Is our English really that hard to understand?
- Thread starter Rainbowgym
- Start date
Rainbowgym
Active Member
Please, don't try to talk in your sleep.
And we still do adhere the Spirit of the Game, even without that has to be written.
We don't need a statement from PUI to do what we are doing in normal live already.
And we still do adhere the Spirit of the Game, even without that has to be written.
We don't need a statement from PUI to do what we are doing in normal live already.
Last edited:
Rainbowgym: I think what some here are saying is this. If PSgames are now willing to send you league materials, TAKE THEM. Do not deny your league (kids) the materials and product that come with the kits. If you still have problems w/ PSgames for tourneys, contact OP International then. Do not block any player from playing in your tourneys, even if they go to PSgames' tourneys also. Be above what PSgames does and show OP International you can be trusted and honest. Don't stoop to PSgames' level. You have made your point, OP International is now aware of the situation and PSGames will now supply you. You have won most of the battles. Fight the tourney battles when they appear again, if ever.
Keith
Keith
ukpokemonpro
New Member
Also I think for the moment Rainbowgym can point out she isn't even a professor!! What more can PUI/POP do to her .. not much what damage does not resolving this do .. well it sends a message to OP providers and Distributors as well as the players and TOs outside north america and that message is ..
Your distributor will not fail! If you continually point out their failings and give us too much aggro we will apply the core values to you even if we do not apply them to the distributor.
After all it's not an "at will" relationship with them... harder to break a contract much easier to shoot the messenger ..
Your distributor will not fail! If you continually point out their failings and give us too much aggro we will apply the core values to you even if we do not apply them to the distributor.
After all it's not an "at will" relationship with them... harder to break a contract much easier to shoot the messenger ..
Last edited:
UKPoke: Look at it from PUI International's perspective. Rainbowgym and the other TO's/Prof. complain that they arent getting lge. materials, kits, support, etc from PSGames. They (OP) get PSGames (although late) to comply and send them the materials. Rainbowgym, etc, won't accept the materials now bc they state, PSGames still doesn't comply w/ ALL the rules. What more can OP do right now?? Yes, they have a contract w/ PSG and it is more difficult to break that than to sever ties w/ TO's/Prof's who expess their views (their right to do so also) that they don't want to be a part of OP, PSGames, etc. I like Lia and am glad she is stepping up to complain about lack of support, etc. Now, OP has fixed the support problem. Lets move on. My 2 cents.
Keith
Keith
Lea,
I've tried for awhile now to get a handle on what exactly your situation is over there. I haven’t posted about any of this because I wasn't exactly sure if there was a good answer. Now that I think I've got an idea on what is going on maybe there is an idea that may help. From what I can see there are 4 TO's in Holland, correct? What percentage of the total Pokemon business in Holland would you say these 4 TO's control? (what percentage of players will not attend any events unless one of the 4 of you are running it?) If that percentage is high enough you need to go to a business competitor of PSgames and get them to apply to become a distributor and deal with them. I know it may not be an easy road to go down, but if PSgames won't play fair, drive them out of business (well Pokemon anyway). And let's say you don't drive them out of Pokemon- a rivalry may develope that'll be good for Pokemon in general. If the percentage of players you control is not high enough then forget I posted anything.
Dave II
I've tried for awhile now to get a handle on what exactly your situation is over there. I haven’t posted about any of this because I wasn't exactly sure if there was a good answer. Now that I think I've got an idea on what is going on maybe there is an idea that may help. From what I can see there are 4 TO's in Holland, correct? What percentage of the total Pokemon business in Holland would you say these 4 TO's control? (what percentage of players will not attend any events unless one of the 4 of you are running it?) If that percentage is high enough you need to go to a business competitor of PSgames and get them to apply to become a distributor and deal with them. I know it may not be an easy road to go down, but if PSgames won't play fair, drive them out of business (well Pokemon anyway). And let's say you don't drive them out of Pokemon- a rivalry may develope that'll be good for Pokemon in general. If the percentage of players you control is not high enough then forget I posted anything.
Dave II
Rainbowgym
Active Member
dld4a - Beside the 4 of us there are only 2 places to play in this country. If we take active players from those 6 locations I would say 70% of all active players are ours.
Becoming distributor is not possible, those requests were done in the past and not answered.
Lawman-
PSG never offered us materials, not untill today.
All what happened was Jarrod meantioning in his email that they were about going to supply them (which we don't believe and reasons for not believing are stated in email C)
And as you can see, also on that email there never was a reply.
Also it's not only about leaguematerials, but getting a change to organize p.e. a CC or a Prerelease.
Even when PSG itselves not following the floorrules while organizing, we want to organize such an event ourselves according the floorrules, but you do need an OP provider to get such a thing done.
And that same OP providers doesn't want to work with us.
We have no Vote in this, PSG wanted us out, now we are out and what a joke, because of that they don't have any player left who will attend to any of their non existing events.
But we 4 will discuss again our conditions under which we are willing to organize official OP again.
Meaby there is a hole, but it's a very very small one.
We didn't refuse anything, we only told Jarrod we don't believe in fairy tails.
Becoming distributor is not possible, those requests were done in the past and not answered.
Lawman-
PSG never offered us materials, not untill today.
All what happened was Jarrod meantioning in his email that they were about going to supply them (which we don't believe and reasons for not believing are stated in email C)
And as you can see, also on that email there never was a reply.
