Moderator Note:
kwisdumb - Well put.
Let us not get into a bashing mode here. There have already been a few posts that have crossed the line.
Thanks
Local Pokémon Card Group Sparks Controversy
- Thread starter vanderbilt_grad
- Start date
- Status
kwisdumb - Well put.
Let us not get into a bashing mode here. There have already been a few posts that have crossed the line.
Thanks
Scipio
New Member
*sigh* There is so much to say for this, so let me, a 22 year old player/leauge leader, add my 2 pence.
I find that certain parents use my league as a babysitting club. They dump their kids off with those cards and call it a day, going shopping in the town and picking them up 4 hours later. Why a parent can't stick around is beyond me - at least have the courtesy to do so the first (few) times to get an impression.
Being an older player, I too have been accused of ripping younger kids. But let me tell you some fun examples.
During the Pokemon Days in Holland, I worked alongside another 21 year old player as...how'd you call it, trading cops? We were to lookout for fake cards and unfair deals. This happened while my colleague was going through a bunch of cards from a kid who had a few fakes in between, a woman (I suppose in her early '50s) comes running at him and yells at him for 'taking away all of the kid's valuable cards'. And in another case, I noticed a little kid having a binder filled with fakes. I told him that since the cards were fake, we weren't allowed to let him trade them for real ones. He nodded and said he understood, along comes his dad scooping up the binder and the kid, scolding me for ruining their day.
Really, are the Late Teen/Early Twenty players to blame? A good league should ALWAYS have someone looking out for trading. I myself always tell the kids to come to me if they don't feel a trade is fair, and I also remind them that if they do not want to trade a card, then they shouldn't trade it. Furthermore, I deny ridiculous offers for them. Like one kid offering me a Glaceon LV.X for a DP Machamp. Good league leaders should look out for that. See an older kid trade a Promo Giratina LVX for a Dialga G LVX? INTERVENE. I can't stress it enough.
That is what that league should do, other then just ban like that. Smells like "we dont want to put effort in this" to me.
I find that certain parents use my league as a babysitting club. They dump their kids off with those cards and call it a day, going shopping in the town and picking them up 4 hours later. Why a parent can't stick around is beyond me - at least have the courtesy to do so the first (few) times to get an impression.
Being an older player, I too have been accused of ripping younger kids. But let me tell you some fun examples.
During the Pokemon Days in Holland, I worked alongside another 21 year old player as...how'd you call it, trading cops? We were to lookout for fake cards and unfair deals. This happened while my colleague was going through a bunch of cards from a kid who had a few fakes in between, a woman (I suppose in her early '50s) comes running at him and yells at him for 'taking away all of the kid's valuable cards'. And in another case, I noticed a little kid having a binder filled with fakes. I told him that since the cards were fake, we weren't allowed to let him trade them for real ones. He nodded and said he understood, along comes his dad scooping up the binder and the kid, scolding me for ruining their day.
Really, are the Late Teen/Early Twenty players to blame? A good league should ALWAYS have someone looking out for trading. I myself always tell the kids to come to me if they don't feel a trade is fair, and I also remind them that if they do not want to trade a card, then they shouldn't trade it. Furthermore, I deny ridiculous offers for them. Like one kid offering me a Glaceon LV.X for a DP Machamp. Good league leaders should look out for that. See an older kid trade a Promo Giratina LVX for a Dialga G LVX? INTERVENE. I can't stress it enough.
That is what that league should do, other then just ban like that. Smells like "we dont want to put effort in this" to me.
We've discussed a lot about how this discriminates against older players, but I'd like to make a point about the younger players too:
I remember when I joined my first league, I was probably 10, and I think all the older people were AWESOME. I bought theme decks, bought a box once, and would pick up packs here and there, but I remember all the older people always had the best cards and best decks, and always gave away cards I thought were amazing (thinking back they were probably unusable rares, haha). I don't know if I would've enjoyed league as much if it was just kids my age/my skill level.
Just a thought.
I remember when I joined my first league, I was probably 10, and I think all the older people were AWESOME. I bought theme decks, bought a box once, and would pick up packs here and there, but I remember all the older people always had the best cards and best decks, and always gave away cards I thought were amazing (thinking back they were probably unusable rares, haha). I don't know if I would've enjoyed league as much if it was just kids my age/my skill level.
Just a thought.
WinkWinkNudgeNudge
New Member
I can see why Pokemon prefers to have leagues run at card and game shops. This would never have happened at a store because the store owner gets to deal with the crazies.
