Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

No Claydol or Uxie!?!

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Ninjask88 said:
No I didnt run Dodrio with those decks. I was just thinking about it with this one I will be using. Yes I do watn some draw power but I dont want to have to use the smae cards that everyone uses. As far as I am concerned I dont think they are necessary because they are not in any Starter decks and they basically supply you with the cards necessary to win. Also yes I do run those supporters because I do find them to be crucial to the game because they do come in the Starter deck so they are crucial to gameplay.
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Palkia, Dusknoir, and Charizard LvX don't come in starter decks either though... Didn't you just say you used those?

And even without Dodrio, look at Slowking. He too is inferior to Claydol. Again, you admit to using him. Baby Mario makes a very very good point that you don't seem willing to see.
 
ShuckleLVX said:
Palkia, Dusknoir, and Charizard LvX don't come in starter decks either though... Didn't you just say you used those?

And even without Dodrio, look at Slowking. He too is inferior to Claydol. Again, you admit to using him. Baby Mario makes a very very good point that you don't seem willing to see.
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You are true but he point I am trying to make with my decks are that there are hundreds of cards to use and you dont have to use the same exact ones in every single deck to make it win. The reason being for the supporters and trainers is because there arent very many of them that are legal to us in this format.

The game has many cards to make every person have an interesting deck but it seemslike everyone ones strategy is to bring up the opponents weak bench Pokemon then KO it and then go Beast against Beast then whoever takes te main card out first is the winner. I am looking to change this so that every card that comes up is a potential threat, and not to have some wea pokemon laying on my bench when I could be using a different card that isnt as weak. SF Dusknoir is one example that I will use to draw cards.

I am not saying that cards like Uxie and Claydol are bad cards I am saying taht people rely on these 2 cards way too much even though there are many others that can be used. Sure they might not be as good but they work.

Yes Palkia, Dusknoir, and Charizard Level X are not in starter decks although Palkia is... But those card arent use any where near as much as Claydol and Uxie. I will also bet that the strategies I used are very unique and much different then what other people would be using them for.
 
the only time you will win with decks like those is if you are battling against people with similar decks.. i don't play claydol in any of my decks, but uxie is a must to making it easier to win. i mean, when you have a hand with almost nothing but a roseannes, wouldn't it be nice to get an uxie, instead of just grabbing 2 pokemon and blindly waiting until you get an evo? i mean the only way this could work is if you ran 4 pachirisu and 2 phione from MD. then you could set up.

BUT IT WOULD BE 10X SLOWER THAN JUST USING UXIE/CLAYDOL!

here are some things that could work

chatot instead of uxie. it would waste an attack, but you would get better cards

sableye SF/spiritomb PA instead of claydol. you wouldnt be able to draw into what you wanted, but you could get all your evos out.
 
Ninjask88 said:
You are true but he point I am trying to make with my decks are that there are hundreds of cards to use and you dont have to use the same exact ones in every single deck to make it win. The reason being for the supporters and trainers is because there arent very many of them that are legal to us in this format.

The game has many cards to make every person have an interesting deck but it seemslike everyone ones strategy is to bring up the opponents weak bench Pokemon then KO it and then go Beast against Beast then whoever takes te main card out first is the winner. I am looking to change this so that every card that comes up is a potential threat, and not to have some wea pokemon laying on my bench when I could be using a different card that isnt as weak. SF Dusknoir is one example that I will use to draw cards.

I am not saying that cards like Uxie and Claydol are bad cards I am saying taht people rely on these 2 cards way too much even though there are many others that can be used. Sure they might not be as good but they work.

Yes Palkia, Dusknoir, and Charizard Level X are not in starter decks although Palkia is... But those card arent use any where near as much as Claydol and Uxie. I will also bet that the strategies I used are very unique and much different then what other people would be using them for.
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In really competitive play, "Not as good" is not good enough. You are welcome to win whatever local events you want with your hodge-podge decks, but I call dibs on the "I told you so"'s when you come back from States and Regionals with 2-X as your best record without these staple cards.
 
