Outside the US - What is left?

[Michel]

Ukpokemonpro, are you sure it will be the distributors ?
I wonder on which basis they could do it as most of them have no knowledge of the organization of tournaments.

If the decision is based on the application forms Profs have sent to PUI and their experience with Wizards, and as I believe there is a close link between the Prof program and beeing a TO, PUI is in the best place to decide who can be TO or not, at least amongst the former WotC TO who have applied to PUI POP.

If a shop owner is not customer of the distributor in charge of OP in the country, will he have POP support like customers of the distributor will have ?
If an experienced TO is not approved by the distributor, will he be able to run tournaments anyway ?

And if a shop owner is an experienced WotC TO but is not customer of the distributor who will not approve him as TO, does that mean that there is a risk that the shop owner has no POP support and will not be authorized to run tournaments ?

IMO, that would be too much power put in the hands of the distributor who could decide either in economical terms (customer or not) and/or in personal terms (like the person or not).

We may not forget that, in the case of a shop, we're not only talking about the love of the game but also about the same thing as NOA and the distributors ... money.

I already hear you saying 'that will not happen !', but if it does, which will be the shop owner reaction ?


Of course it's not my business, but I hope PUI has clearly put in their contracts with distributors that POP has to be open to every shop/organization that fulfil the conditions, customer or not, and that the non-approval of a TO must be clearly justified.

 

[ukpokemonpro]

I can only quote what we have been told why else have no of us who applied for Premier TO status been ratified? It was confirmed by both PUI and the Distributors they get to sanction our applications so like I said earlier be nice to your distributors if you want to be a TO or run a league...

 

[Professor Dav]

LOL so we have the UK's first Master Professor and long term TO and Premier Event Judge having to re-apply because the system mucked up?

Well, plenty of other international professors managed to get into the system and enter thier info. Those that didn't were very quick to use one of the many email addresses supplied to contact me and ask about thier status and how they should proceed. In several cases, I hand entered data for professors who had trouble with the form.

This person you speak of didn't contact me via email, nor did they apply online. So are you saying I should make an exception for them, even though they made no effort to contact me during the 60 day window for grandfathering?

As for running tournaments, being a professor is not a requirement to become a TO, so that's a moot point. Professor or not, the person in question can still be approved to run events.


Prof. Dav

 

[Professor Dav]

I can only quote what we have been told why else have no of us who applied for Premier TO status been ratified? It was confirmed by both PUI and the Distributors they get to sanction our applications so like I said earlier be nice to your distributors if you want to be a TO or run a league...

You should probably be nice to be a nice person, not just to get tournaments.

Generally, as the saying goes, more flies with honey than with vinegar Ben.

Prof. Dav

 

[Professor Dav]

Ukpokemonpro, are you sure it will be the distributors ?
I wonder on which basis they could do it as most of them have no knowledge of the organization of tournaments.

If the decision is based on the application forms Profs have sent to PUI and their experience with Wizards, and as I believe there is a close link between the Prof program and beeing a TO, PUI is in the best place to decide who can be TO or not, at least amongst the former WotC TO who have applied to PUI POP.

Please note, that while in many cases distributors who are running our OP internationally will be approving TO and League applications, in the case of the UK, a third party will be handling this for the distributors there.

Carl Crook's "A Place For Games" will be handling all of this in the UK for the distributors there. Carl's experience with OP is top drawer, and he'll treat every applicant fairly, I'm sure.

To my knowledge, Carl has already received the league materials we sent, and if you need kits, or want to apply to become a TO, you should contact him.

Prof. Dav

 

[NoPoke]

Prof Dave,

THIS Person DID apply for the grandfatering programme and is listed as a professor on your website.

THIS person has emailed you and got no reply.

THIS person has never received a POP ID.

THIS Person is not an isolated case.

Check out an old thread.....http://www.pokegym.net/showthread.php?t=1593

 

[ukpokemonpro]

Carl Crook's "A Place For Games" will be handling all of this in the UK for the distributors there. Carl's experience with OP is top drawer, and he'll treat every applicant fairly, I'm sure.

Dave,

at what point did I say that we were not happy with the situation in the UK as it is NOW? We are having meetings and discussions with Carl and The Place for Games on a regular basis. We are meeting with Carl and the Distributors next week and we are giving up our Saturday all day to do so! Our relationship here in the UK with both Carl, The Place for Games and the distributors is one based on dialogue, understanding and building trust.

