think its the first run of a new set where problems like that come up, I mean since I got started back in this game I havent had a problem with cards peeling or out of condition, I dunno why this problem is occuring since the card stock and methods is all pretty much the same as what WOTC did when they printed them. Now its possible the problem of the unmint cards come during the shipping process, it sounds to me these cards is getting stored in extreme heat really moist area or something before they are opened up out of the packs, thats just a possibility when I done all sorta test back on the old Japanese NEO and english cards that very exact thing would happen when in contact with extreme heat and moist areas.

 

[NoPoke]

I've gone back to the prof forum just to check that I wasn't overreacting .....


Mike said

Its up to the international community to earn more invites for themselves.

seems reasonable

then we get a suggestion of what to do...

Organize more leagues.

Run more tournaments.

Get more players.

All good suggestions.
All things that we are trying to achieve.

Its the next bit that caused the upset.

Don't fight your distributors, work with them.

It too is good advice but is easy to interpret as a slap when you are already trying your best without it seems the same level of commitment from those who will benefit from your individual efforts. I don't think Mike intended it that way. The reality is that there is no choice other than to work with the distributors if you wish to be part of official OP

Why hasn't Mike responded? Perhaps because he is concerned that any helpfull advice that he offers will be mis-interpreted. So Mike please accept my personal apology because I think I saw the slap in the face and not the constructive comments that were also part of your post.

Sorry Mike

Ian