I think there needs to be another product that has basic energy cards.

[ShadowGuard]

They made energy as league promos for the reasons you mentioned - even if some players maybe would rather like to see trainers.

If you don't have a local league, you can still trade for energy at tournaments. Of course players don't carry all their energy cards with them, but you can ask them to bring them for the next tournament. You could also contact your TO if they'd be able to sell you the energy you need for the tournament at a fair rate.

 

[signofzeta]

You can't compare MTG to Pokemon, they're completely different games with completely different fan bases. Kids will be walking through a Toys R Us, see Pokemon packs, and want it because it's the Pokemon they've seen in toys and tv show. Then they'll be dissapointed by the fact that all they got was energies - all he wanted was the cool Pokemon. This would never happen in Magic because MTG's fan base isn't 8 year old kids who saw a tv show and want the cool looking card. They're competitive and their fans exist to play. You can't compare them.



Oh boo-hoo. I use base set energies that I've owned since I was 10 years old. If you want your energy to be pretty, then you're going to have to pay the extra money for them. If you want to be cheap, you can get a set of all energies for less than $20 easily if you look around.




Because it would cost more? I wouldn't be buying any Keldeo boxes if I had to shell out an additional $20 for a full set of all energies. That's ridiculous.

Firstly, those kids won't buy a product that is all energy. NO DUH!!! Haven't you been reading my posts? These energies are packaged within EXISTING products. How hard is it to INCLUDE 80 energies, 10 of each type, in a box set? They could even include 40, 5 of each type, and to amass a good collection of energy, which is typcially 10 of each type, you would have to buy 2 box sets. It also wouldn't raise the price either. WOTC has no problem doing that. They have a $19.99 product, at MSRP, that has 285 cards in them. They sell 15 card booster packs for $4 each, so that would be $16 for 60 cards there. Did WOTC made a product that is 100% basic lands? If so, I would like a link to the product page for that. I didn't think so.

I can't see why TPCi doesn't do something similar. Do you know why MTG is way more popular than Pokemon? I'm only telling the truth here, but MTG is more accessable than Pokemon TCG. They have a product, built for deckbuilders, and has EVERYTHING in it. You don't have to go through loopholes and you don't have to buy online, and you don't have to spend an extra amount of dollars to get friends and start a league and waste a ton of time.

Here is how I would price things. Box set costing $19.99 without the 80 basic energy pack included. Box set costing $19.99 with the 80 basic energy pack included. How I see it is that energy cards should hold no value, and should be mass distributed and easy to obtain, rather than having to buy online all the time. And yes, I can compare this to MTG, because both games have cards that are a requirement to play the game, and the same model can be used for both games. Even if the price increased, it would be like, what, a buck? Seriously. TnT is charging me $5 for 100 energies, but what TPCi could have done is made a $19.99 box set without energies into a $20.99 box set with energies, either an 80 pack, or a 40 pack, depending on how they feel like doing it.

Seriously, if you are paying $20 for a full set of energies, either:

1. You are paying too much for a full set of energies, or
2. TPCi is putting value to energy cards, which should have NO value at all.
3. You say 80 energies should cost $20, so 25 cents an energy. Theme decks have around 18 energy, or $4.50. You are saying that the non-energy component costs $7.50? I always thought the non-energy component would cost MORE, than that and the energy component would cost LESS.

Energies should cost a cent, and should be more plentiful everywhere. As I have seen so far, is only select locations having them, and not more distributed everywhere, meaning, I have to travel far to get energy, compared to travel not as far to get basic lands.

Even so, I have to travel FAR, like 11 miles, to get to the closest tournament, and at that time, I'm too busy to even attend. Not everybody has free time all day every day you know. Again, with the inaccessibility to this game.

Japan has no problem adding energies into their products, and they do have products which contain all 8 energies at once, and I can't see why the only way to get energies officially, is to buy them in groups of 2's.

