Card sleeve policy CHANGE
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Flaming_Spinach
Feature Editor
Rainbowgym said:
You get to choose which of your prizes you want to draw. Not like that's very big.
Infact, knowing what prize you're about to draw is not that great of an advantage. We already have HCTR for that, but no one plays it because IT'S NOT WORTH IT!! What's the value in knowing your prizes when, if you get caught, you get banned for a year+?
Someone who has to resort to marking their cards is someone who doesn't have a chance of winning anyway.
Only a complete moron would mark their cards.
WHISCASHEX
Member
Maybe Pokemon should have players change sleeves in the Top 4 so, it's guaranteed no cheating. Pokemon supplies the Sleeves. I don't support this at all.
NateDawg161992
New Member
I totally agree with Flaming_Spinach: If you're going to cheat then you woudn't win anyway. I know someone who in fun games insists that Pow! doesn't allow that person to choose what to move, I still beat him almost every game, and the ones where I lose only 1 out of 50 would change if he didn't cheat. I only know one person who cheats and does good, and when he doesn't he still wins.
EDIT: Whicash has an interesting idea, but another idea is to have the judge hand you the cards and hide the decks in the finals.
EDIT EDIT: Theres to many people around in the finals to try pulling any stunt and I don't know all to many people who don't look at people beside them (I've seen people cheating while the player missed it).
EDIT: Whicash has an interesting idea, but another idea is to have the judge hand you the cards and hide the decks in the finals.
EDIT EDIT: Theres to many people around in the finals to try pulling any stunt and I don't know all to many people who don't look at people beside them (I've seen people cheating while the player missed it).
Flaming_Spinach
Feature Editor
HOW ABOUT THIS:
If you're really concerned about your opponent having marked sleeves, Don't let them take a prize when they knock something out. Instead, YOU get to decide what card they take as a prize.
PS. I bolded and enlarged this entire post because I think it's pure genious.
If you're really concerned about your opponent having marked sleeves, Don't let them take a prize when they knock something out. Instead, YOU get to decide what card they take as a prize.
PS. I bolded and enlarged this entire post because I think it's pure genious.
NateDawg161992
New Member
Flaming_Spinach said:
Even better idea? Yes indeed, it's pure genius! And no that isn't sarcasm.
Squirtle said:
Squirtle, you're way the hell out of line here. This is my job. When I'm done for the day, I go home. I typically leave the office at 5:00PM. Do you think that maybe I typed up a reply just before I ran out to catch my carpool, submitted it, and left?
Now, to answer your question, because I CAN justify the call...
There's one reason that we included those sleeves in the blanket rule; Exceptions.
Take a second to read my response to Moss's questions in post #116. Heck, I'll even quote the pertinent text for you:
Simply put, I'd much rather make a blanket rule as to which sleeves are legal than have to maintain an "approved" list that has to be updated every time a new sleeve is produced that meets these requirements.
Now, Yasu or TPC may step in and request that we reverse the inclusion of the PokeBall sleeves in this ban. If they do, we may agree to, and put rules in place to allow it. But there's no guarantee that they'll have a problem with any of this.
/posting from home, on my personal time, so that Squirtle feels special
M_Liesik said:
Mike that would make a lot of people happy. A LOT of people very happy. Including me!
Chuck - You're a good player AND I like you but sometimes you're a Burninating_Torchic. You can't speak as if your perspective is the only one. Sure, you don't care, but A LOT of people do. Keep in mind this is a KID'S game.
Kids believe in luck. They get a kick out of it. It helps give them confidence.
I DO have 8 different decks in Pokeball sleeves. Yeah, you're right, I can't play them all, but it is a PAIN to sleeve and resleeve decks when I usually run a different one at each tournament, and I often don't pick until I get there.
In addition, for many people it seems it is not the fact that they want to use the sleeves, but they feel slighted because they spent money/time getting the sleeves, and now they have to buy new ones. This doesn't bug me, I've got the money, I can go buy 1000 sleeves, but for a lot of people having to shell out $10 ($4.99 for 50 sleeves x2 is $9.98 plus takes) for new sleeves is NOT fun. And when you're a parent who plays with your TWO kids and you all need new sleeves? It all adds up.
