Wait a minute. So you're excited for there being exactly 15 cards that require multiple types of Energy? Like I said when they first started doing this with Colorless "Dragon-Type" Pokemon, the set had 19 such cards. That would be four more. So it is not unprecedented.
If you're excited not because of the reasons you state but simply for the 15 cards of a new type being introduced in a single set, that I can understand. While I want to criticize TPC for giving us so few Darkness-Type and Metal-Type Pokemon in their debut (Neo Genesis), there weren't a lot of Darkness or Metal-Type Pokemon in the source material (the video games). They chose to spread the few they had around, maknig it seem like they were almost mythic. I am too am glad they are being implemented fully as well.
You know that I said OVER 15, or MINIMUM of 15, and NOT exactly 15. We know that the MINIMUM amount of dragons is 15 in DRAGONS EXALTED. My point is, WE NEVER HAD A SET THAT HAS THIS MANY POKEMON with MULTIPLE ENERGY REQUIREMENTS for ATTACKS. Creating the Dragon type groups these kinds of pokemon into its own type.
I understand you don't like it, but there is a difference between opinions based on personal preference, opinions based on factual evidence, and facts. Adding another Pokemon/Energy Type would alter gameplay and at least technically add to it. There will be yet another Pokemon-Type, and if it had its own Energy-Type, that would alter gameplay, and it shifts Weakness/Resistance relationships.
Adding just the Pokemon-Type but then using combinations of pre-existing Energy adds to gameplay in a different manner, but both still add to gameplay. Adding a new Pokemon-Type that uses off-Type Energy requirments and following the same template that said Pokemon used (having attacks with off-Type requirements) when those Pokemon were merely Colorless-Type adds to the game... but so would adding a new-Type with a new Energy requirement.
Don't forget the rest of the card pool. Maybe your first example Evolves into a Stage 1 Pokemon with two okay attacks, but the second Evolves into a Stage 1 with a great Ability and great attack. They are no longer "equal", are they? Maybe there is a Trainer or a Pokemon that provides extra Support for Water Types, but no equivalent for Fire-Types, or vice versa. Claiming it boils down to just Weakness/Resistance oversimplifies. If the correct cards are popular (or simply non-existent), Weakness and Resistance may be completely irrelevant.
Making a dragon type with its own basic energy, and its own attacks that requires its own basic energy does not add to gameplay why? Just look at how you are building your deck, and the energies you are adding. It really doesn't matter what the card does, it is how you interact with it. You take a Fire pokemon, and to achieve its attack, you simply have to attach a fire energy to it, and normally you would put it in a deck full of fire energies. Same with Water, Psychic, Darkness etc.
You could basically paint a fire card blue, and replace the fire symbols with water symbols, and it would be a water pokemon. That's what I am trying to get at here. You can't paint a dragon pokemon red, and call it a fire pokemon, because the fire types now only have either :fire: or :colorless: printed on the card for attacks. The reasoning for the dragon type is that we won't see a Grass pokemon that has a :grass:
sychic: attack, and to give us a visual cue.
You also only need to paint the dragon pokemon purple and replace every dragon symbol into a psychic symbol to understand that it doesn't add to gameplay.
You realize a card with an attack may not truly add to game play? It may technically, but for example alternate art version of a card would have to "add to gameplay" by making the card more available, or being so good/bad that it affects people.
A card may also not truly add to gameplay because it is so poor, there is no real reason to use it. Sadly many promo cards are like this; pretty art (sometimes) but stats and effects weaker than that of mainstream release counterparts.
As for "more than 5 cards per set", where'd you get that from? We have about five Pokemon
lines per Type per set, but not just five cards. If TPC wished to keep Dragons Colorless, they merely could choose to let such cards fill all Colorless "slots", or tweak the numbers to add more room.
A :fire::water: attack adds to gameplay in such a way that to use that attack, you NEED to use a Fire and Water deck. you can't have a Fire and whatever deck. The second element MUST BE water. This is different compared to a :fire::colorless: or a :water::colorless: attack because you can add the fire pokemon in a fire and whatever deck, or the water pokemon in a water and whatever deck.