Articjedi
Active Member
Does anyone else find this strange that about 10 years ago, this wouldn't be too uncommon? Remember that the 15+ division didn't come back until the professor program started, and even then we barely got any chance to really play.
We do have a store in Seattle that has preferential admission to premier events due to the large number of regulars who are juniors, but they don't totally block anyone that tries to walk in. I do sometimes find problems with it, but they usually hand out a pack to any older player who comes in and cannot enter due to space issues.
We do have a store in Seattle that has preferential admission to premier events due to the large number of regulars who are juniors, but they don't totally block anyone that tries to walk in. I do sometimes find problems with it, but they usually hand out a pack to any older player who comes in and cannot enter due to space issues.
actually, the 15+ division didn't 'come back' until TPCi got the game back from WotC in '03. from '01 on there WAS no 15+ division under WotC; the only OP for 15+ was professor events as one only had to be 15 to be a professor at that time.
those who don't remember the mistakes of the past are condemned to repeat them, i guess. so was this mom going to cheerfully let her kids age out of the game when they reached 16? or was it suddenly going to be 'okay' when it's HER kids excluded...=/
'mom
those who don't remember the mistakes of the past are condemned to repeat them, i guess. so was this mom going to cheerfully let her kids age out of the game when they reached 16? or was it suddenly going to be 'okay' when it's HER kids excluded...=/
'mom
cHoKoLaTeRuM
New Member
This is just madness, isn't Pokemon suppose to be good for the whole family? You know something to do on a Saturday night (Or any other day but it's sat for me) I'm glad that PoP Is standing up for the older players, they have as many rights as anyone else. I personally think that it shouldn't really matter, you know if you don't feel as if you should trade or your not getting what you think you should get or if you think it's a fake, or even if you feel uncomfortable, go talk to you League Leader they'll help for sure if there true Pokemon fans.
homeofmew
Active Member
yeah this is total discrimination of age.
The only controversy to all of this is that it was ALLOWED to happen.
And a league like this actually existed.
It deserved loosing it's affiliation with POP.
I have no idea why that league would want to do that anyway.
"she wasn't allowed to play anymore when she turned 16."
that is just wrong and sad.
this person is very welcome to move here to Houston and play here :3.
So let me get this right Happy 16th birthday and BTW u can't play pokémon here anymore? ~_~;
"My kids, after going a couple of times, expressed that they were uncomfortable around adults they didn't know or felt pressured to trade cards they didn't want to trade," said said Tabitha Orr, a parent of a player.
isn't the league run by an adult?
You know Pokémon isn't a preschool or a babysitting service.
as far as I remember 16-17 isn't an "adult" yet.
it isn't that hard to say "I don't want to trade that card"
I have had a lot of younger kids beg me to trade with them and get upset when I don't. "TINA I WANT you SHAYMIN lv X I'll trade you Suicune"
Pokémon Organized play does have a 15+ age group deal with it, that person had a right to complain about that league. POP has every right to abandon that league since that situation there was totally unfair.
Absoltrainer:
great point. It was at a public place yea? so they couldn't really do anything about it.
:]
TO: POP thank you for not supporting this situation it is/was totally wrong
The only controversy to all of this is that it was ALLOWED to happen.
And a league like this actually existed.
It deserved loosing it's affiliation with POP.
I have no idea why that league would want to do that anyway.
"she wasn't allowed to play anymore when she turned 16."
that is just wrong and sad.
this person is very welcome to move here to Houston and play here :3.
So let me get this right Happy 16th birthday and BTW u can't play pokémon here anymore? ~_~;
"My kids, after going a couple of times, expressed that they were uncomfortable around adults they didn't know or felt pressured to trade cards they didn't want to trade," said said Tabitha Orr, a parent of a player.
isn't the league run by an adult?
You know Pokémon isn't a preschool or a babysitting service.
as far as I remember 16-17 isn't an "adult" yet.
it isn't that hard to say "I don't want to trade that card"
I have had a lot of younger kids beg me to trade with them and get upset when I don't. "TINA I WANT you SHAYMIN lv X I'll trade you Suicune"
If this was a comment anywhere; well this is what I would say to that person.
Pokémon Organized play does have a 15+ age group deal with it, that person had a right to complain about that league. POP has every right to abandon that league since that situation there was totally unfair.
Absoltrainer:
great point. It was at a public place yea? so they couldn't really do anything about it.
:]
TO: POP thank you for not supporting this situation it is/was totally wrong
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afstandopleren
New Member
I have to lol actually. People in the Donk threads keep saying 'it's a kids game!' and now this happens. XD
Thou art PHALE
Thou art PHALE
WinkWinkNudgeNudge
New Member
This has obviously spun out of control. Does anyone doubt that TPCi would leave any stone unturned if they received credible reports of children being intimidated or taken advantage of at one of their leagues? I don't.