The MTG deckbuilder's toolkit has 100 basic lands, in product that has 285 cards total. TnT sells each basic land for an average of 25 cents, which is around the same price of an energy. But yet, they sell the box at $19.99 while my local stores sell it at $24 and some change. But yet, TPCi can't follow something similar. Also Magic people say paying 25 cents for a basic land is a rip off. If you are paying that much for energy, then you are ripping yourself off, but maybe not, considering how inaccessible those basic energies are.

They could also do something as simple as this. They could include 1 of each energy in a blister pack that they release alongside each main set. That would increase the price by 50 cents, because 8 energies should NEVER cost $2, and paying that much would mean you are being ripped off. Or with box sets, they could have 1 of each basic energy for each booster that is included within the box set. 2 boosters, 16 basic energy included. It's that simple.

Or how about this. It may sound stupid, but they could have boosters go back to 11 cards, and in every one of them would be a random basic energy. Get 80 boosters somehow, and you have enough to build any deck, but I would rather they include basic energies in some of their box sets. Note that I never mentioned anything about a box set that is ONLY basic energies. I never said that.

Oh forgot to mention, WOTC had a $35 fat pack, with 8 boosters and 40 basic lands. It went to $40 with the 9th booster and 40 more basic lands. How in the heck would 40 more basic lands, which, according to TnT cost 25 cents, be $5 more expensive, and including that extra boosters, so in theory, the price should increase by $14, but yet, it increased by $5. How does that happen? Because WOTC knows that charging 25 cents for basic lands is a bad idea, and I would think if TPCi made something similar, with a 80 energy pack included in a box set, would increase the price by a couple of bucks max, and maybe 50 cents at a minimum. They won't make something that is $19.99 become $39.99. That would be stupid, because the value is mostly in the non-energy cards, and NOT the energy cards.

Energies SHOULD cost 1 cent. That's their value. So adding an 80 energy pack should cost 80 cents extra on top of the box set's base price. You are basing the price off of troll and toad, who is only looking to making profit to poor saps like me who don't have access to basic energies at a fair price.

 

[baby mario]

Do you know why MTG is way more popular than Pokemon?

The TCG may be more popular than the Pokemon TCG, but most non-TCG people have barely even heard of Magic, while almost everyone knows Pokemon.

With Magic, the TCG is the whole thing. With Pokemon, organised play is a part of marketing for a TCG that is one part of a global franchise involving video games, movies, and merchandise. I'm sick of people comparing them and often wonder, if MTG is sooooo much better, why people are wasting their time complaining about Pokemon when they could be playing it.

 

[kwisdumb]

Email me at kennyatsixprizesdotcom. I should have at least one brick of the professor energy left. They're the newest design and they're all sealed, etc. Send me your address and I'll send it out to you tomorrow.

 

[signofzeta]

The TCG may be more popular than the Pokemon TCG, but most non-TCG people have barely even heard of Magic, while almost everyone knows Pokemon.

With Magic, the TCG is the whole thing. With Pokemon, organised play is a part of marketing for a TCG that is one part of a global franchise involving video games, movies, and merchandise. I'm sick of people comparing them and often wonder, if MTG is sooooo much better, why people are wasting their time complaining about Pokemon when they could be playing it.

Because I play BOTH? I'm giving a suggestion on HOW to improve the TCG. And yes, I'm only comparing the MTG to Pokemon TCG. I've heard of Pokemon players, the video game players who would rather play MTG over Pokemon TCG, hence why MTG is way more popular than Pokemon TCG, even if MTG is not as popular to the Pokemon brand as a whole.

It's such a simple solution to make the game more accessible to new players who are looking to build a deck from scratch. In MTG, the deckbuilder's toolkit is a popular product for people looking to build their first deck from scratch with, and it includes the necessary tools, and even Pokemon Japan has something similar, although it would be 6 half-ish decks, and a few basic energies, and you are meant to mix and match. Why would the international version of the Pokemon TCG not have something similar? That product would grow the game, but I guess you all would be happy if Pokemon TCG was a third place or maybe 4th place TCG behind MTG, Yugioh, and WoW TCG.