Also it's not only about leaguematerials, but getting a change to organize p.e. a CC or a Prerelease.
Even when PSG itselves not following the floorrules while organizing, we want to organize such an event ourselves according the floorrules, but you do need an OP provider to get such a thing done.
And that same OP providers doesn't want to work with us.
We have no Vote in this, PSG wanted us out, now we are out and what a joke, because of that they don't have any player left who will attend to any of their non existing events.
But we 4 will discuss again our conditions under which we are willing to organize official OP again.
Meaby there is a hole, but it's a very very small one.
We didn't refuse anything, we only told Jarrod we don't believe in fairy tails.
Last edited:
ukpokemonpro
New Member
So the reality is that PS Games did not deliver any league or OP materials to you or the other 3 TOs and despite what they told PUI/POP they did not deliver?
Did you give them sufficient time to do so .. let's be really generous and say 2 weeks from their agreement to do so?
Did you give them sufficient time to do so .. let's be really generous and say 2 weeks from their agreement to do so?
Type O negative
New Member
Another point of view
I think it's time for me to express some of my feelings about this case.
First of all, this may be wrong but not far from the truth, I am viewed by Lia and the other 3 TO's as an enemy. Just like they have been insulted in the past by PS-GAmes, as Lia has stated, so have I been insulted by them, many times over and over again. The first time, foolishly, I flamed back. Later on, everytime we had an argue and they began to flame on me (calling me someone who'll lose the first round at the national championships and then go crying to my mom, someone who makes them look ridiculous because I just post something on this message board, and many other things) I tried to be calm and afterwards maintain a friendly positive position, because I know they have been gone through quite some things. At the National championships, I did my best to be really positive towards them, shook hands with them. I eventually ended 2nd place (winning in the last round from one of the TOs) and I congratulated Lia with her sons and members of her gym ending up high in the competition and she congratulated me on my 2nd place. But back at the national messageboard, I got the message from the TO that I won against in the last round, that I shouldn't be too proud of finishing second with a Gardevoir deck and for the rest just had to shut up. From there on, I lost much of my respect towards the TOs, excluding Lia, because at least with her I could have a slightly reasonable discussion and wasn't as irrational as the others.
I haven't been the only one with some negative experiences with the TOs. In one of the City Championships in Holland, they caused such an uproar that the shopowner, who had nothing to do with the tournament itself or any conflicts as far as I know, stated that the 4 TOs and their clubs weren't welcome anymore. I haven't been there myself but heard the news from the TO who organised the CC. Though I know the TO and the now unofficial TOs weren't on speaking terms, the fact that it was the shop owner who didn't want them anymore, made it believable for me.
Now I'm going back a little further in history. Much of the disputes between me and the TOs started after the cancelling of the first CC in Holland, after a request of them. That CC was to be held in Groningen, where I live and play pokemon. It was I who recommended organising a CC, to let the players in Groningen get used to the modified format, because we normally play Unlimited.
Lia and the other TOs suddenly became interested in competing in a tourney in Groningen. Before the CC, there never was any interest, but now all of a sudden, they wanted to compete. Which was their right to do so ofcourse, it only felt a little bit irritating, especially when you read messages from them saying that they just were going to pick up the byes at Groningen, in other words underestimating players over here. But the trouble really began when our TO said they weren't welcome because of these two points. In his opinion, the fun would be spoiled for players over here when the players of the clubs from the clubs of the TOs would compete. I could understand this point of view of our TO, although I strongly disagreed with the decision to prevent players who weren't interested normally in playing in our tournaments from competing in our CC.
Ofcourse, Lia and the rest were mad. But instead of accepting the fact, because they had 3 CC to go in close distance, while players in Groningen had to travel far if they wanted to compete in them, they decided to step to PUI, and recommended cancelling of the tournament, which happened. A funny little note was that PUI didn't let our TO know, he had to hear it from me, after I read it in a post on a local messageboard from Lia.
Afterwards, PUI came back to their decision and said that in retrospect, they wouldn't have cancelled the CC, because the distributor, PS-Games, is in charge here and is free to do as they like. Needless to say, PS-Games was supporting our TO all along.
And even though I've said many times that I didn't agree with the measurement taken by the TO in Groningen, I was seen by the 4 TOs as if I did agree, which caused much of the problems between me and the TOs.
I'll get ontopic now, but I felt that this history and my point of view of it should be told.
When I read about the plans of the TOs to go unofficial and to ban all players from their tournament who remained playing official tournaments, I was half understanding and half shocked/disagreeing.
I understanded that, after all the disputes they had with PS-Games, and the way PUI react, or better said, didn't react to theri complaints, the TOs decided to go unofficial. I on the other hand didn't understand the need to ban players who wanted to continue playing in official tournaments. I've discussed this over and over with Lia and the rest, and we continue to disagree, so I don't really feel like elaborating on that, even though that question has also been raised here.
To give my own point of view, I don't like the situation with PS-Games as well. They have been doing quite some things wrong, though I don't agree on all things pointed out by Lia. But I also feel that there have been quite some miscommunications, which made the situation worse, to a point that both parties aren't on speaking terms any more and both too proud to admit a mistake even if they knew they were wrong.