Rainbowgym said:
I'm gonna have to assume you just want to argue since it is obvious how marked cards can cause cheating. Let's make a list, so it is easy for you to understand.
1) The most obvious I think, if your cards are marked you know what is in your prizes. This let's you know when you are out of certain cards in your deck, and also helps you pick out which prize you want. I don't know if you have ever played Pokemon, but this could bring about a complete reversal of who is winning and who is screwed.
2) While shuffling, you can take note of a certain card, where it is, and manipulate it to get it near the top. You're opponent is gonna cut? Sure, they've cut a few times before, you know how they cut, shuffle the card to a place where you know it'll end up at time.
3) Begining of the game, look you have your Holon Mentor's marked. You make sure they are evenly spaced around the deck so you have a good chance of gettin em no matter how your opponent cuts.
Blah blah there are more and other examples but still it should be obvious.
Now, after that, I'd like to say that I am AGAINST this rule.
I think it would be MUCH better to just ALLOW mainly plain sleeves.
By this I mean sleeves without any complicated artwork. Plain sleeves, POKEBALL sleeves, sleeves with a general symbol somewhere and that is it. Judges have final discretion. I know it is not perfect but it seems to be better than the current rule IMO.
Pidgeotto Trainer
New Member
I too do not see why you guys are making such a big deal about this. =/
You need 1 set of legal sleeves. If you love your pictured sleeves so much play them all the time, just not at the tournament.
You need 1 set of legal sleeves. If you love your pictured sleeves so much play them all the time, just not at the tournament.
Rulemaster
New Member
Guys stop, don't you guys realize that this is just another April Fools joke? seriously, the PSYLUM'S POKEGYM thing was too.
ShadowCard
Active Member
4 days after April Fools Day?Rulemaster said:
If it was an April Fools joke, I suspect one of the pokegym staff would have posted it. Even though Mike has the ability to mega burn us all in one hit :lol: , he really doesn't exercise that power. He posted it on the OP forum, where such fun is absent (I actually think that hurts the forum :/ ); you're a Professor so you know how it is. If he wanted to toy with the players, I believe he would have posted it here instead.
Ho Megas Alexandros
New Member
Pidgeotto Trainer said:
Maybe we care because this is just a number of growing problems concerning new rulings or policies that just don't make sense.
1. Blatant bias toward the younger crowd. 16 invites at Nationals, while 15+ get half that number and half MANY times more participants?
2. Less overall invites while we have MORE players? We have 20 less invites(going from 78 to 58 for 15+) but the number of players continues to grow annually? What kind of backwards policy is that?
3. One and Done. Allbeit this is a very heated point of discussion, I do not agree with the policy. I will say that I do not like trip-holders conceding to non-trip-holders at Gym Challenges in order to gain an invite, but I think at Regionals and States, where you NEED the money to go to Nationals(or even GCs) to get invites, the one and done should not be in effect. Also, players should be rewarded for outstanding play, not alienated from the game.
This issue is just another issue of new PUI policy that doesn't seem right in the eyes of many. I don't think this is an issue of art-sleeves as much as it is the straw that is breaking the camel's back. How many backwards policies are going to be issued? Every new policy I've seen implemented thus far as been bad in my opinion. This is just #4 on my list of poor policies being changed/made for this season.
