Pokemon Catcher - Why so much?

[Gamester2488]

so have they started printing more catchers then? if not, looks like supply and demand to me.

N has 3 various printings (one of which is full art), and 2 printings, alt art and full art, are still readily available. The fact that there are players who wish to "bling" out their decks causes the price of full art to go up, while others who merely want/need the card in general can get other versions cheaper.

Catcher has only 2 printings - one is the 15 dollar one, isn't in print (or heavily in print) and the other is the "ultra" rare gold catcher - which is harder to pull due to rarity and is even more than original.

your last comment supports the basic definition of "supply and demand" - ppl are wanting the card and are willing to dish out the money to get it.

there are very few decks that can go without catcher and still do well - yes, the game will be more difficult, but it's still do-able.

Has the supply of Catchers changed to make them 15 dollars?

Supply and Demand denotes that the supply, or LACK of supply determines the value of a product. If you have 100 widgets at 100 dollars and then decrease the price you haven't actually increased the supply of widgets, merely, you've made the current supply more desirable. You may have increased the demand, but if you increase the demand because the price has gone DOWN does that actually denote supply and demand? You haven't increased the physical supply, and while you've generated more demand, more demand with less supply is supposed to INCREASE the cost of the product no? Obviously I've only taken very basic Economics, as it was 8 years ago in High School and I got a 5 on my AP test so I haven't taken it since then.

Essentially, I guess I was trying to make a point that when the difference in consumers doesn't increase base on value, as 15 dollars a card and 50 dollars a card isn't going to change the amount of players playing competitively. Not significantly anyway. Monopoly would be a better word for it... The secondary market is monopolized by the NEED for players to play competitively. If there wasn't a NEED for players to have Pokemon Catcher, i.e, a deck that didn't run any, then they wouldn't be 15 dollars. They would be maybe 8-10 as people would have an alternate to the card.

With Cards like N, Bianca, and Juniper, while it is better to run 4, there is an alternate to all of them. The "lack" of them wont actually hurt you in the long run, as long as you just build your deck a little differently. The lack of Catchers, will significantly hurt your chances of winning the game. At least, if Catcher is anything remotely as important as Gust of Wind was.

Regardless, I'm not sure why it's such an issue that I feel like I'm being attacked for a stance... I don't believe Supply and Demand fits the secondary market for TCG's, because the consumer doesn't have a choice but to play these cards if they want to compete. You could say the same thing about my Pen example. You could just homeschool them and let them use pencils. At what point though, does somebody decide that no longer playing competitively is worth the loss of investment that they've made? In my experience from other games, the price of cards has never been the reason why people stopped playing. Even when a single card became 100 a piece in magic, people kept playing. In fact, 80% of the format ran 4 of that card. It was the most populated tournament scene ever.

So, at any point in time, the venders could drop Catchers to 8 a piece. If people believed they would stay at 8 a piece, they would still have stock, they would still sell them at the same rate and nothing would change. So, I don't believe Supply and Demand is accurate. The demand wont change if they halved in price.

---------- Post added 12/10/2012 at 09:23 PM ----------

The difference is between spending $40 on a playset and spending $60 on a playset.

Just because you don't see any notable difference does not mean that no difference exists.

Whats the difference between 40 and 60 on a playset? No more players will shell out 40 for Catchers that wouldn't for 60, and at 60 the same players will still be shelling out 60 for a card. Regardless of whether the catchers were 8, 10, 15, 40 a piece, I would still buy them if I planned on playing in a large tournament and expecting to do well.

As for top cutting without catchers, minority does not make the rules. Generally speaking, 4 catchers = best opportunity to top cut in 90% of the metagame.

 

[Kayle]

Whats the difference between 40 and 60 on a playset? No more players will shell out 40 for Catchers that wouldn't for 60, and at 60 the same players will still be shelling out 60 for a card. Regardless of whether the catchers were 8, 10, 15, 40 a piece, I would still buy them if I planned on playing in a large tournament and expecting to do well.

You are not everybody, nor are you every potentially competitive player.

I'm not even really sure what this contributes to the topic, but it just bothers me that you make such an absolute statement that NO ONE will shell out 40 for catchers that wouldn't for 60. I wouldn't, for one. I only play because I already had some from whne they were cheaperish.

 

[Gamester2488]

You are not everybody, nor are you every potentially competitive player.