And now for a moment of self-reflection, some of the tournaments Lia told about that weren't following the floorrules while being sanctioned, found place here in Groningen. Though there were minor points, and not of any real influence (we continued using the WotC rules, because most of us didn't like Nintendo suddenly taking it all over and changing the rules and such. This opinion, I think, was mainly formed by ignorance of the real situation. I was against continuing the WotC rules and for the Nintendo-rules, but I was in the minority, so following democratic rules I agreed on the majority's wish, to keep using the WotC rules) on the outcome of any tournament, I am the first to admit that it is not how it should be. And this is a problem that is going to be fixed, cause the nest tournament held in groningen will be according all the nintendo rules. With one exception: the ability to evolve first turn using trainers powers or attacks, because many fear that the unlimited format will be ruined by it. I can understand this point of view, though I wouldn't have mind either way, allowing or not allowing first turn evolutions. Furthermore, Slowking is banned, and I think that PUI should have done this a long time ago, but I guess they're not really interested in giving attention to the unlimited format.
You can ofcourse, complain because we're still not completely following the floor rules. But in my opinion, that is looking at the glass being half empty, while I'd rather look at the glass half full. I too think that the floorrules, allowing first turn evolutions, would ruin the format and would only turn players away from the tournament. I think this is from our side, as far as we can go to follow the floorrules without losing our playerbase in the first place. I'm now hoping for a rules change in the unlimited format from PUI, to disallow first turn evolutions or to ban cards that allow first turn evo's such as rare candy and Wally, and to ban Slowking and maybe SER. But that is another discussion.
I know this is quite a long post, and I would like thank anyone who has been willing to read it all. I hope it widens the view on the situation in Holland, and things that Lia has been referring to. In my opinion, both PS-Games and the 4 TOs have made mistakes and acted wrong. But the real problem is, that no-one is looking for a real solution anymore.
There are still some other TOs in Holland, though not many. I'll probably become a TO some day, and have organised some unsanctioned drafts already, that have had, just as our normal unlimited, frequently a good attendence. Though I am playing in the official tournaments, that doesn't mean I agree on anything PS-Games does, and I have been trying all along to do something about the "injustice", as Lia calls it, myself, and with some degree of success. But I have chosen to try to reach things by using words, discussions etc. And keeping a positive attitude no matter what. And Lia, for example, has as far as I know never really tried to talk and discuss with our TO about how things are done here...and never adressed the problem before CC. And I think that is were you should start, if you want to solve problems. By using, `the word`.
My 2 eurocents.
BTW sorry for any spelling/grammar mistakes, I'll probably take care of them later, hope you can understand the post with them
I think it's time for me to express some of my feelings about this case.
First of all, this may be wrong but not far from the truth, I am viewed by Lia and the other 3 TO's as an enemy. Just like they have been insulted in the past by PS-GAmes, as Lia has stated, so have I been insulted by them, many times over and over again. The first time, foolishly, I flamed back. Later on, everytime we had an argue and they began to flame on me (calling me someone who'll lose the first round at the national championships and then go crying to my mom, someone who makes them look ridiculous because I just post something on this message board, and many other things) I tried to be calm and afterwards maintain a friendly positive position, because I know they have been gone through quite some things. At the National championships, I did my best to be really positive towards them, shook hands with them. I eventually ended 2nd place (winning in the last round from one of the TOs) and I congratulated Lia with her sons and members of her gym ending up high in the competition and she congratulated me on my 2nd place. But back at the national messageboard, I got the message from the TO that I won against in the last round, that I shouldn't be too proud of finishing second with a Gardevoir deck and for the rest just had to shut up. From there on, I lost much of my respect towards the TOs, excluding Lia, because at least with her I could have a slightly reasonable discussion and wasn't as irrational as the others.
I haven't been the only one with some negative experiences with the TOs. In one of the City Championships in Holland, they caused such an uproar that the shopowner, who had nothing to do with the tournament itself or any conflicts as far as I know, stated that the 4 TOs and their clubs weren't welcome anymore. I haven't been there myself but heard the news from the TO who organised the CC. Though I know the TO and the now unofficial TOs weren't on speaking terms, the fact that it was the shop owner who didn't want them anymore, made it believable for me.
Now I'm going back a little further in history. Much of the disputes between me and the TOs started after the cancelling of the first CC in Holland, after a request of them. That CC was to be held in Groningen, where I live and play pokemon. It was I who recommended organising a CC, to let the players in Groningen get used to the modified format, because we normally play Unlimited.
Lia and the other TOs suddenly became interested in competing in a tourney in Groningen. Before the CC, there never was any interest, but now all of a sudden, they wanted to compete. Which was their right to do so ofcourse, it only felt a little bit irritating, especially when you read messages from them saying that they just were going to pick up the byes at Groningen, in other words underestimating players over here. But the trouble really began when our TO said they weren't welcome because of these two points. In his opinion, the fun would be spoiled for players over here when the players of the clubs from the clubs of the TOs would compete. I could understand this point of view of our TO, although I strongly disagreed with the decision to prevent players who weren't interested normally in playing in our tournaments from competing in our CC.
Ofcourse, Lia and the rest were mad. But instead of accepting the fact, because they had 3 CC to go in close distance, while players in Groningen had to travel far if they wanted to compete in them, they decided to step to PUI, and recommended cancelling of the tournament, which happened. A funny little note was that PUI didn't let our TO know, he had to hear it from me, after I read it in a post on a local messageboard from Lia.