Concerning the sleeve issue itself: I already stated I think it's stupid. It is easy to mark or cheat with de-sleeved cards, probably easier than with sleeves in all honesty. The curvation and bending of cards is so obvious, it's ridiculous. Want to know how bad it is? I've played against people that can tell what starter I have based on the curvation of the card when it is FACE DOWN. Yes, when you play against LBS, for example. There is only ONE DX basic they use: Jirachi. If it's RH, you can see the obvious curvation of the card. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to see your opponent has a Jirachi start, and you can adjust your starter based on that (for example, I have a Cyndaquil in hand and a Jirachi in hand, I might play the Cyndaquil instead to harass early on and get a T2 KO)
People will cheat regardless. This policy will NOT make it any more difficult to cheat via cards and card-backings. You can de-sleeve cards at any time in rounds. I could go in deck-check with opaque sleeves, and before a tough opponent de-sleeve. Or for a Top Cut de-sleeve and mark the cards so that I can tell some cards(even basic markings of energy/pokemon/trainer- to see what I might topdeck). Let's not even get started on the obvious issue of card curving. I know when my opponent uses an LM or DX RH card in their deck, how dumb is that?
This is a bad policy. There was no need for it, and all it does is just annoy players a little bit more, and when added to the number of bigger, worse problems(like the unfair 14- bias, the international state, or the huge drop in invites) people will get angrier and angrier. There have been no issues of cheating, There is no need for this, but it was done anyway. It does NOT address the issue of cheating(which I have shown, with the card curvation and ability to de-sleeve/re-sleeve mid-tournament and still mark the backs of cards) like it is supposed to. I think this is really about the issue of inappropriate art. If it is, just come out and say it. I hate the idea of being told it's for better play when it clearly isn't. This is about inappropriate art backing, and the change in the art of cards ruling made, and the responses in the thread for inappropriate sleeves shows an obvious inclination toward this decision- just come out admit it, no need to create a false front guys.
M_Liesik said:
Mike , Thank you for the response. But WHOA! I did not say anything to you to recieve a response like that.Did I make a personal attack to you? No I didn't.You took my post comepletly wrong.If I did anything to aggrivate you , I apologize.No I did not consider that you "typed up a reply just before I ran out to catch my carpool, submitted it, and left?" I didn't. I would think that you posted after me and saw it.
Squirtle said:
Squirtle said:
Did Either of those posts deserve a response like I got from you? I WAS NOT trying to **** you off. But I dont think that I warrented a personal attack. Once again I apologize. I'm done now. I am done with this thread.
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Flaming_Spinach
Feature Editor
Alright. I agree with Alexandros (except for the small point about 1-and-done, but that's not really the issue here).
Fact is this: PUI has made a large number of questionable decisions over the past season. Bias towards the youngsters, loss of invites, insane prize differences between first and second at all major events, less boosters at Pres, and now, banning of the vast majority of card sleeves. It's enough to make someone wonder why they even play this game.
People brought up the point of inappropriate card sleeves, and PUI did something about it. Sure, they made a few people angry, but the vast majority of people either thought it was a good idea, or didn't care at all.
Then they come and just decide to get rid of ALL art sleeves, Even though THERE IS NO PRECEDENT OR REASON.
Someone might cheat? That's not a reason to ban everything.
It's enough to make me wonder where it's all going to end. When will the questionable and bad decisions stop? No one's quit yet over what's happened this year, maybe that's about to change.
Fact is this: PUI has made a large number of questionable decisions over the past season. Bias towards the youngsters, loss of invites, insane prize differences between first and second at all major events, less boosters at Pres, and now, banning of the vast majority of card sleeves. It's enough to make someone wonder why they even play this game.
People brought up the point of inappropriate card sleeves, and PUI did something about it. Sure, they made a few people angry, but the vast majority of people either thought it was a good idea, or didn't care at all.
Then they come and just decide to get rid of ALL art sleeves, Even though THERE IS NO PRECEDENT OR REASON.
Someone might cheat? That's not a reason to ban everything.
It's enough to make me wonder where it's all going to end. When will the questionable and bad decisions stop? No one's quit yet over what's happened this year, maybe that's about to change.
ShadowCard
Active Member
I find OP's distrust of the player base, which is known for its good sportsmanship, bothersome. What is sad is that a player playing without card sleeves appears more likely to be cheating than one who is playing with card sleeves (like a lot of you have mentioned the Deoxys cards). Why don't we ban decks without card sleeves too?
Thanks for the poll, PokePop.
Thanks for the poll, PokePop.
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