Are you seriously refuting my points by removing the energy symbol smilies? When I mean more than 5 cards per set, I meant more than 5 cards that uses MULTIPLE different energies per attack. The only other sets that have multiple energy attacks are the sets that have the Dark pokemon, like Dark Charizard, and the Delta Species, but even so, all of their attacks have either Darkness or Metal in them. The dragon type allows for many different combinations of energy type per attack, and isn't restricted to let's say, fire and metal, as it could be fire and grass, or fire and water, or fire and fighting.
Name me a set that has more than 5 cards with attacks that require 2 or more different energy types. I already gave you 2 examples, so you have to come up with a set that does not have those 2 above examples, such as Dark Charizard, or the delta species.
What the makers of this game is doing is grouping the pokemon that have attacks like :lightning::dark: or :fire:
sychic: into its own type.
Other than, ya know, being a new Energy Type. So what happens if we suddenly start seeing other Pokemon-Types implement multiple Energy-Type requirements more regularly? I personally wish they would, but by your logic that "diminishes the game" and becomes "more of the same". Plus on top of it all, it is still not new. It is the Type change that makes it "new"; I've already given proof that "Dragon" Pokemon having attacks with dual-Energy-Type requirements is debuted eight and a half years ago.
You just don't get it. We have a bunch of cards that have off energy attacks, like CELEBI PRIME, you know the one that has a little psychic symbol on it despite it being a GRASS type. They created the Dragon type in order for players like us to be able to tell that the card requires 2 different energies for attack. In the older sets, there were a lot of cards that have 2 different energy attacks, but the second energy usually was Darkness or Metal, and at that time, they weren't basic energies yet. They are creating the dragon type as a visual cue in order to distinguish it from any other colorless type, so you don't put a colorless pokemon that doesn't have any colorless attacks into your deck, and realize that the attack requires :fire::lightning:
Okay, this may be your chance to explain what I am missing, because I don't get the reference. Well, not exactly; I've seen this line of reasoning used before, but with a set-up I understood.
The existing 8, such as Darkness or Metal, or Fire makes it possible so that you can have a all Darkness deck with darkness pokemon, or a combination of Metal or Fire.
The reasoning on why Colorless is OR, is because you can put a colorless pokemon in any deck, as in you can put that pokemon in a Fire OR Water deck. Likewise, if you have a deck of solely colorless pokemon, you can have Fire OR Water OR Lightning OR whatever energy you want.
The reasoning on why Dragons is AND, is look at the energy requirements, and describe to me what energies you need without using the word AND. Exactly. When you want to play Giratina, you need a deck with Grass AND psychic energy. Each dragon works only on specific decks, much so that it requries this AND that energy.
We get that, really we do. The problem is then you just sort of say random stuff that if it is connected, could use some better writing to convey your points and as I demonstrated in both your posts I've quoted, seem to contain errors.
Why? What makes eight Basic Energy-Types the magic number? Do the handful of cards that reference basic Energy cards become severely broken by an additional Type? Since they gave it a distinct enough color (the gold could be mistaken for Lightning, but it isn't too bad), why couldn't there be another?
Just saying that doesn't make it true. Decks already have to use specific cards to accomodate more than two Pokemon/Energy-Types per deck (not counting Colorless). More Types would not change this; it would just take more skill to balance a deck, and if you choose the proper Types could allievate extreme Type-matching disadvantages more readily.
To accomodate 16 different types, let's say, you would have to make a 20 or 25 card booster pack, so each type can be represened in each pack. If you open the standard 10 card pack, and there are 16 types, the pokemon you want to get, let's say Psychic, may not even be in that pack. Making it 16 types makes it even less of a chance.
Also 8 isn't the magic number. 8 is already way too many different energy types, and adding just one more is making it even worse.
Or they just print fewer Pokemon of a Type, or accept that not every Type ends up evenly represented in a single set. That would be the status quo, at least outside of Japan.
So in any given set, you prefer to have so little of a certain type, that nobody could even build a deck based off that type, so the only viable solution is to build a deck featuring 3 or more types, or buy tons of packs just so they could get a decent collection of a certain type, or buy singles in which case TPCi won't get any money? I don't think so.