Afterwards, PUI came back to their decision and said that in retrospect, they wouldn't have cancelled the CC, because the distributor, PS-Games, is in charge here and is free to do as they like. Needless to say, PS-Games was supporting our TO all along.
And even though I've said many times that I didn't agree with the measurement taken by the TO in Groningen, I was seen by the 4 TOs as if I did agree, which caused much of the problems between me and the TOs.
I'll get ontopic now, but I felt that this history and my point of view of it should be told.
When I read about the plans of the TOs to go unofficial and to ban all players from their tournament who remained playing official tournaments, I was half understanding and half shocked/disagreeing.
I understanded that, after all the disputes they had with PS-Games, and the way PUI react, or better said, didn't react to theri complaints, the TOs decided to go unofficial. I on the other hand didn't understand the need to ban players who wanted to continue playing in official tournaments. I've discussed this over and over with Lia and the rest, and we continue to disagree, so I don't really feel like elaborating on that, even though that question has also been raised here.
To give my own point of view, I don't like the situation with PS-Games as well. They have been doing quite some things wrong, though I don't agree on all things pointed out by Lia. But I also feel that there have been quite some miscommunications, which made the situation worse, to a point that both parties aren't on speaking terms any more and both too proud to admit a mistake even if they knew they were wrong.
And now for a moment of self-reflection, some of the tournaments Lia told about that weren't following the floorrules while being sanctioned, found place here in Groningen. Though there were minor points, and not of any real influence (we continued using the WotC rules, because most of us didn't like Nintendo suddenly taking it all over and changing the rules and such. This opinion, I think, was mainly formed by ignorance of the real situation. I was against continuing the WotC rules and for the Nintendo-rules, but I was in the minority, so following democratic rules I agreed on the majority's wish, to keep using the WotC rules) on the outcome of any tournament, I am the first to admit that it is not how it should be. And this is a problem that is going to be fixed, cause the nest tournament held in groningen will be according all the nintendo rules. With one exception: the ability to evolve first turn using trainers powers or attacks, because many fear that the unlimited format will be ruined by it. I can understand this point of view, though I wouldn't have mind either way, allowing or not allowing first turn evolutions. Furthermore, Slowking is banned, and I think that PUI should have done this a long time ago, but I guess they're not really interested in giving attention to the unlimited format.
You can ofcourse, complain because we're still not completely following the floor rules. But in my opinion, that is looking at the glass being half empty, while I'd rather look at the glass half full. I too think that the floorrules, allowing first turn evolutions, would ruin the format and would only turn players away from the tournament. I think this is from our side, as far as we can go to follow the floorrules without losing our playerbase in the first place. I'm now hoping for a rules change in the unlimited format from PUI, to disallow first turn evolutions or to ban cards that allow first turn evo's such as rare candy and Wally, and to ban Slowking and maybe SER. But that is another discussion.
I know this is quite a long post, and I would like thank anyone who has been willing to read it all. I hope it widens the view on the situation in Holland, and things that Lia has been referring to. In my opinion, both PS-Games and the 4 TOs have made mistakes and acted wrong. But the real problem is, that no-one is looking for a real solution anymore.
There are still some other TOs in Holland, though not many. I'll probably become a TO some day, and have organised some unsanctioned drafts already, that have had, just as our normal unlimited, frequently a good attendence. Though I am playing in the official tournaments, that doesn't mean I agree on anything PS-Games does, and I have been trying all along to do something about the "injustice", as Lia calls it, myself, and with some degree of success. But I have chosen to try to reach things by using words, discussions etc. And keeping a positive attitude no matter what. And Lia, for example, has as far as I know never really tried to talk and discuss with our TO about how things are done here...and never adressed the problem before CC. And I think that is were you should start, if you want to solve problems. By using, `the word`.
My 2 eurocents.
BTW sorry for any spelling/grammar mistakes, I'll probably take care of them later, hope you can understand the post with them
Last edited:
Rainbowgym
Active Member
UKpro
NO we (Henna en me) didn't get anything, not from last year and not from this year, Nothing.
The other 2 got last year untill those energy promo's (no badges) and than there was an argu between those 2 TO's and PSG, and the 2 TO's prefered to step out OP and did send the materials back.
We didn't hear a single word from PSG, since I had a "conversation" with the Manager OP at Worlds august 22nd.
I really don't know when or where this supposed agreement to send us materials was made.
We only know that Jarrod mentioned (see mail) that PSG was telling him that they were willing to send and that is it.
The last contact we official had concerning OP in the Netherlands, was in April 2004 when we got a letter from the President of PSG.
Stating that he was free to do whatever he wanted regarding OP (and seeing what they it, that's includes ignoring the floorrules), and that they are in charge.
Remark: this letter also stated that the Netherlands was the most active country regarding OP at that time.
( I wonder on which numbers that was based, I surely don't hope on the tournaments Henna en me did )
NO we (Henna en me) didn't get anything, not from last year and not from this year, Nothing.
The other 2 got last year untill those energy promo's (no badges) and than there was an argu between those 2 TO's and PSG, and the 2 TO's prefered to step out OP and did send the materials back.
We didn't hear a single word from PSG, since I had a "conversation" with the Manager OP at Worlds august 22nd.
I really don't know when or where this supposed agreement to send us materials was made.
We only know that Jarrod mentioned (see mail) that PSG was telling him that they were willing to send and that is it.