If you would care to read some more of my comments you will find that I am not fighting for just the UK. Indeed it would be easy to sit back and just say well we got dialogue, we got a pre-release; just a shame that with 3 days to go we have no product, no rules, no software to run it with and no guidance but hey that's cool because we have a pre-release right? and the UK is AOK so sod the rest of them.

But that would not be true, we as yet have no league kits, the pre-release looks like it may go wrong .. we will do our best to ensure it doesn't but that is us doing it for free ...

Yes Dave we don't get paid for doing it, we don't get paid to gloss over the cracks, heck at the moment we get no recognition, no respect and certainly no thanks from PUI for doing all we do.

We are taking a whole world view on this thread and the perception is; as we keep on telling you, that you don't care.

If you want us on side then start answering the questions and dealing with the issues. You can only sell the empty treasure chest so many times and then we all catch on that the next time we look to have found the treasure the reality is it's an empty box!

So Ian has emailed, he set up a thread he asked about his lack of POP id and yet you rant on that he didn't? Spin and bluster to hide the facts? You rant that we should talk with the place for games and the distributors but we already are doing that.

So your FACT that the place for games has League Kits is only correct as of Yesterday when the box arrived in their office, they still have to sort the kits out!

Also please note it is The Place for Games not A Place for Games, semantics I know but companies you're dealing with would probably like you to get their name correct?

Check out the website at http://www.theplaceforgames.com/

Helpfully their company name is there in the URL

So the UK is looking up, we talk, we have respect and building trust between ourselves, The Place for Games and the Distributors ... now what is missing from that list in the relationship we have with PUI? .....

 

[Michel]

Great to see that things are moving in the right direction in the UK

Dave, I was not talking about UK, but about the whole continent.

And even if you're a very nice person in the eyes of everybody, one person may find that you're not nice

So if a distributor has a 'bad opinion' about someone, that person could see the POP he loves going away, or a part of his business if he's a shop owner not customer to, or not liked by, the distrubutor ?

I'm sure that kind of things will not happen, ... but you'll agree with me that it's surprizing that people who have a very little (or no) knowledge and experience of POP have in their hands decisions about the future of people who know POP and have been involved in it for a very long time as TO, LC or shop running a league.

And for a shop, POP means incomes during league sessions, incomes during tournaments, visibility of the name of the shop, new customers, ... it's not only the love of the game, it's business too.

 

[ranmasaotomes]

I agree with ukpokemonpro on this one but it isn't completely about things such as not getting the leagues and the like.

It is about getting recognised. This forum was started because it shows that there is a commitment by us to the pokemon league itself. At the moment and also for the past few months we have used what little support that we did recieve from the older system. (Namely Wizards) and to some extent that has kept us going. I also agree that it has been hard for us international gym leaders as we have not had the support for the new sets until recently.

I am going to now be completely frank.

At the moment I have 7 Different sets of pokemon cards for sale at the shop I work in. The only ones that are moving rapidly are the newer ones because people hope that we will be getting the Pokemon USA league soon. Besides this the cards have not been officially released in our areas and yet we have not just the Ru/Sa cards but we also have the Sandstorm and also have Dragon Coming....
We have a similar situation with other Cards.... Yu-Gi-Oh for example. (I know this goes slightly off topic here, please bare with me) With Yu-Gi-Oh we have 1, yes 1 set that is officially released here in Australia. there are currently 8 sets that we sell!
My Point.... In order to keep the players coming we have to get things in that arn't officially released. We try to get assistance with such things and we are constantly asked to wait. At the moment, we are waiting patiently but I am concerned that if we continue to have delays, that this game will just not be able to fully recover. We had a pokemon tournament on the sunday just gone. (9th November) and becuase of the promotional cards that people already have and that everyone already has the started boxes and anything else we offered. Guess how many people we had.....
1
Yes a tournament of 1
All that I am saying is that we need the international support. Please help us as to know what to do, like earlier in the thread. If we even got some promotional cards during the transition. They would have been greatly appreciated. Instead. we are already 9 promo cards behind. (+ the rest we never got from wizards)

This is not to critisize anyone at Pokemon USA. but to let you and other card companies know that there are more places than just the US that play these games.

