Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Is the TCG going downhill?

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^- I've tried every single one of those cards, it doesnt work, SP is too strong :/
And how exactly would you run a setup deck without claydol? Not a good diea, wont work either... :/

Kazam is too slow and discarding 2 cards is like serving them yourh ead on a silver plate, chatot is fun but thats it because you use mimci and they beat your bench to a pulk. Vire is too slow and vulnerable unless you run it as an entire deck and then it looses to everything else. And Pachirisu really is a joke, I've play Legos against Decks with Pachi countless times, it never hits you if you play smart. I know I sound like DP here but I mean it, I sometimes played without using gain at all.... Still was easy mostly :/

I never said don't run Claydol, Claydol is obviously a primary tool to help setup decks run, BUT honestly if u build a setup deck right it can take down SP decks semi-consistently or at least a 50-50.

How can u say Kazam is too slow? That is the one tech that EVERYBODY has taken for granted and I don't understand why. Yes it's a stage 2 that needs Candy, but it changes games drastically. The ability to play 3-4 Luxury Ball is ridiculous for your consistency. And pitching 2 cards to stop a crucial power is nothing. Think of it as a power spray requiring an extra discard in place of the 3 SP requirement.

I'm not saying it's easy to beat SP decks by any means, but people need to stop complaining and FIND YOUR WAY to deal with it. For me, the above cards have done wonders in most of my setup decks.

And, Pachi is only a joke if they are expecting it, and even then, they have to play around it. Trust me I played Palkia and it's a pain to know your opponent can drop a Pachi at any time and dish 80 to ur Palkia and rid u of your energy gain. And Pachi is a great starter regardless.

People said the same thing about Plox last year. "Every counter we have is too slow and loses to everything else." Well, I dunno what to tell u then, but I can say people found a way last year, and a smart player can find a way this year too. Especially with the card pool so big.
 
Dunno this croak deck probably was good but I doubt it could have won in masters, it was definitly great fr juniors cause they probably cant handle something like that.

I've really played Legos against every deck in the pt-dp format when tasing for nats and pachi never bothered me :/ When my opponent got a hit then just cause I wanted him. And he wasted more resources than it was worth in the end. Kazam is nice but a stage 2 that cant normally evolve and needs to discard 2c ard? to counter power lock? Dunno, you drop 2c ards, legos says thank you and drops the next mesprit. If you even get it up...

Kazam is nice but I wouldnt rely on a stage 2 that is so situational in EARLY game. This is where sp shines, not lettign you get a setup. The one card right now that really helps is the Promo Croak, we'd need more stuff like this.
 
Dunno this croak deck probably was good but I doubt it could have won in masters, it was definitly great fr juniors cause they probably cant handle something like that.

lolwuuuuutt

sure that deck may not have but a good Empozong beat a GG 7/10 times... just ask Jason K.
 
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Mhm ok, if you say so.
I just thought I had read some reports where GG players still won against cc/beach decks like this (at least the good ones). But idk, it was definitly an awesome deck xD
 
lolwuuuuutt

sure that deck may not have but a good Empozong beat a GG 7/10 times... just ask Jason K.

Leave Zong out of it. He just said Empoleon would have been the better contender (Probably because the MD Empo can use Cess Crystal very well) . Though PLOX being annoying and all, he chose like many others to go PLOX instead of Emo.
 
Leave Zong out of it. He just said Empoleon would have been the better contender (Probably because the MD Empo can use Cess Crystal very well) . Though PLOX being annoying and all, he chose like many others to go PLOX instead of Emo.

That's wrong.

He mentioned Empozong in several posts and his 08 report, not stand alone Empoleon. One of the people he tested against a lot (and found that he couldn't really beat a solid empozong), Alex Brosseau, played Bronzong and no Cess.

But whatever, that's Off-Topic.

