next modified format: no special enegies?
- Thread starter logan1975
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scramble would expire eventually (unless the user only has 1 prize left...)
UzumakiNaruto
New Member
Umm that CDRE is kinda wack.
Rai
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Most of people's suggestions frankly are more then a bit off kilter.
You WANT a format with special energies in it that provide more then one energy. It's just like how you WANT a format with rare candy.
Players should be given incentive to take risks with big stage 2 pokemon that have expensive energy costs--Thus we give them the option of using special energies if they are willing to make sacrifices. If we don't give them the ability to attack with stage 2s, no one will play them, and the options in the game decrease from a variety of cards to only quick stage 1s or basics. We'll basically degrade into Yu-gi-oh, which has never rewarded players for playing the way designers intended.
As for those sacrifices... Yes, they (mostly) make up for the card's benefits.
Scramble only works if you're losing in prizes. While you can argue that someone is winning in prize count, but going to lose the actual match due to weaker set up... What happens when time is called? Prizes are looked at, and that's it. Not set up. Prizes. That's an obvious indicator that prize count should reflect how players are doing.
DRE sacrifices your ability to deal damage. It weakens damage spread to the point of unusability. So really, it's only going to be used on cards that only hit one pokemon at a time, or its damage lowering makes the attack inefficient.
Boost is lost at the end of the turn, and provides only colorless energy when most cards need at least one specific color to use an attack.
See the downsides to each of them?
Now, what about the benefits? Scramble makes it so players who lag in set up don't automatically lose. Why should a magmortar deck in a mirror match have games determined by who goes first, and matches become a matter of "Attach to Magmortar, Flame Blast. GG" because the damage that the unlucky player deals is unable to compensate for the healing and constant damage the lucky player deals? Scramble opens up recoveries from being screwed early on. DRE serves a similar purpose, making attacks possible that weren't earlier. People praise Claydol for making decks possible by giving players a hand to play with; I say Special Energies are just as vital by giving players attacks to use.
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Now, the real reason we should go "Yay, special energies will (most likely) be different next format!" is because of tricks that seem overpowered due to the game's balance changing dramatically in Diamond/Pearl. Before Diamond/Pearl, not many powerful pokemon could make use of DRE or Scramble (The big hitters were all EX pokemon, which couldn't receive those cards). Now though, the big hitters are stage 2 pokemon who are not LV.X pokemon. Cards that were as powerful as Gallade in the EX generation had restrictions on them; Gallade has NONE except that it's a stage 2, but happens to have an amazing evolution line to make up for this.
A modification to special energies to better fit the power balance would keep the game stable rather then abuseable. LV.X pokemon are difficult to play for instance, unlike EX pokemon. No Rare Candy into a LV.X for example. Thus, the requirement of a card being LV.X before receiving DRE would remove the major power balance issue: Powerful attacks being performed too early for protective action, while keeping them possible for recoveries.
Scramble absolutely should stay, as the prize requirement requires careful moves to be taken to avoid being useless. Scramble's actually worse now then it used to be. Formerlly, you could play a deck and let your opponent have 1 prize, you have 2 prizes left. Scramble. KO their EX. You just won on prizes. You can't win on Prizes now unless you KO multiple Pokemon at once--a task that takes significant set up to pull off and is not easily abusable by every deck out there, thus not broken.
No one complains about Boost right now because of the new energy requirements and its forced discard at end of turn, thus its slightly more then reasonable benefits are counterbalanced with quite reasonable drawbacks..
...Rather then going "yay, let's kill possibilities!" or "Yay, let's tack on pointless damage, which won't matter because it doesn't address current problems!", you ought to dream of a card that DOES solve the problems in our metagame. And believe me, you won't be calling Scramble too broken once we get Groudon DP5 and other powerful basics which move at a pace so brisk, it's almost suicide to try and dream of beating them with only one energy attach per turn.
Time for Pain
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next format Kriketune is BDIF!
ninetales1234
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Remember those days before SS and DX came out? Those were some fun days. It may be nice to return to them for a while...
I predict Scramble will be reprinted and probably DRE too.
I predict Scramble will be reprinted and probably DRE too.
DarkLordSigma
Member
If we are to see new special energies in the future, I wouldn't mind seeing special forms of all the basic energy cards, not unlike how the original Dark and Metal energies were. I havn't given much thought as to what the energies would do specifically, but I'll leave that to the people who make the cards.
We'll get a new DRE or DCE replacement soon, it's just not Pokemon without 'em. Although, Groudon, Kyogre, Togekiss, Weavile, Typhlo/Blaze will be big before the reprints. I say eeveelutions does good next format, as T3 Glaceon X doesn't need DRE and Multi is still in the format.
People complained about this before SS/DX, it's just a matter of time and maybe cities will be played W/O DRE/Scramble. I bet the "Intense Fight in the Destroyed Sky" block will RP DRE.
People complained about this before SS/DX, it's just a matter of time and maybe cities will be played W/O DRE/Scramble. I bet the "Intense Fight in the Destroyed Sky" block will RP DRE.