I'm not even really sure what this contributes to the topic, but it just bothers me that you make such an absolute statement that NO ONE will shell out 40 for catchers that wouldn't for 60. I wouldn't, for one. I only play because I already had some from whne they were cheaperish.

Sure. I'm done with this topic. The fact that it bothers you is why you probably take discussions far too seriously to begin with. Read a book, go see a movie... if an internet discussion bothers you, then you shouldn't be on the internet. Opinions vary from person to person, and I've done nothing but the discussion is about supply and demand being created by decreasing the price to create a higher demand.

I understand I am one person and not everybody. The point was, if player X wanted to go to a tournament, we'll say regions, would player X truly believe they could win said tournament with a budget deck? If the answer is yes, then Catcher should not be 15 dollars. If the answer is no then my point is valid. Any player expecting to do well at a major tournament will be willing to shell out 40-60 dollars for a set of Catchers, otherwise catcher would NOT be 15 dollars.

 

[Tim17]

let me break this down to a more simplistic version:

supply and demand - basically this concept is how much one can sell a product that is in high demand and get the most profit out of it.

basically the supply is what ever is available. demand affects the price on which consumers will pay for the supply available.

looking at your pen scenario - if everyone decided to homeschool, then Bic would have to lower prices in order to sell. they'd have too much supply and not enough demand. Also, say a competitor makes the same pen required, but a lower price and has the same supply volume as Bic does - then bic would yet again have to lower the value of their product due to too high of supply versus the lower demand for their product.

In this case, in a TCG - it's secondary market, filled with variable merchants (online, local stores, vendors, etc) that can affect price.

for example, the price from a vendor at an actual event is going to be higher because of limited supply at that location.

basic economic understanding from a consumer and retail worker's view.

we're not attacking you, we're merely trying to help you understand how this card is at 15 dollars - the supply is limited while the demand is higher.

it's like the cost of a home going up because another party is willing to spend more, and if more consumers are willing to pay that price than other parties willing to pay less, why lower it?

 

[sebastianlugo]

1 per box... Need a better explanation?

 

[Gamester2488]

let me break this down to a more simplistic version:

supply and demand - basically this concept is how much one can sell a product that is in high demand and get the most profit out of it.

basically the supply is what ever is available. demand affects the price on which consumers will pay for the supply available.

looking at your pen scenario - if everyone decided to homeschool, then Bic would have to lower prices in order to sell. they'd have too much supply and not enough demand. Also, say a competitor makes the same pen required, but a lower price and has the same supply volume as Bic does - then bic would yet again have to lower the value of their product due to too high of supply versus the lower demand for their product.

In this case, in a TCG - it's secondary market, filled with variable merchants (online, local stores, vendors, etc) that can affect price.

for example, the price from a vendor at an actual event is going to be higher because of limited supply at that location.

basic economic understanding from a consumer and retail worker's view.

we're not attacking you, we're merely trying to help you understand how this card is at 15 dollars - the supply is limited while the demand is higher.

it's like the cost of a home going up because another party is willing to spend more, and if more consumers are willing to pay that price than other parties willing to pay less, why lower it?

Not all of you are attacking, but a few... Something I do understand is basic English connotations. Some of the tones people are using are negative in connotation. Those are the people I'm arguing.

If I was an Economic Major, something I definitely admitted to NOT being, then I would be making a legitimate argument against Supply and Demand. Instead, I think, and truly believe, that my posts were merely explanations of my understanding of Supply and Demand.

 

[Tim17]

Not all of you are attacking, but a few... Something I do understand is basic English connotations. Some of the tones people are using are negative in connotation. Those are the people I'm arguing.

If I was an Economic Major, something I definitely admitted to NOT being, then I would be making a legitimate argument against Supply and Demand. Instead, I think, and truly believe, that my posts were merely explanations of my understanding of Supply and Demand.

first off, sorry if I was one who was attacking, I was merely trying to point out how most see it as supply and demand, and took it that you weren't able to see it that way (I was wrong apparently you were trying to explain your view and nothing more).

 

[Gamester2488]

first off, sorry if I was one who was attacking, I was merely trying to point out how most see it as supply and demand, and took it that you weren't able to see it that way (I was wrong apparently you were trying to explain your view and nothing more).