The last contact we official had concerning OP in the Netherlands, was in April 2004 when we got a letter from the President of PSG.
Stating that he was free to do whatever he wanted regarding OP (and seeing what they it, that's includes ignoring the floorrules), and that they are in charge.
Remark: this letter also stated that the Netherlands was the most active country regarding OP at that time.
( I wonder on which numbers that was based, I surely don't hope on the tournaments Henna en me did
)
Last edited:
Rainbowgym
Active Member
TON
Not really, only as somebody who doesn't know were he is talking about, And when you speak you only spreading rumors.
This is new for me not welcome anymore? another rumor meaby??
And yes there was a loud discussion, because that certain TO didn't allow our players to play with Target Promo Torchic. And because that is a complete LEGAL card to play, he was wrong and we told him to look into the floorrules which cards are allowed in Modified, but he started yelling at me and saying that he was in charge and that if he banned cards he could. REMEMBER this was an official CITY CHAMPIONSHIP.
My Dear TON
1. CC's are open for ALL PLAYERS and not only the ones living in Groningen. And with only 4 CC's in the whole country, you could expect players from outside. We travel always to play LEGAL tournaments.
2. While PSG supported the fact that players from outside were not welcome, we only mailed PUI about this situation. That the CC was cancelled was never even suggested by us. It was the soul and only decision of PUI, not ours. But again you are spreading rumors and trieing to put me in a bad daylight.
3. You TO is not an official TO. His tournaments are sancionted by PSG and not by him so in a straight way he even doesn't exist in the records.
4. I don't believe PUI came back on their decision to cancel that CC, no way. And you know why I don't believe this, because if they let PSG ignore the floorrules/tournament rules why should anybody in the World feel the need to follow them.
By the Way, did you read with your own eyes the emails + letter PUI did send concerning this matter?
IF not you are again spreading rumors.
You can play it that way, but don't sanction it, that's all we are saying.
Or are you again putting up a rumor.
I have some emails from long before send by myself, but also DDM tried to discuss with your TO about unlimited/modified etc.
So TON the only thing you are doing is stating rumors.
The only fact you are giving is that you agree/play in sanctioned tournaments who are NOT according the floorrules. You call that a minor issue and meaby it is, but as player you need to read this in the spirit of the game.
Observe the rules – No good Pokémon player would ever deliberately break the rules
And what are you doing, you break the rules and even admit it.
And you are the one who made the Professor test and passed??
You are the one who is going to play another NOT ACCORDING TO THE FLOORRULES tournament, because you are not willing to prevent your TO form sanctioning?
That's what I call the real Spirit of the Game.
Not really, only as somebody who doesn't know were he is talking about, And when you speak you only spreading rumors.
This is new for me not welcome anymore? another rumor meaby??
And yes there was a loud discussion, because that certain TO didn't allow our players to play with Target Promo Torchic. And because that is a complete LEGAL card to play, he was wrong and we told him to look into the floorrules which cards are allowed in Modified, but he started yelling at me and saying that he was in charge and that if he banned cards he could. REMEMBER this was an official CITY CHAMPIONSHIP.
My Dear TON
1. CC's are open for ALL PLAYERS and not only the ones living in Groningen. And with only 4 CC's in the whole country, you could expect players from outside. We travel always to play LEGAL tournaments.
2. While PSG supported the fact that players from outside were not welcome, we only mailed PUI about this situation. That the CC was cancelled was never even suggested by us. It was the soul and only decision of PUI, not ours. But again you are spreading rumors and trieing to put me in a bad daylight.
3. You TO is not an official TO. His tournaments are sancionted by PSG and not by him so in a straight way he even doesn't exist in the records.
4. I don't believe PUI came back on their decision to cancel that CC, no way. And you know why I don't believe this, because if they let PSG ignore the floorrules/tournament rules why should anybody in the World feel the need to follow them.
By the Way, did you read with your own eyes the emails + letter PUI did send concerning this matter?
IF not you are again spreading rumors.
So you know it better that PUI does?
You can play it that way, but don't sanction it, that's all we are saying.
Didn't I???
Or are you again putting up a rumor.
I have some emails from long before send by myself, but also DDM tried to discuss with your TO about unlimited/modified etc.
So TON the only thing you are doing is stating rumors.
The only fact you are giving is that you agree/play in sanctioned tournaments who are NOT according the floorrules. You call that a minor issue and meaby it is, but as player you need to read this in the spirit of the game.
Observe the rules – No good Pokémon player would ever deliberately break the rules
And what are you doing, you break the rules and even admit it.
And you are the one who made the Professor test and passed??
You are the one who is going to play another NOT ACCORDING TO THE FLOORRULES tournament, because you are not willing to prevent your TO form sanctioning?
That's what I call the real Spirit of the Game.
Last edited:
Type O negative
New Member
LIA
In my experience, this equals, "not taken serious".
I know of the reason of the discussion. And it's a FACT that the shop owner doesn't want you anymore, So no rumour. And I also know, that yelling back at someone yelling has no other effect on a discussion except for negative ones. He might have been wrong in the first place, by starting to yell (and before, by not allowing the promo to be played), but yelling back is just as bad, cause then you're making the same mistake.
Sigh. How many times doe I have to say it wasn't a restriction for players outside of the province of Groningen, but for players who had otherwise no interest in our tournaments?
