No, I did not contradict myself and no where in my OP was I trying to save ADULTS. They should know, point blank. Its about the younger players/ new players that wouldn't know the difference between what they need and what they want, not saying all don't know because no where did I state that either. Again its not all about the values, it also has to do with the useable factor, and the actual factor that is, when your getting most of the kids better cards for junk that can't be used or no one else would want which puts the younger player/ new player, at the point that they can't get any trades going or make a deck they might be into, how will they get what they ACTUALLY need?
Nationals new players/younger players (ripping)
- Thread starter PokeChump
- Start date
- Status
No, I did not contradict myself and no where in my OP was I trying to save ADULTS. They should know, point blank. Its about the younger players/ new players that wouldn't know the difference between what they need and what they want, not saying all don't know because no where did I state that either. Again its not all about the values, it also has to do with the useable factor, and the actual factor that is, when your getting most of the kids better cards for junk that can't be used or no one else would want which puts the younger player/ new player, at the point that they can't get any trades going or make a deck they might be into, how will they get what they ACTUALLY need?
Patsfan112892
New Member
fact is most younger kids dont care what stuff is worth they only care about their favorites ones that look cool and ones that deal a lot of damage and if thats what they want then ok
its not always about value i mean most trades just should be
i need this you need that or i want this you want that
plain and simple
its not always about value i mean most trades just should be
i need this you need that or i want this you want that
plain and simple
Still, knowing the young player/new player your trading with doesn't know the things you do, should at least give you some sense to tell him/her what is actually going on. More insight to the cards.
grassmaster239
Active Member
I tell him the following.
I will trade you my "insert card names here" for your "insert card names here" That is all the information they need. They don't care what cards are worth. They just want to have fun. If someone wants to trade rare for rare or holo for holo, then I will do that. It is what they want to do, why try to change people. HMM? STOP TRYING TO FORCE YOUR WAYS ON ME!!!!!!!!
I will trade you my "insert card names here" for your "insert card names here" That is all the information they need. They don't care what cards are worth. They just want to have fun. If someone wants to trade rare for rare or holo for holo, then I will do that. It is what they want to do, why try to change people. HMM? STOP TRYING TO FORCE YOUR WAYS ON ME!!!!!!!!
XD haha, you're funny, (no sarcasm) I'm not forcing anyone to do anything, just trying to give valid statements to the ones that think its right to rip them off. I already explained everything threw the "before" posts, so if anyone else has a statement that doesn't pertain to what has already been handled give it a shot.
I know better than to even post this, but I'm going to....
PokeChump - You gained some points here with this Poke-Dad.... Most people on here understand the point you're trying to make. And like I said in my post, it's usually stopped cold if there's adults around. You sound like you're the kind of guy that would stop a new kid from getting fleeced, take him to his parents, walk him over to the Poke-Mart (card sales) and point out the cheap cards he wants. I respect that....
To the few that are saying "but if the kid wants it???"... then YES, give the kid what he wants.... But give the rookie proper value if you know what it is... Ex... the Gengar Prime mentioned above... Toss the kid 4 Chancey and 4 Blissey if that's the deck he wants to build... It still may not balance it out... but you need to show some heart. You gain several things - A)Respect with the kids parents... B)a Younger player who will look up and give you props in the future... C)that younger kid might stick with the game because he feels the generosity the poke-community offers.
I've lived the last one, even at my old age. Took my daughter to our first ever tourney Nationals '07.. We had only been playing a month.. While standing in a long deck check line, some kid behind me asked what I was playing... I showed him my deck which was a dud... This 20-something kid, who I did not know, opened his binder and improved my deck majorly... I didn't even know what a rare candy or scramble energy even was, and he gave me about 10 cards that improved my deck... After me and my daughter went through deck check we went and sat down... Saw some 10 year old crying about not having some missing cards to his deck and she needed to run back to the hotel to get them.... Mother was freaking out, and I looked in my collection and had two of the Stadium cards he needed... I handed them over without question... They offered cash, I took the fathers handshake instead.... Made a friend for life.... That is POKEMON... That's why most of you play this game....
To the ones that are saying... "Keep Out of My Business".... Are you serious???? Can you seriously come on here and argue your side against a concerned parent like PokeChump.... The guy doesn't think he's better than anyone, he's just stating his opinion on something he'd like to see get cleaned up. Do me a favor.... HIT THE PRINT BUTTON on this entire thread... show it to your Parents and local TO or league director.... See how you feel after that.... C'mon... Use your head.....
PokeChump - You gained some points here with this Poke-Dad.... Most people on here understand the point you're trying to make. And like I said in my post, it's usually stopped cold if there's adults around. You sound like you're the kind of guy that would stop a new kid from getting fleeced, take him to his parents, walk him over to the Poke-Mart (card sales) and point out the cheap cards he wants. I respect that....