Honestly, this format... it's very disruptive. It's one thing to not be able to pull off a semi-complicated strategy, but it's another, when it's nearly impossible to actually set-up anything. I can't count the number of games where my Baltoy got Bright Eyes KO'd T2 and my Uxie sprayed, or where I got Mespirit'd 4 turns in a row (but maybe still won).

I think this format is quite skill-oriented though. And there are ways of beating the popular decks so it's not all bad.
 
I think the gradual increase in card strength we see is intentional. That way, each time a new set comes out, the cards are in higher demand because they are generally stronger than previous sets. (I'm well aware that there are exceptions to this pattern, but if you look at the pattern from RS on it just seems like the Pokemon's HP go up, and the amount of energy they need require goes down.)

I will admit I am not too happy with this format. It is my least favorite modified format. There are two BIG problems with the current format IMO:

1) Turn one/two wins.

It took Pokemon about 8 years to nearly remove these from the game. In our first modified format, we limited trainers to 15, which helped, but overall, most people agree it was a boring format. (This was Prop15/3 held by WotC at the ECSTS in 2000.) Then, we had our first rotations and modified formats: Team Rocket to Neo Genesis made turn one/two wins fairly difficult, which was a nice change in pace. It was the addition of supporters that really did it, though. Removing player's abilities to go through their deck made turn one and two wins very difficult. From the RS on format, turn one wins weren't very popular. It seems like Pokemon finally adjusted their rules and created a format everyone liked. But then, Crobat G and Poké Turn come out, Stage Twos that do 60 for a single energy and OHKO a basic for a single energy come out, and voila - I feel like we're back in the stone age. It frustrates me because I feel like they were always trying to "fix" the game to remove or at least reduce those Turn 1/2 wins, but then they are careless with what they print in Japan and we're right back to square one. I could be wrong - I mean, it's impossible for me to know the intentions they have for this game because the cards are made in Japan, but I am fairly confident that was one of the main goals of creating supporters.

2) The length of games.

So if you aren't knocked out on turn one or two, be prepared for a long game. Cards like Poké Turn, Super Scoop Up, and in previous formats, Mr. Briney's Compassion make for long games. (I'm not suggesting all of these cards have no place in the format, although with Poke Turn I probabably would like to see it not have been printed.) One of my favorite things about the 2005-2007 formats was that the presence of EX Pokemon sped up games. I think Pokemon games should aim to be about 20 minutes long on average. Anything longer than that and tournaments take too long to complete. The length of games has serious consequences: Look at U.S. Nationals this year, 45 minutes for the first Best 2/3 rounds. 1 Hour for the rest. This isn't the players' fault or POP's fault. The games take too long and their simply isn't enough time to have both an adequate number of swiss arounds and adequate time for the top cut. Additionally. with long games, playtesting becomes more of a chore. This is just my personal opinion, and I'm not sure if people agree with me as much as they would about disliking Turn 1/2 wins, but I have noticed playtesting to become more of a chore than enjoyable when games can easily stretch past 45 minutes. I'd love to hear from other people on what they think about games frequently going 45+ minutes.
________________________________________________________

Those two things are both serious problems for the TCG, IMO, but that doesn't mean I'm going to quit. It's still a blast. There's so much more to the Pokemon TCG than the game - it's like a culture. Everyone who plays has their own group of friends and half the fun at Nationals & Worlds isn't even Pokemon related. I will also say there are also things about this format I like: a fair variety of playable decks, and very skill-oriented games when it goes past the first few turns.

I'd like to hear other opinions on these two things, too.
 
I think the gradual increase in card strength we see is intentional. That way, each time a new set comes out, the cards are in higher demand because they are generally stronger than previous sets. (I'm well aware that there are exceptions to this pattern, but if you look at the pattern from RS on it just seems like the Pokemon's HP go up, and the amount of energy they need require goes down.)

I will admit I am not too happy with this format. It is my least favorite modified format. There are two BIG problems with the current format IMO:

1) Turn one/two wins.