And like I said, I was against the measurements taken, even said to you before the measurement that I would enjoy playing against you.
And I am not the one that is sanctioning it, that's the job of the TO. I can argue with him, but in the end it is his decision.
And you know what? I've tried to convince people here to adapt to the floor rules since the beginning of the Nintendo take-over. And finally the mentality seems to change, but instead of seeing that and being positive on that, hoping with me that once it will be following the floorrules, you keep looking at the glass being half empty, even though the glass was once completely empty and I with some other people have been busy filling it.
What would be better, withdrawing from the tournaments, which would mean quitting pokemon because there wouldn't be another reasonable option to play anywhere, OR trying to solve things? It seems as if you're forcing me to quit, just as you seem fixated on looking what's wrong and all, but never searching for a solution, and not recognizing people who are trying to solve things. I am being rational, and know that quitting pokemon WON'T HELP A THING about the whole situation. Being there at tournaments, helping and discussing things does a lot more. And there are a lot of other things that I have set in motion, in a positive way. And maybe you'll get interested in that, cause I'll try to make sure that that is according to floor rules, and more details I cannot give.
I have been trying sort of the same thing, trying to rationally convince people here to follow the floor rules. But that isn't something that happens in one day suddenly. Rome hasn't been built in one night. But instead of appreciating that I try to help, and that Groningen is right now much closer to the floor rules, you keep reacting in an angry way. And some of the things you call rumours, are based on what you have said, most have been confirmed by others, so are facts instead of rumours, and sometimes I am wrong. And in the last situation, like I said, I am the first to admit. Because I trust you in saying what you see as the truth and I still respect your opinion. The opposite can't be said.
@ All others, I hope you are not regarding this as off-topic chatter, cause I think this discussion helps creating a point of view regarding the situation in the Netherlands, even though these points are part of a discussion between two persons. If this is seen as off-topic chatter that could be done in PM or chat, then I'll post my statements more general and not straightly headed to Lia.
Rainbowgym said:
In my experience, this equals, "not taken serious".
Rainbowgym said:
I know of the reason of the discussion. And it's a FACT that the shop owner doesn't want you anymore, So no rumour. And I also know, that yelling back at someone yelling has no other effect on a discussion except for negative ones. He might have been wrong in the first place, by starting to yell (and before, by not allowing the promo to be played), but yelling back is just as bad, cause then you're making the same mistake.
Sigh. How many times doe I have to say it wasn't a restriction for players outside of the province of Groningen, but for players who had otherwise no interest in our tournaments?
And like I said, I was against the measurements taken, even said to you before the measurement that I would enjoy playing against you.
I always thought that you suggested cancelling of the tournament, because of what you were posting at the local messageboard. If this isn't so, then what I said about that is not true, like I have said many times, if I might be wrong at something, I'll be the first to admit such a thing. But the thought that you recommended cancelling, originated from posts you made, for me they suggested that you did that. But again if this isn't so, it isn't so.
This is something I discovered quite recently. Even though I will continue to see the TO in Groningen as the TO of tournaments in Groningen, because he organizes it, not the person shown as the TO.
Well, believe what you want to believe, but PUI did come back on their decision and send an excuse to our TO. They ARE letting the distributor do as the distributor pleases, which is nowhere near a pleasant situation, but unfortunately, as far as I know it is THE situation right now.
I am entitled to have my own opinion, and that I may express it in a professional way. All I am saying is, that in my opinion, the unlimited format would be better off without Slowking and the first-turn evolutions. Any further discussion about that will be between me and POP.
And I am not the one that is sanctioning it, that's the job of the TO. I can argue with him, but in the end it is his decision.
And you know what? I've tried to convince people here to adapt to the floor rules since the beginning of the Nintendo take-over. And finally the mentality seems to change, but instead of seeing that and being positive on that, hoping with me that once it will be following the floorrules, you keep looking at the glass being half empty, even though the glass was once completely empty and I with some other people have been busy filling it.
As far as I know, there haven't been any e-mails except from the CC on. But I'll ask the TO here on it, if there have been serious attempts for discussion, this argument will be withdrawn.
What would be better, withdrawing from the tournaments, which would mean quitting pokemon because there wouldn't be another reasonable option to play anywhere, OR trying to solve things? It seems as if you're forcing me to quit, just as you seem fixated on looking what's wrong and all, but never searching for a solution, and not recognizing people who are trying to solve things. I am being rational, and know that quitting pokemon WON'T HELP A THING about the whole situation. Being there at tournaments, helping and discussing things does a lot more. And there are a lot of other things that I have set in motion, in a positive way. And maybe you'll get interested in that, cause I'll try to make sure that that is according to floor rules, and more details I cannot give.
I have been trying sort of the same thing, trying to rationally convince people here to follow the floor rules. But that isn't something that happens in one day suddenly. Rome hasn't been built in one night. But instead of appreciating that I try to help, and that Groningen is right now much closer to the floor rules, you keep reacting in an angry way. And some of the things you call rumours, are based on what you have said, most have been confirmed by others, so are facts instead of rumours, and sometimes I am wrong. And in the last situation, like I said, I am the first to admit. Because I trust you in saying what you see as the truth and I still respect your opinion. The opposite can't be said.
@ All others, I hope you are not regarding this as off-topic chatter, cause I think this discussion helps creating a point of view regarding the situation in the Netherlands, even though these points are part of a discussion between two persons. If this is seen as off-topic chatter that could be done in PM or chat, then I'll post my statements more general and not straightly headed to Lia.