To the few that are saying "but if the kid wants it???"... then YES, give the kid what he wants.... But give the rookie proper value if you know what it is... Ex... the Gengar Prime mentioned above... Toss the kid 4 Chancey and 4 Blissey if that's the deck he wants to build... It still may not balance it out... but you need to show some heart. You gain several things - A)Respect with the kids parents... B)a Younger player who will look up and give you props in the future... C)that younger kid might stick with the game because he feels the generosity the poke-community offers.
I've lived the last one, even at my old age. Took my daughter to our first ever tourney Nationals '07.. We had only been playing a month.. While standing in a long deck check line, some kid behind me asked what I was playing... I showed him my deck which was a dud... This 20-something kid, who I did not know, opened his binder and improved my deck majorly... I didn't even know what a rare candy or scramble energy even was, and he gave me about 10 cards that improved my deck... After me and my daughter went through deck check we went and sat down... Saw some 10 year old crying about not having some missing cards to his deck and she needed to run back to the hotel to get them.... Mother was freaking out, and I looked in my collection and had two of the Stadium cards he needed... I handed them over without question... They offered cash, I took the fathers handshake instead.... Made a friend for life.... That is POKEMON... That's why most of you play this game....
To the ones that are saying... "Keep Out of My Business".... Are you serious???? Can you seriously come on here and argue your side against a concerned parent like PokeChump.... The guy doesn't think he's better than anyone, he's just stating his opinion on something he'd like to see get cleaned up. Do me a favor.... HIT THE PRINT BUTTON on this entire thread... show it to your Parents and local TO or league director.... See how you feel after that.... C'mon... Use your head.....
I think the entire thing here is intent and who you are dealing with. I feel there is a huge difference between both parties knowing the value of their cards and simply trying to get a better deal vrs one party know the value and simply lieing to the other one.
There is also a huge difference between I'll trade my Arceus Lv X for your 4 Pokemon Collector vrs I'll trade my Arceus Lv X for your Pokemon Collector.
Lastly to all you kids that are like its cool to rip off little kids I'm going to let you in on a little secret, no one likes you. you think I'm kidding? I'm really not. I would rather have respect of the community than rip off a little kid, but thats just me.
There is also a huge difference between I'll trade my Arceus Lv X for your 4 Pokemon Collector vrs I'll trade my Arceus Lv X for your Pokemon Collector.
Lastly to all you kids that are like its cool to rip off little kids I'm going to let you in on a little secret, no one likes you. you think I'm kidding? I'm really not. I would rather have respect of the community than rip off a little kid, but thats just me.
baby mario
Front Page Article Editor<br><a href="http://pokeg
Most people do have more self-respect than to rip kids off.
The ones that don't? They will find a way to do it anyway.
I dunno . . . I understand the OP's good intentions, and I'm more than happy for friends/parents to check my trades, but I'm not sure I'd feel completely comfortable about a stranger watching over it. Maybe that's just me.
The ones that don't? They will find a way to do it anyway.
I dunno . . . I understand the OP's good intentions, and I'm more than happy for friends/parents to check my trades, but I'm not sure I'd feel completely comfortable about a stranger watching over it. Maybe that's just me.
ogremarauder
New Member
You should be very wary when trading with children. It can be construed as a verbal contract- A) most states do not allow minors to enter contracts of any kind. B) If the difference in valuation is great enough and someone with the chops to pursue it chooses to do so, you could open yourself up to possible litigation in small claims court. I know this is an extremely unlikely possibility, BUT the laws exist so it is possible.
When i trade with kids i always make sure a parent or guardian is involved and is ok with the trade.
losjackal
Technical Administrator
For the traders arguing that "kids don't care about the value of their cards", then tell them the retail value of both sides as you're doing the trade. See if they still don't care.
Or, think of it this way:
A boy wants change for a dollar for the gumball machine.
You hand him four quarters, but he gives you a 10 dollar bill because he is blind and cannot tell the difference.
Do you say something?
Or, think of it this way:
A boy wants change for a dollar for the gumball machine.
You hand him four quarters, but he gives you a 10 dollar bill because he is blind and cannot tell the difference.
Do you say something?
Nobody said it's cool to rip off little kids, they just said it has happened before, and it will happen again. Like I said in one of my posts no person goes to an event to intentionally rip off a little kid, and if they do then that's another thing. However it happens, and you can offer the kid more cards and the kid could just say no i dont need those cards or i dont want them. But not one person in this thread said they intentionally rip off little kids.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 12:17 PM ----------
Thats a bit different. A pokemon card is a piece of cardboard. Ya it's worth money but it's different from an ACTUAL 10 dollar bill.