It took Pokemon about 8 years to nearly remove these from the game. In our first modified format, we limited trainers to 15, which helped, but overall, most people agree it was a boring format. (This was Prop15/3 held by WotC at the ECSTS in 2000.) Then, we had our first rotations and modified formats: Team Rocket to Neo Genesis made turn one/two wins fairly difficult, which was a nice change in pace. It was the addition of supporters that really did it, though. Removing player's abilities to go through their deck made turn one and two wins very difficult. From the RS on format, turn one wins weren't very popular. It seems like Pokemon finally adjusted their rules and created a format everyone liked. But then, Crobat G and Poké Turn come out, Stage Twos that do 60 for a single energy and OHKO a basic for a single energy come out, and voila - I feel like we're back in the stone age. It frustrates me because I feel like they were always trying to "fix" the game to remove or at least reduce those Turn 1/2 wins, but then they are careless with what they print in Japan and we're right back to square one. I could be wrong - I mean, it's impossible for me to know the intentions they have for this game because the cards are made in Japan, but I am fairly confident that was one of the main goals of creating supporters.

2) The length of games.

So if you aren't knocked out on turn one or two, be prepared for a long game. Cards like Poké Turn, Super Scoop Up, and in previous formats, Mr. Briney's Compassion make for long games. (I'm not suggesting all of these cards have no place in the format, although with Poke Turn I probabably would like to see it not have been printed.) One of my favorite things about the 2005-2007 formats was that the presence of EX Pokemon sped up games. I think Pokemon games should aim to be about 20 minutes long on average. Anything longer than that and tournaments take too long to complete. The length of games has serious consequences: Look at U.S. Nationals this year, 45 minutes for the first Best 2/3 rounds. 1 Hour for the rest. This isn't the players' fault or POP's fault. The games take too long and their simply isn't enough time to have both an adequate number of swiss arounds and adequate time for the top cut. Additionally. with long games, playtesting becomes more of a chore. This is just my personal opinion, and I'm not sure if people agree with me as much as they would about disliking Turn 1/2 wins, but I have noticed playtesting to become more of a chore than enjoyable when games can easily stretch past 45 minutes. I'd love to hear from other people on what they think about games frequently going 45+ minutes.
________________________________________________________

Those two things are both serious problems for the TCG, IMO, but that doesn't mean I'm going to quit. It's still a blast. There's so much more to the Pokemon TCG than the game - it's like a culture. Everyone who plays has their own group of friends and half the fun at Nationals & Worlds isn't even Pokemon related. I will also say there are also things about this format I like: a fair variety of playable decks, and very skill-oriented games when it goes past the first few turns.

I'd like to hear other opinions on these two things, too.


I don't think the games that last past 2-3 turns are exactly skill oriented. While some may be, I think it's just a matter of common sense. Maybe I think of 'skill-oriented' differently, but I think that's the least defining thing in the format today. As much as I hate Power Spray, I will admit, there is still some technique in using that card. But besides that card, I don't see much skill in this format. If two decks setup equally, it's just trading knockouts. There is no surprise card that can turn a game around. There is no Absol EX. There is no ATM Rock. There are no cards that really make you actually THINK (very few exceptions). And what deck can get out of a bad situation in this format? Maybe Palkia/Luxray, but I think that's it. No other deck can really find any outs in a bad situation. And I think that is what defines skill oriented. Not just each player taking a prize each turn, so whoever took the first prize wins.

And like I posted earlier, I don't think there is a fair variety of decks (due to Power Spray). You're either playing an SP deck, Gengar, Kingdra, or a stage 2 deck that is inconsistent. There is nothing new. Every list will be identical. At least last season, in as bad of a format as that even was, there was still a lot of diversity in Plox and Empo lists. Just my 2 cents.
 
I don't really play competivly, so I don't usually try to make decks that win in 1 turn.
Of course pretty much any CCG has it's share of ups & downs. People like to complain that cards are "broken".
Not everybody who plays this game has a ton of $, so not everybody is going to have 47 of every card.

With the attendence that the league I play in going up, I see no problem making the game easier to play.
 