Rainbowgym
Active Member
What has the shop owner to do with it?
I don't know who the shopowner is, He or she wasn't even present at that day.
So why shouldn't the shopowner make that kind of decision, without being present.
Sanctioned tournaments are open for ALL PLAYERS, how many time do I have to repeat this.
There is no valid excuse for the disclosing.
Well start to read/understand what I was writing, before spreading rumors. We told you we didn't wanted that CC to be cancelled and you were not listening.
No they are not in the way you mean, PSG and all involved still have to follow the floorrules/tournament rules.
What they mean is that prizestructure or restrictions to start a league can be set up in any way PSG likes, but doing what you like is not including the floor/tournament rules.
There are more things you don't know about (such as your TO not being the official TO)and this is one of them. If needed I can provide you an email send on januari 4th which is long before the CC was even planned. By sanctioning the tournaments of Groningen under the name of PSG they can say, Look how good we are doing, we did a few tournaments last year. And you know they weren't the ones who organized the whole thing. You know that someone else did. Meaby your "TO" doesn't care if anyone get the credit for the work he did, but we do care.
Nobody tells you to quit.
But tournaments not according the floorrules do not belong in the rankings.
Play it any way you like, but don't sanction. Start sanctioning at the point you can forfill the floor/tournament rules.
And implenting the new playingrules is done in no time, don't hide behind things like we need time to do that.
The whole Pokemon community stepped over in the new rules in no time and Groningen needs more than a year to only come a little closer to the floorrules, come on.
Nothing of this has to do with why I started this topic.
There is not a simple solution.
Last edited:
ukpokemonpro
New Member
WOAH guys you need to cool it a little lets see on what you can agree first off and then see what else needs addressing!
Okay you all agree PS Games has not done a bang up job so start from there in your future relations please .. This is not pretty and like I say it doesn't do your arguments with PUI/POP and PS Games any good at all to be bickering here.
If you want to take it off board and into a chat room with mediator I am more than willing to arrange it but can we cool the vitrolic comments please ..
Also you both appear to be taking the message off-topic
Not like me at all to play reasonable .. must take the pills again !
Okay you all agree PS Games has not done a bang up job so start from there in your future relations please .. This is not pretty and like I say it doesn't do your arguments with PUI/POP and PS Games any good at all to be bickering here.
If you want to take it off board and into a chat room with mediator I am more than willing to arrange it but can we cool the vitrolic comments please ..
Also you both appear to be taking the message off-topic
Not like me at all to play reasonable .. must take the pills again !
If I may interrupt.
Usually I restrict myself to reading on this board but now I felt the need to explain a couple of things. I don’t want to start another useless discussion here, on the Dutch boards there is said enough about this. I just want to make sure nobody gets wrong impressions about the situation in Holland and some persons in particular.
TON claims that the unofficial Dutch TO’s don’t want to discus certain problems with him ( anymore ) and he is right about that. The reason there for is quite simple. As long as he is telling lies and spreading rumours in public, there is no reason for us at all to take him serious. Instead of evolving some kind of self criticism or investigating things, before making them public, he rather seems to prefer further isolation. Otherwise I can’t explain why he is posting the same rubbish on this board, like he posted on the Dutch board already before.
One rumour is totally new for me, I seem to be banned in Leiden because of indecent behaviour during the National Qualifier last year. A typical TON rumour, I haven’t even been there.
I shall no longer meddle within this conversation, I’ve said what I had to say. From now on Lia’s doing the word on this board for all 4 unofficial Dutch TO’s, like she always has done quite well before, in this case however I felt necessary to express myself.
DDDM.
Unofficial Dutch TO.
Back On Topic again.
Usually I restrict myself to reading on this board but now I felt the need to explain a couple of things. I don’t want to start another useless discussion here, on the Dutch boards there is said enough about this. I just want to make sure nobody gets wrong impressions about the situation in Holland and some persons in particular.
TON claims that the unofficial Dutch TO’s don’t want to discus certain problems with him ( anymore ) and he is right about that. The reason there for is quite simple. As long as he is telling lies and spreading rumours in public, there is no reason for us at all to take him serious. Instead of evolving some kind of self criticism or investigating things, before making them public, he rather seems to prefer further isolation. Otherwise I can’t explain why he is posting the same rubbish on this board, like he posted on the Dutch board already before.
One rumour is totally new for me, I seem to be banned in Leiden because of indecent behaviour during the National Qualifier last year. A typical TON rumour, I haven’t even been there.
I shall no longer meddle within this conversation, I’ve said what I had to say. From now on Lia’s doing the word on this board for all 4 unofficial Dutch TO’s, like she always has done quite well before, in this case however I felt necessary to express myself.
DDDM.
Unofficial Dutch TO.
Back On Topic again.
Hai
Not many people Know ME and Lots of OTHERS do
I restrict myself in NOT reading and Editing on to Boards because I rather do things in Person. So there is no Misunderstanding. Unfortunaly I am forced into comming on this board to make some remarks. As is stated by DDDM, we 4 EX TO (get it), have given Lia "carte blanche" to Post on this Board. Everything she does is accordingly and approved by Us. So now everybody knows. I hope this is my first and last time to give comments here.