Tabitha Orr clearly does not understand the goals or purpose of the league and the game or she would be working with the LL, LO and other parents to address her specific issues and not blindly trying to exclude any group of individuals.
Picture this. You bring your 8 year old to the play ground. You see him run off with a couple of other 8-10 year olds. So you park it on a bench, break out the paperback and read for a few minutes. The next time you look up you notice a 20 something guy playing tag with your 8 year old. What would your reaction be?
You know and I know that the analogy is extremely flawed, but I'm wondering if this is closer to what she might be thinking.
Tabitha Orr clearly does not understand the goals or purpose of the league and the game or she would be working with the LL, LO and other parents to address her specific issues and not blindly trying to exclude any group of individuals.
Picture this. You bring your 8 year old to the play ground. You see him run off with a couple of other 8-10 year olds. So you park it on a bench, break out the paperback and read for a few minutes. The next time you look up you notice a 20 something guy playing tag with your 8 year old. What would your reaction be?
You know and I know that the analogy is extremely flawed, but I'm wondering if this is closer to what she might be thinking.
meganium45
Active Member
The only piece of credibility I will give to this is that the mom did not like the trading and pressure of the older players to trade the good stuff away.
I have one league, soon to be 2, where there is a no trading policy.
The older "hawks" flew away, and the other kids just love being there at this point.
Some of the older players are still there, those who want to play, but the no trading policy is strictly, strictly enforced.
Makes parents feel comfortable, and yes, all ages are allowed.
As for the age restriction, no way. I may act like I less than love the masters from time to time, but the masters are the parents, are my kid's friends, and are good young people, for the vast most part.
Like any group, the cream rises to the top. The ickiness has to be dealt with by a strong league leader.
Talk to you all soon.
Vince
I have one league, soon to be 2, where there is a no trading policy.
The older "hawks" flew away, and the other kids just love being there at this point.
Some of the older players are still there, those who want to play, but the no trading policy is strictly, strictly enforced.
Makes parents feel comfortable, and yes, all ages are allowed.
As for the age restriction, no way. I may act like I less than love the masters from time to time, but the masters are the parents, are my kid's friends, and are good young people, for the vast most part.
Like any group, the cream rises to the top. The ickiness has to be dealt with by a strong league leader.
Talk to you all soon.
Vince
CHARIZARD MASTERTRAINER
New Member
I am actually having the same type of situation here in WI where my local library is prohibiting anyone who is over 11 from participating in their pokemon activities. Its funny because I was actually one of the individuals who brought pokemon to this library while running a city tournament last year. I am actually not allowed to be even at the location when the event is held anymore, I was actually kicked out of the area, which was really rude.
I was really nice to the person who was running the event as she was a mom with kids who played pokemon and wanted to inform her about setting up a league to get free material for her to give to the children. I even offered some of my own pokemon products and empty tins that I had as things she could give away to the children. She took my offerings, but she would not listen to any type of advice I had to offer. The events they hold draw about 30-50 kids, sometimes even more. They call it a pokemon club and what they have been doing is having a game station for pokemon gamers and a trade station for TCG players and coloring station for the little kids. I thought that was a great idea, but I think the only thing that would benefit these kids would be to show them how to play the game, get them exposed to the awesome experiences of Organized Play.
Like I mentioned before, I was completely ignored and barred from being there or in the library during those events. I am not upset about the fact that I am not allowed to participate, I don't care about playing among the kids, I was more focused on being able to help the children learn how to play and tell them stories about my own experiences as well as those of other local and state players.
What is even worse is that I am also not allowed to use the library space to hold official POP events, such as the upcoming battle road or future city championships! I have told the reps that I at no point sell any pokemon product or charge any type of admission for these events, because these are non-profit, POP does not make money directly from hosting these events. I am glad someone brought this up and hopefully I can use this to show the ignorance that these types of organizations have against individuals who love and enjoy this game, no matter how old or young they are. If anyone has any recommendations or suggestions, please feel free to post or contact me. Thanks!
CMT
I was really nice to the person who was running the event as she was a mom with kids who played pokemon and wanted to inform her about setting up a league to get free material for her to give to the children. I even offered some of my own pokemon products and empty tins that I had as things she could give away to the children. She took my offerings, but she would not listen to any type of advice I had to offer. The events they hold draw about 30-50 kids, sometimes even more. They call it a pokemon club and what they have been doing is having a game station for pokemon gamers and a trade station for TCG players and coloring station for the little kids. I thought that was a great idea, but I think the only thing that would benefit these kids would be to show them how to play the game, get them exposed to the awesome experiences of Organized Play.