Then why are so many Types so similar in their implementation? There are many games where this is true; certain mechanics are reserved for certain types, but with Pokemon it is more certain mechanics are preferred by certain types... and usually are available to multiple Types.
Ok fine, each types isn't different but is preferred, but either way, it gives each type its own identity. When you describe a the type of pokemon that heals themselves when they attack, you would most defeinitely say Grass, because it is its identity, although Water or Psychic may heal themselves too, but Grass is known for that gameplay element. If there are different types that are similar in gameplay elements, then I think, personally, that they should change that. Adding a new type with its own basic energy, so that every single type has no distinct identity isn't adding to gameplay, but over saturate the cardpool, and making it hard for anyone to build a deck. It's like picking up a red marble inside a pool of 100 marbles, in which there are 20 different colored marbles, which means that 5 of them are red, compared to a pool of 100 marbles where there are 10 different colors, so that 10 of them are red, thus making it easier to get that red marble. I'm basically saying, if you over saturate the game with so many types, it makes it even harder to pull a card of a certain type from a booster pack, and especially you can't use water energy on a fire pokemon, despite, as you say, all types having the same gameplay style. If each type has its own distinct gameplay element, well not entirely distinct, then each type has its own identity in such a way that players would say, hey, I am playing water because I like the fact that I can directly hit pokemon on their bench. Psychic pokmeon also have this gameplay element, but it isn't their main element.
So do Colorless, Darkness, Fighting, Fire, Lightning, Metal, Psychic and Water-Type Pokemon. I went to Pokepedia.net, and I found examples under the "Heals self" effect for each Type, most having at least one currently modified example. There are six other effects Pokepedia.net classifies as "healing", and at least one other "heals your other Pokemon" definitely applies here.
You still haven't given me 16 distinct gameplay elements that give each type its own identity. If you give the high HP identity to metal and rock, then one of them isn't adding to gameplay, which means they are basically the same thing.
So you tell me they have all these specialties, then admit they aren't all that "special".
yes there are preferences, but as time goes on they seem to be broadening the scope of each Type more and more. To a degree this makes sense, but since many of these mechanics have only had a few success stories, I'd rather they got it right for the "preferred" Type first, and once it was regular (and useful) then start seeing about having the mechanics show up off-type.
I never said that they aren't all that special. I said that the makers of this game have claimed that each type are specialized, as in what the rulebook says, but so far, what we are seeing now is that each type isn't that special. I, personally, would rather have each type specialized, so when you are playing a water deck or a fire deck, it won't seem like you are playing the same deck. Each type should be specialized, and for each new type added, there needs to be a brand new gameplay element that gives that new type its own identity. If it doesn't have its own identity, then that new type shouldn't exist.
Okay, you linked to the rule book... why? I've read it, but if you want me to find a specific point, can you at least tell me the page it is on?
Look at the page with all the energy types. It describes what each pokemon type is supposed to do. Ok, then give me specific strengths of the other 8 elemental types (Bug, Ice, Rock, Dragon, Flying, Ground, Ghost, Poison), much like how metal types have high HP?
If you seriously think that adding a dragon type with its own basic energy and its own attack that does the same thing as any other type, that is plainly attack, or have special abilities that are not unique to it, and call that a brand new gameplay element, then I don't know what your definition of new gameplay element is. For each basic energy, there has to be its own identity, such as Grass being healing, mostly, Metal having high HP, Darkness discarding opponent's cards, or Psychic giving a wide variety of special conditions. Even if the current setup is that each type has its preferred gameplay element. I would rather have the makers of the game make each one distinct to force players to make multi energy decks. Want a deck that recycles energies from the discard pile? Well too bad, you have to play a lightning deck. Ok fine, I don't really want it so that all pokemon who recycles energies are lightning type, but make it so that the majority are lightning type. Right now, each type does NOT have its unique identity, but I wish it did. Adding a dragon type with its own basic energy is like adding the 9th of the same thing.
It's like playing rock paper scissors. Each one is exactly the same, that one has a weakness to something while at the same time having a strength to something else. There aren't any unique identities.