Seriously, what's wrong with making the game more accessible to everybody? I buy a MTG fat pack per set, every year, so I get 320 basic lands every year, and it doesn't take that much space in my room. Because their fat packs contain basic lands, I don't have to pay an arm and a leg to travel long distances, or pay tons of cash for shipping just to get something that otherwise should have been close to free.

Both MTG and Pokemon Japan have products that serves a functional purpose, while the international Pokemon TCG has box sets that serves no purpose, and doesn't help grow the game. I mean, look at all those box sets that contain tons of Emerging Powers boosters in them, the ones we had from this year and the last. They served no purpose at all. The aren't an introduction to new players, and they aren't for deckbuilders. All, and I mean 100% of their box sets catered to the collector, and I would rather have them allocate some of them to cater to the deckbuilder, and that means, including basic energies. They release on average, a box set per month, and it wouldn't hurt if at least 2 or 3 of them had basic energies included, and I'm being generous here, because I'd rather them have 6 of 12 box sets include basic energies, and a good amount would be 80, with 10 of each type, and would increase the price by 50 cents, because basic energies shouldn't influence the price.

Also why should it be that only Pokemon Professors have basic energies? It makes no sense. This game is meant to be played anywhere, and not only in stores and stuff like that. Rather than TPCi giving all the energies to the Pokemon Professors, they should distribute them within their tins and box sets well some of the tins and box sets, and then the people with extra can DONATE, because afterall, basic energies should have no value to them, to the leagues. Then anybody who doesn't attend leagues have access to basic energies, while those Pokemon Professors should have enough energies donated from a bunch of people who have extras.

Also don't get me started on basic Darkness and basic Metal energy. In TnT, they cost a lot more than the other 6.

 

[TheRolesWePlay]

Am I the only one who sees a disconnect on the subject.

Let's be honest here, the majority of players on this thread, do not, and will not have problems with basic energy (at least unless a new basic energy is introduced), and those with these issues are new players. These players generally don't know about TnT, and don't have many other options to get energy other than theme decks, which don't always provide enough energy for a whole deck.

Personally a good solve to this would be what Japan does, and include a basic energy in every pack, instead of once every so many sets.

 

[signofzeta]

Am I the only one who sees a disconnect on the subject.

Let's be honest here, the majority of players on this thread, do not, and will not have problems with basic energy (at least unless a new basic energy is introduced), and those with these issues are new players. These players generally don't know about TnT, and don't have many other options to get energy other than theme decks, which don't always provide enough energy for a whole deck.

Personally a good solve to this would be what Japan does, and include a basic energy in every pack, instead of once every so many sets.

That's what I'm getting at. A lot of people here don't get it, because they are from the inside looking out, rather than from the outside looking in.

One of the ways they can solve this is to have 80 basic energies, 10 of each type included in at least 2 of their box sets released every year. Another way to do this is to include an 11th card in the booster pack, which shouldn't drive up the price. Or they could revamp the trainer kit. Rather than 2 30 card decks, it would be 8 30 card decks with energies to match, and the purpose here is to mix and match 2 of the 8 30 card decks to make a 60 card deck. I believe Japan has something like this too.

Ideally, basic energies should cost 1 cent, or maybe 2 cents, no more than that, so if anyone seriously thinks that by adding a pack of 80 energy to an existing box set would drive up the price by $20, then you are delusional.

I've already said that MTG includes basic lands in some of their non precon products, and so does Pokemon TCG in Japan. Yes, I can compare MTG to Pokemon TCG here, because it is the issue of having a card type that is required in each deck, and should cost next to nothing, but one is generous enough to make each product newbie friendly, so that when you buy that product, let's say a fat pack, they can start playing without having to buy something else, while when you buy a Pokemon TCG box set, you have no energies. You have tons of cards and no energies. You can't play. The game becomes stale, and people then buy the cards just to look at, and the game isn't as popular.

 

[Vulpix Yolk]

Put two energy in every pack... Problem solved.

Of course, Pokémon won't do anything unless they are making money of their fanbase.

