How big will infernape 4/Luxray GL be?

[FunnyBear]

Since both Infernape 4 and Luxray GL can switch the opponent out with ease, a 1-1 Mewtwo tech is unlikely to stop them. Dialga G would probably be more for Flygon, Nidoqueen, and the occassional Grass deck.

If someone gets a Mewtwo X out and doesn't see a counter, he's gonna stop benching stuff pretty quickly, LOL.

Ninetales. Now I didn't think of that one. He apparantly also used Rayquaza and Stark to get the Fire Spin energies back from discard. There are layers and layers to the cleverness of this build. The more I hear about it, the more I'm impressed.

 

[DarthPika]

Not to take anything away from the deck or it's creator as I have a lot of respect for him, but I really would like to point out that both Ray and Ninetails were both known techs.

 

[elekid_957]

i didn't think it would be too big, then had to face three of them. in answer to the original question, it's only gonna get bigger after it won nationals.

 

[prodigal_fanboy]

Not to take anything away from the deck or it's creator as I have a lot of respect for him, but I really would like to point out that both Ray and Ninetails were both known techs.

Not to take anything away from that post or it's poster but it's damn hard to fit them both into a consistent build without sacrificing something crucial.

 

[Chompy]

you would have to be a really good player to be able to use those 2 pokemon as techs during a battle. Problem with so many techs is you wind up getting a bad start if its not the right pokemon.

 

[Banette EX]

Not to take anything away from that post or it's poster but it's damn hard to fit them both into a consistent build without sacrificing something crucial.

No it isnt if you know how to build consistent decks in the first place.

How are people suprised by Ray LA in the deck or Ninetails?? If people actually looked at all the avaliable card, its so many techs for the deck anyway. Its not like anyone there were the first to use the decks, he just outplayed each of his opponents.

 

[ryanvergel]

Not to take anything away from the deck or it's creator as I have a lot of respect for him, but I really would like to point out that both Ray and Ninetails were both known techs.

Yet I didn't hear of a SINGLE other LuxApe built being played that used both. Almost none used tails OR ray, let alone both.

Pooka had the stones to play these supposedly known techs, and both of them, and that is why he won.

I guarantee 90% of players did not know of using stark+ray or ninetales in luxape, and 99.9% didn't have the stones to actually run it.

Pooka did. Pooka won nats. GO KYLE

 

[Banette EX]

Yet I didn't hear of a SINGLE other LuxApe built being played that used both. Almost none used tails OR ray, let alone both.

Pooka had the stones to play these supposedly known techs, and both of them, and that is why he won.

I guarantee 90% of players did not know of using stark+ray or ninetales in luxape, and 99.9% didn't have the stones to actually run it.

Pooka did. Pooka won nats. GO KYLE

I posted my list in BRs with Ray/Stark. You dont even know if they did, your just assuming because you didnt play them, they probably did but didnt have the same luck.

So don't say he has the "stones" to do it because other people probably did the same. My goodness your too arrogant for your own good.

 

[ryanvergel]

I posted my list in BRs with Ray/Stark. You dont even know if they did, your just assuming because you didnt play them, they probably did but didnt have the same luck.

So don't say he has the "stones" to do it because other people probably did the same. My goodness your too arrogant for your own good.

I'm arrogant for applauding someone else's tech choices and confidence to run them? Weird. That doesn't even make sense.

I walked around a lot, and saw/heard many matchups. I hadn't heard a single person say the WORDS stark mountain, rayquaza, or ninetales in the same sentence as LuxApe. You weren't even AT nationals though, so why bother with someone with absolutely no idea of what happened? You're 100% ignorant of this, so what position are you arguing? You're saying I can't make predictions of what was played, despite being there, despite top cutting, and despite investing time and energy into finding out what were in certain lists?

I think it's a very safe statement to make that 90% of people did not know of putting those cards into the deck, and virtually no one actually used the cards. Definitely no one who actually made the top cut.

 

[ryanvergel]

I never go to where you are anymore? As in, I chose to go to FL regionals over GA regionals?

I went to your states and your cities this season. The only event I didn't go to was Regionals, because there is a regionals in Florida which is closer. I won a city in GA and got second at YOUR state (conceded to my roommate who ran an identical, 60 card for 60 card list). In fact, I have never NOT made the top cut in Georgia. I've been there 5 times, and have cut 5 for 5 times- 3 CCs and 2 States. Call me mediocre all day, it won't make you any better.

I never said he was the first one to put them in the deck. It doesn't matter who does what first. It matters who shows up at the tournament and does well with what. I made an accurate estimation of the number of ninetales/stark+ray techs at nationals. I can't know for certain whether my estimation is correct, but I can argue that we can't know anything for certain. Everything is an estimation. I don't understand why you're calling me arrogant for simply noting what I saw and the information I gathered. I didn't even run luxray/infernape, so it doesn't affect me at all.