 

[Professor Dav]

Great to see that things are moving in the right direction in the UK

Dave, I was not talking about UK, but about the whole continent.

And even if you're a very nice person in the eyes of everybody, one person may find that you're not nice

So if a distributor has a 'bad opinion' about someone, that person could see the POP he loves going away, or a part of his business if he's a shop owner not customer to, or not liked by, the distrubutor ?

I'm sure that kind of things will not happen, ... but you'll agree with me that it's surprizing that people who have a very little (or no) knowledge and experience of POP have in their hands decisions about the future of people who know POP and have been involved in it for a very long time as TO, LC or shop running a league.

And for a shop, POP means incomes during league sessions, incomes during tournaments, visibility of the name of the shop, new customers, ... it's not only the love of the game, it's business too.

I absoluetly see the point, and we had a long discussion here about those types of issues. Our expectations are that our international partners will base their decisions upon qualifications, and not favoritism.

To be fair, the same issues could easily be applied to the US offices. Who's to say that we couldn't decide not to approve someone because we simply didn't like them, or because they rubbed us the wrong way here on the forum?

The answer is that we, like our partners, must put our personal opinions aside, and give everyone the benefit of the doubt. Whether or not I like you as a person has no bearing on how skilled you may be as a tournament coordinator, and I need to let you succeed or fail based upon your own actions, not my impressions.

As I said, I do understand the concerns, but those same concerns could easily be applied to any of our markets, and would still be valid. In the event that someone feels they have been singled out, and disapproved for 'no good cause' they are certainly welcome to contact us, and we will investigate the matter.

Realize also, that in most cases, our partners are better qualified to approve and manage our international TOs, as they've actually met many of you, and worked with you in the past. They are also closer geographically to the events being run, and the people running them. If this were administered from the US, we'd have someone flying to a different country every day to check up on reports of various sorts, that would be much more easily handled locally.

Also, my apologies, as I had forgotten that you were Belgian, and not from the UK when I posted my prior response referring you to Carl Crook.

Prof. Dav

 

[Professor Dav]

Prof Dave,

THIS Person DID apply for the grandfatering programme and is listed as a professor on your website.

THIS person has emailed you and got no reply.

THIS person has never received a POP ID.

THIS Person is not an isolated case.

Check out an old thread.....http://www.pokegym.net/showthread.php?t=1593

THIS person did NOT enter a valid email address when they applied and therefore didn't get their ID automatically when they were approved.

I have NO record of THIS person emailing me for this information until TODAY.

See item #1 for WHY THIS person didn't receive an ID.

THIS person is the only one I see here complaining about this. Others have contacted me directly, or are at the least not here complaining that I haven't dug their request off of an old post on this forum.

The old thread specifies in a number of cases that THIS board is NOT the official point of contact. While I appreciate that someone tried to collect all of these people who needed IDs, the list was NEVER sent to me. Had it been, EVERY ONE of these people would've been personally emailed thier IDs and Passwords immediately.

SD Pokemom said in that thread:

As I said above: please do NOT depend upon POP happening upon this thread and fixing this for you; EMAIL them to make sure they learn that you need to have this taken care of.

Remember that the PokéGym is NOT the 'official' board of the TCG anymore, as it was under WotC; if the POP people stop by here it's on their own time. Please take the initiative and email YOURSELF instead of waiting for POP to see this.

YOU said:

It does seem that PUI prefer lots of individual emails rather than having the collation work done for them

Yet, you never sent me your request (at least, not to [email protected]). Yes, I'd much prefer to have 10 individual emails than have to hunt around on this board, cut and paste each email address as I find them, and then provide the requested information. Also note, that all of the people who submitted their requests to that thread did NOT enter their email addresses. So, I would've also had to go into the Professor lists, find their names, and get their email addresses from there, cut them, and paste them in to send the email.

That sounds easier to you?

Hitting 'reply' to twenty individual emails is much easier, thank you.

Prof. Dav

 

[Professor Dav]

Dave,

at what point did I say that we were not happy with the situation in the UK as it is NOW? We are having meetings and discussions with Carl and The Place for Games on a regular basis. We are meeting with Carl and the Distributors next week and we are giving up our Saturday all day to do so! Our relationship here in the UK with both Carl, The Place for Games and the distributors is one based on dialogue, understanding and building trust.