Master Entei
Member
But not so much different. Sure, the value is a bit different with different people, but if you get excited because you just got 5 times the actual worth of the card back just because the kid didn't know what he was giving away, it is like trading a quarter for a dollar.
Now this is different. This isn't ripping off, if you tell them that they could get more for the card and they refuse, it's they're own business to decide, and a stranger shouldn't interfere.
Dude, you're ripping off little kids. Not cool.
Yeah, it would be a bit uncomfortable if a complete stranger watched over your trades. A simple "Hey, btw, that card's three times as valuable than what you're getting" would be just as efficient, and not seem as noisy.
Saying that it's okay to rip off someone when they don't know the value of the card they're giving away is like saying it's okay to take the little kid's deck because he left it unattended at the table. He should've known better!
It's not healthy for the community to rip off someone new (or unexperienced, even if they weren't that new!), and even if the kid was happy at the moment of the trade, he'll feel cheated a week later if someone tells them that they were ripped off.
tl;dr Trying to say that it's okay to rip off a 7-year-old because they didn't know the value of the card makes you look pathetic. Stop.
losjackal
Technical Administrator
Indeed it's less abstract, which is why makes the situation more uncomfortable.
I don't think anyone is saying that every trade needs to be equal dollar for dollar. A $5 Pokemon Collector for $2 or $3 worth of holos and rares is in the neighborhood of "fair", depending on the needs and wants of both sides. But a $25 Gengar Prime for $2.50 of holos and rares is what we'd all call a "rip off".
Thanks a lot for the respect, that means a lot. One thing though, I am not a parent, I am a older brother to 5 siblings, all which look up to me, the 2 youngest having interest in what I do and having cards of there own. Which is part of the reason why I posted this, and of course to bring the topic up to everyone that reads it. I am a adult though. LOL
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:38 PM ----------
That's why the older/veteran player should pass the knowledge on to them instead of possibly taking all they have for scraps.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:41 PM ----------
I have no intentions to "stand over" anyone's trades, and I have no intentions to make a big deal out of it, like I stated before, if you see it happening, tell the older/veteran player, if they shrug it off, try to teach the kid/younger player about whats going on.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:43 PM ----------
Yea, laws do exist but I don't think playing/trading Pokemon in any way will break them.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:45 PM ----------
That's probably the best way if you are a adult trading to a kid.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:47 PM ----------
Good example, kids/younger new players, are smart, once they find something out, they'll most likely remember. It just takes us, the older/adults/veteran players to pass the knowledge we know on.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:53 PM ----------
@xCiegex, Someone did imply it was cool to rip kids off, also implied that there "good at it" look on the first page of posts and read down. Also, most may not go to purposely rip kids off, but there is that few that do.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 01:57 PM ----------
I agree with your post, money is used to buy the cards, so $10 going into pokemon is pretty much straight up value to what ever its going for.
Last edited:
grassmaster239
Active Member
I am not ripping them off. I am giving them a deal that they are happy with.. I see nothing wrong with that. They are happy. I made a profit. Everyone wins.
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 02:14 PM ----------
---------- Post added 06/20/2011 at 02:14 PM ----------
Yes, I can argue that. My business is my business. If they ask you what a card is worth, tell them, but it seams rude to go around butting into peoples trades. And is what I am doing any worse then what Trollandtoad does? no.... I have helped people out with decks before to. It depends on the kid. If it is some snobby kid, of course I won't help them, but I have helped out people with there decks before tournaments on more then one occasion.
Last edited:
Master Entei
Member
If what you do isn't ripping off, what is? How do you define ripping off?
The problem isn't really that you were doing something that the kid doesn't want. The problem is that you're taking advantage of someone else's lack of knowledge. Taking advantage of a child.
Posted with Mobile style...
grassmaster239
Active Member
I considder what I am doing making good deals. I considder ripping stealing. Everyone has a different value for cards anyways. So in their minds, they could be getting a better deal
Its your opinion that you're making "good deals" to a kid/younger player, for the ones that wouldn't know, they don't have a clue to what you know that the trade is going into your favor more then it should. The definition to that is "Ripping" You're taking advantage of the fact that the kid/new player doesn't know what you do, all that he/she know is the cards there getting are cool looking, but what they don't know is to excel in the game without having there parents to spend extra $ is that they need cards to actually swap in FAIR trades.... It doesn't come down to values, its about the knowledge you have over them and you using it in the wrong way.
Master Entei
Member
Sorry, but I don't know if I understood this right, English isn't my first language... Is your definition for ripping "stealing"? Because that really isn't a good definition. It doesn't work the other way, at all. Stealing isn't ripping.
Posted with Mobile style...
- Status