Every number used on this forum is an estimation. We estimate the number of decks we saw, estimate matchup odds, because there is no way to have 100% information about those sorts of things. I don't think it's arrogant to estimate the field percentages. If you do, then you must have a problem with a lot of estimating techniques used in Pokemon. Regardless, it definitely isn't arrogant to make an estimation about a deck I didn't play. I applaud Kyle's confidence to play lesser-known techs and do succeed.

All one has to do is take a look at the top 64/128 list, note what decks were played, see that none if any other luxape decks ran the techs (both, too), and that should give an idea of the field. Extrapolate and estimate.

If only 1 luxape player in the top 128 used stark mountain, rayquaza, and ninetales out of nearly, that is under 1% of the "better field". Imagine how the less-skilled field (being completely assuming here, but that is what the top cut does- it assumes the current 128 players with the best record/resistance are the best in the field) would run these techs. I think people who miss the top cut are less likely to run the techs, and Kyle was already 1% of the top cut, so I should think that less than 1% of the other players used the two techs in their deck.

 

[chriscobi634]

Banette you are way out of line here. I made Top 128 with Ape/Ray. I knew of the techs, heck I was trying to the combo work for Regionals, Ninetales/Ray/Stark. But like Vergel said most Ape/Ray players didn't have the stones to run both or either one. Or we made our decklist fit our playing styles. Which was the beauty of the deck. It had it's initial strategy but then it also had a unique way of playing it. I for one have always disliked flip cards, so I wasn't going to put Ray in.

I would like to see the numbers of this deck in Top Cut, like how many were in Top 128, Top 64, etc.

 

[ryanvergel]

Saying "I disagree with those numbers" is one thing. Saying "you're arrogant and a mediocre player" and other ridiculous things is another thing entirely. I personally think that 90% of the field didn't know of the techs, based on my own opinions, and based on some numbers.

But we can definitely say that virtually no one actually ran the cards, just based on what we saw in the top cuts. If the luxapes that actually top cut weren't running all those techs, why can't we say even fewer ran the techs in the not-top cut, and come up with the conclusion that virtually no one else ran the techs?

I'm not going to stoop to your level and try to insult you. Maybe if I had less success in Georgia, like you, I would feel the need to insult someone who does better in the state- like me. But what do I know; I am a mediocre player.

 

[Prime]

let's all calm down a little and try to stay on topic. infractions have been given out to those that deserved them.

 

[chriscobi634]

I honestly think Ape's Corner (My name for it since it covers so many types) has the advantage vs. Flygon who doesn't set-up until T3 or later. By that turn Ape has already split bombed 3 times, spreading 120. Or it can Split Bomb a couple times then drag up the Flygon that is powered up and KO it with Fire Spin. I was playing against Flygon/Machamp and the Flygons never attacked me.

It's so crucial for Ape to KO those Flygon ASAP before they Lvl. Up, because Flygon Lv.X can take 2 prizes and disrupt with it's Body, and leave the Ape player in a bad situation, scrambling for energy.

Ape's Corner is a really hard deck to play and a great list is hard to make. So it will probably be like the Speed Spread of 06-07 but for this Nats. Not many players can play it effectively or make a great list for it so it won't see much play as your Auto-Pilot/List decks like Machamp, Gengar, to an extent Flygon and Dialga G (W/O Palkia G).

Didn't I call it? And then there is this other time I called it.

Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

All this from the person who thought this deck lost to Kingdra. I played against Chin with his Flygon/Machamp and I lost because he flipped 3/4 on my Uxie and then made a misplay because Jeremy was distracting me. He concentrated more on his Machamp, and I wasn't playing Toxicroak before just 2 Unown Gs.

I've yet to playtest against Gengar/Queen but right away I see so many outs against that deck that it's not a 50/50 at all.

Flygon is way to slow to give this deck any problems, like I said before I honestly think it's BDIF but not anyone can just pick this deck up and play it or make a good list for it.

Not even the 37th ranked master in the US could make a good list for it, with only a 1/1 Luxray.

Here is the second time where I mention how good this deck is. yet a lot of Pokegymers wrote it off.

 

[ryanvergel]

It was my #3 going into nats. I disliked my Machamp, Gengar, Mewtwo X, Flygon X, mirror LuxApe matches, so I ended up not playing it.

 

[Articjedi]

Your first post kinda answers the second one. The deck doesn't autopilot, so it's not like you'll have many last minute switches to the deck.

 

[Chompy]

can anybody explain to me what "AutoPilot" means?

 

[gallade]

it means that basically, you draw, you do cosmic, or whatever, get more of your pokemon out, and attack.

 

[The Ralts]

can anybody explain to me what "AutoPilot" means?

Well, what does it sound like? >.>
It pilots itself. Little to no outside(player) thinking required. Hence the term, auto pilot.

 

[charchar]

I think it's going to be pretty big because a lot of people will go like it won so I play it.

Gengar will also be pretty big like Lux/Ape.

Does this deck have trouble with gengar? What's a good tech to beat gengar?