If you would care to read some more of my comments you will find that I am not fighting for just the UK. Indeed it would be easy to sit back and just say well we got dialogue, we got a pre-release; just a shame that with 3 days to go we have no product, no rules, no software to run it with and no guidance but hey that's cool because we have a pre-release right? and the UK is AOK so sod the rest of them.

But that would not be true, we as yet have no league kits, the pre-release looks like it may go wrong .. we will do our best to ensure it doesn't but that is us doing it for free ...

Yes Dave we don't get paid for doing it, we don't get paid to gloss over the cracks, heck at the moment we get no recognition, no respect and certainly no thanks from PUI for doing all we do.

We are taking a whole world view on this thread and the perception is; as we keep on telling you, that you don't care.

If you want us on side then start answering the questions and dealing with the issues. You can only sell the empty treasure chest so many times and then we all catch on that the next time we look to have found the treasure the reality is it's an empty box!

So Ian has emailed, he set up a thread he asked about his lack of POP id and yet you rant on that he didn't? Spin and bluster to hide the facts? You rant that we should talk with the place for games and the distributors but we already are doing that.

So your FACT that the place for games has League Kits is only correct as of Yesterday when the box arrived in their office, they still have to sort the kits out!

Also please note it is The Place for Games not A Place for Games, semantics I know but companies you're dealing with would probably like you to get their name correct?

Check out the website at http://www.theplaceforgames.com/

Helpfully their company name is there in the URL

So the UK is looking up, we talk, we have respect and building trust between ourselves, The Place for Games and the Distributors ... now what is missing from that list in the relationship we have with PUI? .....

Everyone, thank Ben for making sure that I don't post a single other response to this thread or any other on this board.

Prof. Dav will now use this forum exclusively for making broad statements and announcements regarding the programs he runs, and no more. I will no longer respond to ANY questions or comments on this board. If you want to ask a question, and receive an answer, you may email me at [email protected] for professor related questions, or [email protected] for league related questions.

I've said an uncountable number of times in the past that this forum is NOT the official means of contacting us, so therefore you expect that I WILL find a thread requesting IDs and passwords? That I'm even looking for it? That all of the necessary information will be contained there?

I don't get paid to come here and be called a liar, a spin doctor or any of the other names and implicatons that you and others here have used and continue to use now. I get paid to develop our league programs, professor program, and if you don't think I'm doing a good enough job of this, I recommend you contact my employer and complain. Again, my full name is Dave Schwimmer, so you can let them know just who the person you think has been lying to you is.

You demand respect from us, yet, we've never worked with you. You earn respect Ben, it isn't freely given or you'd have given us the same respect you feel you're due since you've NEVER worked with us either.

If you are Ian, you can tell me you emailed me, but since your name is Ben, I'll just assume that you are telling me what he told you. I've just finished telling him that I've never received an email from him until TODAY. But, I'm sure you'll just tell me I'm lying about that too, so, why bother?

Goodbye.

Prof. Dav

 

[Sensei]

Everyone, thank Ben for making sure that I don't post a single other response to this thread or any other on this board.

Dave,I would like to say two things.First off,I hope you said this "in the heat of the moment" and didn`t really mean that.I think it is beneficial to the game and it`s community for you(and Jimmer and crew) to come on the boards and personally get involved with the members.To sacrifice that due to one or two people,would have a negative impact on the community IMO.

Second of all,on behalf of the mods and admins here,I would like to apologize for letting this continue.We have always told people to take any problems and complaints off the boards and send them e-mail/pm and we failed to do this in the spirit of letting the overseas members discuss their problems.Unfortunately,a few took it too far and personally defamed you and Jarrod and for that I apologize again.Please don`t let this harm your interaction on the Pokegym

As for the people mentioned,you guys seriously owe some apologies to Dave,Jarred,and "those people" that own these boards...I can understand fighting for what you believe in and for the love of the best TCG on earth,but the defamation of character that was done on these boards by the select few who did this,is just shameful and wrong and can no longer be tolerated.

While we won`t personally ban anyone on the boards over this,we will keep it in mind and the aforementioned people will have a strike against them unless they can publically and personally apologize for their actions.

I am going to lock this.You can make another thread so long as it is kept peaceful and that every person on there RESPECTS everyone else INCLUDING the MT`s.

`Sensei