To TON
Hello TON and GOODBYE ton
"do I need to say more"
To My UKPRO's
Not in sight but in the heart of the Game still going Strongokeball:
To all Others
Lov reading all that keeps U folks bzzzzzy
To and @ LIA
GO ON GIRL ...... :fighting: ............. so there is no MISUNDERSTANDING concerning our support to her
Thank Y'all
May the FORCE be with US
Not many people Know ME
and Lots of OTHERS do I restrict myself in NOT reading and Editing on to Boards because I rather do things in Person. So there is no Misunderstanding. Unfortunaly I am forced into comming on this board to make some remarks. As is stated by DDDM, we 4 EX TO (get it), have given Lia "carte blanche" to Post on this Board. Everything she does is accordingly and approved by Us. So now everybody knows. I hope this is my first and last time to give comments here.
To TON
Hello TON and GOODBYE ton
"do I need to say more"
To My UKPRO's
Not in sight but in the heart of the Game still going Strong
okeball: To all Others
Lov reading all that keeps U folks bzzzzzy
To and @ LIA
GO ON GIRL ...... :fighting: ............. so there is no MISUNDERSTANDING concerning our support to her
Thank Y'all
May the FORCE be with US
I'm sorry, but I don't understand all that stuff about Groningen.
If you run a Pokemon tournament, you HAVE TO FOLLOW SOME RULES, and these rules are clearly mentioned on the PUI's website, PERIOD.
If you don't follow these rules, the tournament is not an official one and may not be sanctioned.
You call it a CC or a PTQ (Private Tournament Qualifier), but the tournement may not be official.
According to what I read here, the CC in Groningen has not followed the rules and has been canceled by PUI.
Who is to blame for that ? Who didn't follow the official rules ?
Is it that difficult for EVERY TO to follow the rules of the game (Floor rules, ...) ???
I've played (and won ) the CC in Made. That tournament was perfect ... even if it was run by one of the 4 TO's.
I don't want to say if PUI is right or wrong in that Prof status question. I believe it's just a question of misunderstanding and bad communication.
The only thing I can say is that I know Rainbowgym and the other To's for more than 3 years.
I've played with them, judged main events with them (GC and GS), played tournaments run and judged by them. Believe me, they know their job, they know how to run a tournament, how to judge it.
I've seen and talked many times with players from Rainbowgym and Henna's leagues. They're all very happy of what they do for them ... and they love these two women !
Honestly, I believe that PUI on one side, and the TO's on the other side, should try to find a way to communicate in a positive way.
With 'a positive way' I mean try to find a solution to see the TO's back to the official POP, and that in an environment which follows the POP rules.
When I look at the PUi's website, I don't find Prereleases or any other tournaments in Holland anymore. And I only find 1 league. IOW, Pokemon is 99 % dead as an official game in Holland.
That country deserves really more than that.
If you run a Pokemon tournament, you HAVE TO FOLLOW SOME RULES, and these rules are clearly mentioned on the PUI's website, PERIOD.
If you don't follow these rules, the tournament is not an official one and may not be sanctioned.
You call it a CC or a PTQ (Private Tournament Qualifier), but the tournement may not be official.
According to what I read here, the CC in Groningen has not followed the rules and has been canceled by PUI.
Who is to blame for that ? Who didn't follow the official rules ?
Is it that difficult for EVERY TO to follow the rules of the game (Floor rules, ...) ???
I've played (and won
) the CC in Made. That tournament was perfect ... even if it was run by one of the 4 TO's. I don't want to say if PUI is right or wrong in that Prof status question. I believe it's just a question of misunderstanding and bad communication.
The only thing I can say is that I know Rainbowgym and the other To's for more than 3 years.
I've played with them, judged main events with them (GC and GS), played tournaments run and judged by them. Believe me, they know their job, they know how to run a tournament, how to judge it.
I've seen and talked many times with players from Rainbowgym and Henna's leagues. They're all very happy of what they do for them ... and they love these two women !
Honestly, I believe that PUI on one side, and the TO's on the other side, should try to find a way to communicate in a positive way.
With 'a positive way' I mean try to find a solution to see the TO's back to the official POP, and that in an environment which follows the POP rules.
When I look at the PUi's website, I don't find Prereleases or any other tournaments in Holland anymore. And I only find 1 league. IOW, Pokemon is 99 % dead as an official game in Holland.
That country deserves really more than that.
Rainbowgym
Active Member
Michel, today we went to the Ekeren pre-release.
$30 to play and beside the 6 boosters to draft with, only 1 booster price support (+2 POP booster).
When this would happen in the US, the World was to small and this board was overworked with complains. But because we international players are not massive present here, we are never heared.
Help me how to communicate positive when I see this happening.
Must I say, great yes we have a prerelease. (and forget that we had to pay almost double than US players and got less).
Sorry I can't see anything positive in this.
What was positive, was to see old friends and trading some cards, but that can be done on a normal tournament to.
$30 to play and beside the 6 boosters to draft with, only 1 booster price support (+2 POP booster).
When this would happen in the US, the World was to small and this board was overworked with complains. But because we international players are not massive present here, we are never heared.
Help me how to communicate positive when I see this happening.
Must I say, great yes we have a prerelease. (and forget that we had to pay almost double than US players and got less).
Sorry I can't see anything positive in this.
What was positive, was to see old friends and trading some cards, but that can be done on a normal tournament to.
Last edited: