Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Gothitelle in BRs

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darth_vader

darth_vader

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Why hasn't Gothitelle being doing as well as some other decks in BRs? It won in only 2 reported BRs.

What are some common counters Gothitelle decks have been seeing?
 
People aren't playing it right. I've gone 4-1 both days this weekend placing 5th and missing cut saturday and making 4th but losing to Reshiboar today.

The decks fine, but just like everything else in todays format you have things you either can't beat or have extreme difficulties with.
 
1. Players haven't perfected builds, mastered playing it and don't know how to play specific matchups.
2. Playsers were expecting and teching against it.
3. It doesn't do very well in a tournament format (like Lostgar), in a full untimed game it can fall 3,4 or even 5 prizes behind and still win easilly.
 
Wow way to ask a simple question... haha :smile:

Here are the reasons why I think it is struggling:

1) Time Limit: This is the biggest reason why it is not succeeding like people thought it would, the time limit. People are learning to slow play the deck when they see a Gothirita (sp?) turned over. They just take their lead to time. In Top Cut, it takes too long for the first game to conclude, leaving a second game to go to time and a sudden death match. This is not a good situation for Goth.

2) Speed Kills: ZPST and tyRam are both too fast for most Goth players. If you are Goth you are relying on some lucky draws to get those basics evolved before they are KOd.

3) Vileplume (with Beartic, Yanmega, Mew, etc.) gets the better of this match up and tends to have a better match up against the field in general.

4) There are just enough big hitting decks to keep Goth down. Decks with RDL, Bad Boar, Magnezone, etc really feast on Goth. As long as they see a decent amount of play, Goth will struggle to consistently dominate the tables.
 
Honestly, Zekrom and Reshiphlo don't give the deck problems, once you get the lock you're fine, my biggest problem is there isn't enough draw in the deck, as I like a lot of people are missing Tropical Beach, so you rely on top decks a lot and thats not always good.
 
My perception:

1. There are plenty of decks which can OHKO Gothitelle (Magnezone, RDL, MewBox, Bad Boar, Lanturn).

2. The most prevalent attacker in the format is Yanmega. Against Yanmega, bench swap space for 200 HP has been removed (5 x 40), or else your bench can be sniped. This really squeezes the bench swap space, particularly for those Gothitelle builds which run Shaymin/Jirachi. The squeeze is even tighter against Yanmega/Kingdra.

3. Vulnerability to Lost Zone decks, status decks like Roserade/Leafeon.

4. The quick-loss due to the 30 HP Solosis, combined with a bad opening start.

5. A good Gothitelle deck often requires skill to play and is vulnerable to misplays that will cost you the game.
 
Magnezone decks DO NOT call for a defeat against Goth. A fast Goth means that Magnezone's 3-1-3 line will get crippled. Drawing into that one Magneton won't be easy, but eventually they will play it. Just hope Goth doesn't have a Catcher/Junk in hand. It becomes a battle of speed. Goth is out first? Huge advantage for Goth. Zone is out first? I don't think I need to explain that Zone has a big edge there.

I have also tried a 3-2-3 line of Zone to combat Goth, but the logic remains that in order for that line up to be effective, you'll need them at the same time so that Goth can't Catch one up and KO. Ultimately it's useless. Oddly enough, Rare Candy is the best Goth counter in Zone oriented decks.

To be honest, Mega hardly limits Goth's healing capabilities. Max Potion + Junk Arm is more than enough, and Goth can even let Mega by with a cheap Zekrom KO, if they run another one. In fact even attacking with Mega at all can be difficult, unless they constantly redraw Judge/Copycat. Without trainers, Goth can just drop 2-3 cards and be safe.

Speed isn't a problem, one Goth locks it should be game over. However, I have given my Goth build to many friends and playing from behind is a skill they don't fully have. I can see where many would assume fastdecks can push over Goth, but in actuality any player who is more practiced at playing on the defensive can out maneuver and lock such fast decks.

I have yet to test out Magby. It does sound like a strong counter, though.
 
Ignatious said:
What are your thoughts on the following paragraph?
Click to expand...

Megazone requires a 4-2-3 line of Magnezone. I've even seen 4-3-3 or 4-3-4 ran, but at a very minimum 4-2-3 seems to be a solid play.

Gothitelle runs very tight lists, and they don't have as many draw supporters as some other decks do. Obviously, once you set up, the game is yours, but I think you're overstating Gothitelle's advantages over "fast" decks that get quick and easy KOs, especially in a tournament structure where rounds are 30+3. Note that I'm not saying the Megazone matchup vs. Gothitelle is easy. All I'm saying is that it's a matchup that's not as easy for Megazone as Pikabruce might make it seem, and not easy for Gothitelle as you make it seem.