 

[SD PokeMom]

you're forgetting one very important thing here: every M:tG box/collection/starter you describe is geared towards *players*...which is not necessarily true with PTCG boxed product.

there are MANY consumers who 'buy the cards just to look at' in our game...and very few if any in M:tG. you're comparing apples and oranges: the games have completely different audiences and therefore, marketing/products.

 

[signofzeta]

you're forgetting one very important thing here: every M:tG box/collection/starter you describe is geared towards *players*...which is not necessarily true with PTCG boxed product.

there are MANY consumers who 'buy the cards just to look at' in our game...and very few if any in M:tG. you're comparing apples and oranges: the games have completely different audiences and therefore, marketing/products.

You know that if a box set has 80 basic energies with minimal price increase to the existing box set, it caters to both the collectors and new players, while not including the 80 basic energy would only cater to the collectors, and would turn would be players into collectors right?

Perhaps they only cater to the collectors because the collectors were players at one point, who gave up on playing because getting access to a huge stock of basic energy is much more of a hassle than what it's worth.

I have a sizable collection of pokemon cards, but I couldn't do anything with them, because I don't have any basic energies to build a deck with. So a collector won't become a player, and a new player will most likely become a collector, because the game is so inaccessible to new players compared to MTG and Pokemon TCG in Japan.

You also forget that TPCi release on average 12 box sets a year. I don't think it is fair that 12 are geared towards collectors. I think at least 2 and at most 6 should be geared towards players.

Hey guess what, Magic fat packs. They are mostly geared towards collectors, but serves a dual purpose in that it is also for the player. I buy fat packs for collecting purposes, but I can have the option to use it to play with, because it has basic lands. Of the many box sets that TPCi releases, I have NO option but to let the cards collect dust, because it can never be used.

In one of my posts, I think I wanted someone to name consequences that including basic energies in some boxed products might entail. I have yet to see one logical consequence. Bumping the box set prices up by $20 is not a logical consequence. I can only see upsides in doing this, and no downsides.

 

[Charranitar]

For $26.10 you can get 15 of every Basic Energy card, which will be enough to build pretty much every deck. Once you by these, they can last you your entirety of playing Pokemon. Have you checked into this option before? Seems to be exactly what you're looking for.

Edit: Here is the product you're directly looking for. http://trollandtoad.com/p392958.html

 

[BJJ763]

You assume adding the energy cards would not much.

Shipping the product just got more expensive. Packaging the energy is not free.

Adding a basic energy to every pack: Either replace a common with a basic energy which most people would not want - either they already have them or they are not interested in them; or increase the number of cards in a pack: increase the wrapper size, increase the box size, and increase shipping costs

League, theme decks and trading are your best options. Very few decks are going to run more than 2 types anyways, just mix and match theme decks.

 

[Ziggmiceter]

I don't understand why you can't buy a freaking Theme Deck.

 

[ZeroWing]

Plenty of ebay sellers have bulk energy for cheap. I tell all my new parents that decide to start building decks seriously to hit up ebay and get their energy stock.

I also, give out the energy that they give us in the Professor store, but I have a big league and it is not enough...so, ebay:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trk...w=pokemon+basic+energy+lot&_sacat=0&_from=R40

 

[signofzeta]

I don't understand why you can't buy a freaking Theme Deck.

Fine, give me a theme deck, or any official product that contains all 8 energy types all at once. Oh sorry, it doesn't exist.

The increased shipping cost is also not a factor either. WOTC sells MTG 15 card booster packs for the same price that TPCi sells 10 card booster packs. It isn't like the cardboard for MTG cards cost less than the cardboard for Pokemon cards. So what difference does it make if they add an 11th card. EX Power Keepers booster packs, I think costed $3.99 Diamond and Pearl booster packs cost $3.99. How could that be, doesn't one have 9 cards and the other have 10 cards? How is that possible?

Even so, I mentioned that they could include a pack of 80 energies, 10 of each, into 1 or 2 of their 12 box sets the release annually. It isn't that hard to do. If you seriously think that because of the energies, the price of the product increases by $20, then you are sadly delusional. I never happened with MTG, and the point still stands. It doesn't matter what caters to what target audience. I also see some Pokemon TCG Japanese products that contain more than 3 energy types at once, and is meant to be a start of a collection that could also be used for playing.