Like I mentioned before, I was completely ignored and barred from being there or in the library during those events. I am not upset about the fact that I am not allowed to participate, I don't care about playing among the kids, I was more focused on being able to help the children learn how to play and tell them stories about my own experiences as well as those of other local and state players.
What is even worse is that I am also not allowed to use the library space to hold official POP events, such as the upcoming battle road or future city championships! I have told the reps that I at no point sell any pokemon product or charge any type of admission for these events, because these are non-profit, POP does not make money directly from hosting these events. I am glad someone brought this up and hopefully I can use this to show the ignorance that these types of organizations have against individuals who love and enjoy this game, no matter how old or young they are. If anyone has any recommendations or suggestions, please feel free to post or contact me. Thanks!
CMT
yoyofsho16
New Member
I support this and have seen some bad trades go on, but in a game where there are a lot of lacking younger players who need lots of cards to make above average decks, it is hard to get a lot of staple cards without trading at league. A TRADING card game needs trading to stay healthy. Overall, trading more benefits the younger players than not.
Blastoise_Trainer
New Member
Hey well im from Albuquerque where is was taking hold. I was the guy in gray helping the little 5 year old to play. (lol Misty)
I thought this was so dumb that they were doing this age locking thing. Im 17 and a LL at one at league here. And every parent like me so much. They always say hi and always tell me how their kid is doing much better thanks to me. I like helping younger kids learn how to play.
I always tell them sooner or later the will become stonger them me. I never got to go to the Cherry Hills league because i heard i wasnt going to be able to play so i never went.
But I think is true that if your kids feel uncomferable being around 15+ kids. They should try to have their parents to help them or just get to know us.
Well hope that this doesnt happened anywhere else.
And to all 15 and younger kids that are scared to play around 15+ kids should hang out with us and see that some of us are cood to hang out with. Just dont be scared and play with us.
Blastoise_Trainer Out ( Jose, NM League Leader)
Class of 2009!!
I thought this was so dumb that they were doing this age locking thing. Im 17 and a LL at one at league here. And every parent like me so much. They always say hi and always tell me how their kid is doing much better thanks to me. I like helping younger kids learn how to play.
I always tell them sooner or later the will become stonger them me. I never got to go to the Cherry Hills league because i heard i wasnt going to be able to play so i never went.
But I think is true that if your kids feel uncomferable being around 15+ kids. They should try to have their parents to help them or just get to know us.
Well hope that this doesnt happened anywhere else.
And to all 15 and younger kids that are scared to play around 15+ kids should hang out with us and see that some of us are cood to hang out with. Just dont be scared and play with us.
Blastoise_Trainer Out ( Jose, NM League Leader)
Class of 2009!!
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Mypokemonkid
New Member
Hey there Jose.
Yes this was my main thing. We as parents are responsible for getting involved with our kids. Jose is awesome and these kiddos are missing out by not having him as a role model. He can play with my 5 yo whenever he or any of them want. Pokemon players are AWESOME.
Yes this was my main thing. We as parents are responsible for getting involved with our kids. Jose is awesome and these kiddos are missing out by not having him as a role model. He can play with my 5 yo whenever he or any of them want. Pokemon players are AWESOME.
EeveeLover
Member Services Administrator
One thing the Leagues in my area did, to protect all traders, is to require all trades be approved by a League Leader.
The reason for this was because we have a lot of players, both young and old, that have no clue about cards values. Got some grumbling about it, but after telling them they either did it our way or not at all, the grumblers see the point.
The parents of the newer players really like this policy, as it makes them feel that the cards they buy their kids will be safe when being traded.
The reason for this was because we have a lot of players, both young and old, that have no clue about cards values. Got some grumbling about it, but after telling them they either did it our way or not at all, the grumblers see the point.
The parents of the newer players really like this policy, as it makes them feel that the cards they buy their kids will be safe when being traded.
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Mamoswine42
New Member
wow that is so ridiculous if you don't feel that you kid is comfortable during the league around adults/teens then take your kid out of the league don't make everyone else suffer seesh
yep, this is my rule at my league as well.
and yes, i've heard the grumbling from 'visitors' whose real interest is trading with the younger kids. too bad: my parents and kids have no complaints...
'mom
EeveeLover
Member Services Administrator
Where do you think we got the idea from?? :thumb:
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