Nah, it wasn't you. Don't worry, it's an irrelevant discussion regardless.

---------- Post added 12/11/2012 at 01:32 AM ----------

Edit: Because what I posted was inappropriate.

 

[Kunx990]

Sure. I'm done with this topic. The fact that it bothers you is why you probably take discussions far too seriously to begin with. Read a book, go see a movie... if an internet discussion bothers you, then you shouldn't be on the internet. Opinions vary from person to person, and I've done nothing but the discussion is about supply and demand being created by decreasing the price to create a higher demand.

I understand I am one person and not everybody. The point was, if player X wanted to go to a tournament, we'll say regions, would player X truly believe they could win said tournament with a budget deck? If the answer is yes, then Catcher should not be 15 dollars. If the answer is no then my point is valid. Any player expecting to do well at a major tournament will be willing to shell out 40-60 dollars for a set of Catchers, otherwise catcher would NOT be 15 dollars.

If you want a budget catcher, then run Ninetales.

Just because poor people exist, that will not change the price of curtain items, also if $15 of a single STAPLE card is too much then I do not believe this hobby is for you and you should avoid card games and cames with micro transactions.

 

[Gamester2488]

If you want a budget catcher, then run Ninetales.

Just because poor people exist, that will not change the price of curtain items, also if $15 of a single STAPLE card is too much then I do not believe this hobby is for you and you should avoid card games and cames with micro transactions.

I think I've stated multiple times I would buy whatever staples I needed. Trust me, this game is far cheaper than the past two TCG's I've played, merely an inquiry as to why an uncommon would be so ludicrously high and cost more than any of the rares or ultra rares in my deck.

 

[chuzzoe]

The value of the catcher is that to be competitive you have to have three or four in your deck (in my opinion). They are hard to trade for and that drives the price up at places like T&T and that drives up the price that individuals want for them. All playable cards are higher priced regardless of their commonality, they are the most sought after cards by the players.

chuzzoe

 

[ddbargardi]

I still agree with gamester2488

 

[Lugia EX]

There are many many games in tournaments that come down to "I have to draw into a Catcher
off this Juniper/Bianca/Cheren, or I lose." Playing anything less than 4 Catchers puts you at an
incredible disadvantage in that situation. One very important thing not mentioned on this thread
though is once you pay the $60 for your playset, you can use that in any deck you build for the
nest year or more. The bottom line is, if you are serious about being competitive, you will either
pay the $60 for 4 Catchers, hope to get lucky on EPO packs, or accept the fact that you will be at
a massive disadvantage in every game. On that note, a friend of mine played a
Flygon/Dusknoir/Accelgor deck that did not run any Catcher.

 

[pnoodle5]

I also know personally that one o the best parts of the pokemon game is teamwork and meeting others. I have a little brother who loves Pokemon and just started Seniors, and he never did pull any catchers but I managed to pull 3 at a prerelase and 2 later on. I was lucky, of course, but my brother wanted to borrow one so i let him use it. If there's somenoe you can trust who has a catcher to spare, asking nicely to borrow it is always okay.

More on the given topic, the price of staple cards really depends on A. How many are made B. How many are used and C How much people think they are worth. I'm no business major but I think I have a decent grasp of the concept. If I see that my friend Jim just sold a Catcher for 12 dollars and i know that they are popular, i might sell mine to the next guy for 15 to make even more sweet Pokeprofit.

 

[Hunter2hitman]

It is at its value because people buy it at that. If nobody bought them for more than $15, then the price may drop a bit. but the fact is, people NEED it in their deck, so they buy them as cheap as possible, so they go on ebay and buy them as low as they can, but then there are only ones say, over $15. so then when someone goes online that NEEDS them, they pay the higher price to get them, and so it continues.
as for how easy it is to get, well its not worth while to go buy a box, becuase youre getting little other value, so the ones that bought the packs and pulled them feel they should get some value back when they do sell them, so really, they do have a fair market price.
BUT i do feel Pokemon has created this because they have not reprinted it other than a secret rare, which is much harder to get.


Anyways, SUPPLY and DEMAND. that is all.

 

[jon_meadowbrook]

Catcher was the hardest hurdle for me to jump...
I stopped playing in 99' and this is the same card as a SUPER common "Gust of Wind".

It was really hard to justify $40 on a trainer that isn't very exciting, but it has to be done