 

[Charranitar]

If you can't afford to pay the $30 or whatever it would be to just buy all of the Basic Energy cards that you need, how are you going to be able to afford cards like Pokemon Catcher, Keldeo, Mewtwo, etc. that you might need for competitive play?

And if you're not planning on playing in organized tournaments, than just proxying the cards is always an option.

 

[signofzeta]

If you can't afford to pay the $30 or whatever it would be to just buy all of the Basic Energy cards that you need, how are you going to be able to afford cards like Pokemon Catcher, Keldeo, Mewtwo, etc. that you might need for competitive play?

And if you're not planning on playing in organized tournaments, than just proxying the cards is always an option.

Yeah, making decks for fun is competitive play, yeah, ha ha, that's right. If you have to resort to buying online, and proxying stuff, then it goes to show that the game really needs a better way to distribute basic energies. Heck, why not just proxy everything while we're at it.

The only way to get basic energies is via theme decks. Even so, the more recent available theme decks don't have an even distribution of energy. Take metal energy for example. Only furious knights has it, from all the theme decks from the past year. And within, there are only 6 metal energies. Not enough to build a metal themed deck. As such, THEME DECKS DON'T WORK. They don't give you enough energy of each kind without having to buy at least 6 of them, which is a bad way to get basic energy.

I get it now, you just don't want the game to grow, yeah, that's it. You love this TCG to live in the shadow of Magic and Yugioh. It's sad, but common cards are more common than energy cards. Say what you will, but if basic energy are all available in certain locations and not others, unlike magic's basic lands where you can just basically find them anywhere, then there is seriously something wrong. It is a dumb model that someone would have to buy from outside their home city or make fake versions of the cards that are totally required to play the game.

As I said before, there is absolutely no consequence in including 80 basic energies in some of their box sets or tins. The counterarguments I hear are all nonsense, because as I said before, another company, by the name of Wizards of the Coast, can make a 285 card product for $19.99, with 100 basic lands, or include 40 extra lands and one more booster in their fat pack and only increase the price by $5. They have no problem with it, and I don't see why TPCi should be any different, because it isn't. Comparing a magic card, and Pokemon card, they are made the same way, probably printed in the same factory.

I feel like I'm wasting my time here, knowing that everybody here, save a few, don't have the perspective of the outside looking in. Hence, the game will never grow, and in my city, isn't as popular as Magic, Yugioh, and WoW TCG, reasoning being that the other 3 games are much more easily accessible to new players and more diverse in how new players should handle the product, while Pokemon TCG is just, hey, buy a theme deck, and you start there. That was what Magic used to be, until it became better with more product options for beginners.

 

[psychup2034]

I don't see why TPCi should be any different.

Well, there's your problem! I'm glad that I'm able to help you identify it. :lol:

you're forgetting one very important thing here: every M:tG box/collection/starter you describe is geared towards *players*...which is not necessarily true with PTCG boxed product.

there are MANY consumers who 'buy the cards just to look at' in our game...and very few if any in M:tG. you're comparing apples and oranges: the games have completely different audiences and therefore, marketing/products.

 

[Nintendan]

there are MANY consumers who 'buy the cards just to look at' in our game...and very few if any in M:tG. you're comparing apples and oranges: the games have completely different audiences and therefore, marketing/products.

Exactly. This has been the case since the beginning of the game.
Remember when we all asked our parents to buy us cards even though we didn't (know how to) play them?

 

[FunnyBear]

I think OP is right, there probably is enough demand for some sort of product. Fortunately, as many have pointed out, the secondary market has fulfilled this need nicely with both T&T and ebay featuring lots of mixed energy, not to mention the Professor store item. Still, what would be the harm in offering the Professor store item to the public through the league system? If TOs could order the item at a price as a service to the player base, it would solve a need and it wouldn't require much additional on P!P's part.