I think the gradual increase in card strength we see is intentional. That way, each time a new set comes out, the cards are in higher demand because they are generally stronger than previous sets. (I'm well aware that there are exceptions to this pattern, but if you look at the pattern from RS on it just seems like the Pokemon's HP go up, and the amount of energy they need require goes down.)

I will admit I am not too happy with this format. It is my least favorite modified format. There are two BIG problems with the current format IMO:

1) Turn one/two wins.

It took Pokemon about 8 years to nearly remove these from the game. In our first modified format, we limited trainers to 15, which helped, but overall, most people agree it was a boring format. (This was Prop15/3 held by WotC at the ECSTS in 2000.) Then, we had our first rotations and modified formats: Team Rocket to Neo Genesis made turn one/two wins fairly difficult, which was a nice change in pace. It was the addition of supporters that really did it, though. Removing player's abilities to go through their deck made turn one and two wins very difficult. From the RS on format, turn one wins weren't very popular. It seems like Pokemon finally adjusted their rules and created a format everyone liked. But then, Crobat G and Poké Turn come out, Stage Twos that do 60 for a single energy and OHKO a basic for a single energy come out, and voila - I feel like we're back in the stone age. It frustrates me because I feel like they were always trying to "fix" the game to remove or at least reduce those Turn 1/2 wins, but then they are careless with what they print in Japan and we're right back to square one. I could be wrong - I mean, it's impossible for me to know the intentions they have for this game because the cards are made in Japan, but I am fairly confident that was one of the main goals of creating supporters.

2) The length of games.

So if you aren't knocked out on turn one or two, be prepared for a long game. Cards like Poké Turn, Super Scoop Up, and in previous formats, Mr. Briney's Compassion make for long games. (I'm not suggesting all of these cards have no place in the format, although with Poke Turn I probabably would like to see it not have been printed.) One of my favorite things about the 2005-2007 formats was that the presence of EX Pokemon sped up games. I think Pokemon games should aim to be about 20 minutes long on average. Anything longer than that and tournaments take too long to complete. The length of games has serious consequences: Look at U.S. Nationals this year, 45 minutes for the first Best 2/3 rounds. 1 Hour for the rest. This isn't the players' fault or POP's fault. The games take too long and their simply isn't enough time to have both an adequate number of swiss arounds and adequate time for the top cut. Additionally. with long games, playtesting becomes more of a chore. This is just my personal opinion, and I'm not sure if people agree with me as much as they would about disliking Turn 1/2 wins, but I have noticed playtesting to become more of a chore than enjoyable when games can easily stretch past 45 minutes. I'd love to hear from other people on what they think about games frequently going 45+ minutes.
________________________________________________________

Those two things are both serious problems for the TCG, IMO, but that doesn't mean I'm going to quit. It's still a blast. There's so much more to the Pokemon TCG than the game - it's like a culture. Everyone who plays has their own group of friends and half the fun at Nationals & Worlds isn't even Pokemon related. I will also say there are also things about this format I like: a fair variety of playable decks, and very skill-oriented games when it goes past the first few turns.

I'd like to hear other opinions on these two things, too.

I agree with you 100% on this. All my games this year have either been too short or too long. 45min best 2/3 was one of the worst things they could have done. Yes, they had good intentions, but they pretty much just ruined anyone who was using a spread deck by doing this. Want to know what happened to me? I nearly got donked the first game, but held out a while because I knew I had practically no chance at winning the 2nd game due to my opponent being able to take prizes VERY quickly. I eventually am forced to give in, and then sadly watch as my opponent takes 4 prizes while I can only spread until time is called. If I had an hour to play, I know I could have won that game.

So ya... There's a good example of a game that went on too long. What were the judges thinking? A full SP mirror can take over an hour to truly complete, and they give best 2-3 40min rounds? >_>

While 20min is a little on the short side for games IMO, I do wish that there was more of a balance. That is, less games that either end in a few short turns or go on forever, and more games that are closer to 30min.
 
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