Also, putting a Zekrom active except to take the final prize is a mistake in almost every situation. Killing a Yanmega is generally not worth the risk of getting your Reuniclus Catchered out and killed.
 
psychup2034 said:
Megazone requires a 4-2-3 line of Magnezone. I've even seen 4-3-3 or 4-3-4 ran, but at a very minimum 4-2-3 seems to be a solid play.

Gothitelle runs very tight lists, and they don't have as many draw supporters as some other decks do. Obviously, once you set up, the game is yours, but I think you're overstating Gothitelle's advantages over "fast" decks that get quick and easy KOs, especially in a tournament structure where rounds are 30+3. Note that I'm not saying the Megazone matchup vs. Gothitelle is easy. All I'm saying is that it's a matchup that's not as easy for Megazone as Pikabruce might make it seem, and not easy for Gothitelle as you make it seem.

Also, putting a Zekrom active except to take the final prize is a mistake in almost every situation. Killing a Yanmega is generally not worth the risk of getting your Reuniclus Catchered out and killed.
Click to expand...

I meant specifically that running 2 Magneton hasn't helped much at all against Gothitelle. It has helped much more against other trainer locks, where Catcher isn't possible, but against Gothitelle, you really need them both at the same time. In my eyes the match up is 50-50, I didn't mean to imply that Goth has a strong edge at all.

If Zekrom takes the final prize, you win. They can't Catcher Reuniclus because the game is over.
 
L the Great said:
Honestly, Zekrom and Reshiphlo don't give the deck problems, once you get the lock you're fine, my biggest problem is there isn't enough draw in the deck, as I like a lot of people are missing Tropical Beach, so you rely on top decks a lot and thats not always good.
Click to expand...

Read my front page article. My engine works wonders
Posted with Mobile style...
 
ajhawk said:
Wow way to ask a simple question... haha :smile:

Here are the reasons why I think it is struggling:

1) Time Limit: This is the biggest reason why it is not succeeding like people thought it would, the time limit. People are learning to slow play the deck when they see a Gothirita (sp?) turned over. They just take their lead to time. In Top Cut, it takes too long for the first game to conclude, leaving a second game to go to time and a sudden death match. This is not a good situation for Goth.

2) Speed Kills: ZPST and tyRam are both too fast for most Goth players. If you are Goth you are relying on some lucky draws to get those basics evolved before they are KOd.

3) Vileplume (with Beartic, Yanmega, Mew, etc.) gets the better of this match up and tends to have a better match up against the field in general.

4) There are just enough big hitting decks to keep Goth down. Decks with RDL, Bad Boar, Magnezone, etc really feast on Goth. As long as they see a decent amount of play, Goth will struggle to consistently dominate the tables.
Click to expand...

Wrong.

1) Time doesn't hurt Goth at all. I am constantly winning around the 20 minute mark. You'd have to be an idiot to say that time hurts it.

2) Speed loses. Zekrom is a near autowin, same with reshiphlosion. T2 Goth is GG easily. Praying to topdeck? Clearly you have no idea what you're talking about. 4 Twins sets you up beautifully, and lets you win games against these autopilot decks (esp reshiphlo) with ease.
 
jeffrey123 said:
Wrong.

1) Time doesn't hurt Goth at all. I am constantly winning around the 20 minute mark. You'd have to be an idiot to say that time hurts it.

2) Speed loses. Zekrom is a near autowin, same with reshiphlosion. T2 Goth is GG easily. Praying to topdeck? Clearly you have no idea what you're talking about. 4 Twins sets you up beautifully, and lets you win games against these autopilot decks (esp reshiphlo) with ease.
Click to expand...

Zekrom is not a near autowin. Multiple solosis have to be on the field at once to ensure setup, and any good player knows Solosis is the 1# target.
 
jeffrey123 said:
Wow. I didn't know people were this bad at this game.

Pichu
Playground
3 solosis



gg
Click to expand...


I didnt know people were this pretentious. That is far from game over for the zekrom player. Look at what has the most Br's wins? Your theorymon godhand doesnt happen often at all, and if you think beating a good zekrom is that easy, then im going to go on the assumption its is you who is bad at this game.
 
I've never seen Goth lose to Zekrom... You just have to throw them prizes until you get a Goth out, then it's GG. They can't BB and they can't Catcher a Solosis, so you can have Reuni next turn. Then they scoop.

And yeah, most people play a 3-1-3 Zone. It's fine. 4-2-4 in consistent MegaZone decks is common, too.
 
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