I hope someone reads this that has some control over cards reprinted. Scramble Energy is one of the most skillful cards in the history of Pokemon. It allows for comebacks and decks to be created based around it. Many opponents have issues dealing with it and it allows players to make several amazing plays. I will be extremely dissapointed if Scramble is not reprinted. I don't care about Double Rainbow Energy, if it's between Scramble and DRE, I'm picking Scramble anyday of the week.
Scramble is much more unfair than skill based.
It's a good Idea to give the losing player a chance to comeback, but Scramble is just overpowered.
I don't dryw anythink good at my starting hand but can attack fast, when i do, my opponent will scramble and
kill my only strong pkmn, if i don't... yeah
Scamble is too heavy exploitable and should be gone forever hopefully.
It's a good Idea to give the losing player a chance to comeback, but Scramble is just overpowered.
I don't dryw anythink good at my starting hand but can attack fast, when i do, my opponent will scramble and
kill my only strong pkmn, if i don't... yeah
Scamble is too heavy exploitable and should be gone forever hopefully.
manicgiraffe
New Member
How about a DRE that once attached can't be discarded by the owner? As with Boost it can't be used to retreat, but it also can't be used as part of a discarding attack. Would that pacify the DRE haters?
Most of the current suggestions are just too long winded. Have a look at existing energy, there's only so much text PCL are willing to put on a card.
MG
Most of the current suggestions are just too long winded. Have a look at existing energy, there's only so much text PCL are willing to put on a card.
MG
I agree totally here. I'll go ahead and voice the same opinion actually. PLEASE, if someone who reads this has any control over the game, consider reprinting Scramble Energy. We've already been down this road before. When Rocket's Admin. wasn't reprinted, everyone had to suffer an entire season in which we had no form of decent hand disruption... one of the most skillful aspects of this game. We've seen a bunch of skillful cards just disappear (Rainbow Energy, Pow! Hand Extension, Pokemon Reversal, etc.), don't let Scramble Energy go.
Just because you can't figure a way around an opponent abusing Scramble Energy doesn't mean others haven't. You sound like you're whining about Scramble Energy in the same way I've heard people whine about tons of other things: "It's so unfair when my opponent uses a Rocket's Admin. and gives me only 2 cards to work with," "All he does is use Disable from the second turn on and shut down my trainers... it's not fair," "All she did was make me knock out Fossils while her Cursed Stone and Desert Ruins killed everything I had; this game is stupid!"
While I'll accept that Scramble Energy is frustrating to go against, your "problems" have nothing to do with the card at all. How can you expect to win games if you're not using a deck that gives you good starts? And you can't blame Scramble Energy if you haven't figured out that you should put CG Dugtrio in your deck (responding to your second "problem").
Scramble Energy gives decks that don't have energy acceleration a chance. Without it, two things will saturate the format: decks that have energy acceleration and T2 decks. How many cards have energy acceleration right now? Let's see... like 4 or 5 good ones? That cuts out sooo many options of what to run that it's not even funny. In fact, just for the sake of actually being able to use more cards in a tournament, I'd almost like to see DRE get reprinted as well. Almost. I don't because I think it'll be the only thing to truly silence Gardilade decks.
Without at least Scramble Energy, the next format will be pretty lame. If I show up at a tournament to see a bunch of GrouDONK and Quicketune decks running around, I might never come back. Sadly, this may be the case, as PUI/POP have constantly neglected to reprint cards that our format would benefit from,
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I really get your point but there will be no t2 format even without dre / scramnble.
A situation i came across quite often against magmortar is that i had the choice of either killing their starter and get a scramble / double scramble punch in the face as a result, or I try to outplay it, giving mortar time to load himself manually.
Same with Empoleon, and Dugtrio will be gone next season (and pls don't tell me about the metal fossil stage 2, whatever his name is)
vanderbilt_grad
New Member
In the next set
Anyway I agree that Scramble and DRE make decks without energy acceleration playable ... but the problem is that they work in decks WITH energy accelration now too. Magmortar was a good example using Blaziken or Typhlosion to speed fire energy attachment AND running Scramble. Leafeon lv X will let you attach 2 or even 3 Scrambles / DREs in one turn! IMHO that's where Scramble breaks now. It's OK in decks without the accel, but it's nuts in decks that have both.
I'm concerned about cards like Togekiss and maybe Regirock becoming even more played without the DREs and Scrambles ... but flipside is that it seems like every single new set is coming out with cards that accelerate energy either by power or by attack. If the trend continues maybe you will not be quite so limited in your deck choices.
Anyway I agree that Scramble and DRE make decks without energy acceleration playable ... but the problem is that they work in decks WITH energy accelration now too. Magmortar was a good example using Blaziken or Typhlosion to speed fire energy attachment AND running Scramble. Leafeon lv X will let you attach 2 or even 3 Scrambles / DREs in one turn! IMHO that's where Scramble breaks now. It's OK in decks without the accel, but it's nuts in decks that have both.
I'm concerned about cards like Togekiss and maybe Regirock becoming even more played without the DREs and Scrambles ... but flipside is that it seems like every single new set is coming out with cards that accelerate energy either by power or by attack. If the trend continues maybe you will not be quite so limited in your deck choices.
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