Ninjask88 said:
Yes Palkia, Dusknoir, and Charizard Level X are not in starter decks although Palkia is... But those card arent use any where near as much as Claydol and Uxie. I will also bet that the strategies I used are very unique and much different then what other people would be using them for.
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How about Rare Candy? I guess you don't use that either.

Oh wait . . .

Ninjask88 said:
The current deck has a
4-2-3-1 Dusknoir with one DP one SF one Promo and the other is the Level X
2-1-2 Metagross with one SV and one LA
1-0-1 Nidoqueen
1-1 Dodrio
2-2 Bronzong
Some other Pokemon too but undecided.
4 Rare Candies
and some trainer/supporters and energies.
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Well, there is a VERY common card that people rely on just as much (if not more) than Claydol and Uxie. It also doesn't come in any starter decks.

See, you are already using some staple, non-Starter deck cards. Do yourself a favour and try out some of the others.
 
Ninjask88, you are the epitome of hypocrisy.
Are you posting just to try to stir up a big commotion?

First of all, you are not posting because you want help. You are posting because you are whining.
This is what I've concluded.
a) You cannot fork out $15 to get a Claydol or Uxie
b) You're too lazy to go to a local PokeLeague to get them for free

You've already stated you win tournaments without them. So what help do you need since your decks are incredible.
So what are you trying to say in this thread? We should all stop using Claydols and Uxies, right? You want originality?

Here is my suggestion.

http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?t=113232

Read that through, and DO NOT use any of those cards listed.
Because I guarantee you every one of those cards are used VASTLY in all of the decks you will face in any tournament, or even recreational league play. So double check that your deck list doesn't contain any of those.

Did you know Nidoqueen is very commonly used, especially with Gengar?
I mean that's not original at all. Neither is Dusknoir. It used to be a popular archtype. Kind of dying now, but it's been used. Old stuff.

You are placing inferior cards in your build just so you can say, "Hey! I'm original!"
It makes absolutely no sense.

Honestly, the only point of your thread is to bash on people using Uxie or Claydol. I don't know why. But that's what your motive is. I mean, possibly, maybe, you were storming through this tournament of yours, then you finally faced someone with a Claydol / Uxie deck, and then lost. Then you grew this hatred on them, because you don't have access to those cards. I don't know... I don't want to throw any assumptions.

Either way, stop "Trolling."


Read this too.
http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?t=113997

This guy, Shen, is complaining about the luck of the game.
You are complaining about how the game has no luck, and it's all drawing the exact cards you need.
You two are like... complete opposites. You two should Poke Battle it out.
 
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Will you guys lay off him. This isn't a topic about weather or not Claydol and Uxie are good cards. But rather coming up with a deck that doesn't need them, I don't see how the why is important. If he doesn't want to play them let him.

I've done it before to, I enjoy playing fun league decks that don't use them. Why becuase a majority of my league kids don't have them and I really don't need an ego boost by walking in there and stomping on them. I instead prefer to play decks they might have access to. Below is what I played with out Claydol or Uxie

Scizor/Cherrium
Blissey
Blissey/Stage 1

Back to back posts merged. The following information has been added:

AzNightmare said:
Did you know Nidoqueen is very commonly used, especially with Gengar?I mean that's not original at all. Neither is Dusknoir. It used to be a popular archtype. Kind of dying now, but it's been used. Old stuff.
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This is such horrible argument, you could do this with any card. The difference between Claydol and Nidoqueen is also about $20
 
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I've read this thread post for post, and I am extremly angred at what I've seen here. Its pretty redickulus to completly flip at this guy simply because he doesn't want to use what everyone else is using. And I agree with him. Its bad for the TCG to have 2 cards that every deck must have. That's kind of crazy. I do reconize the benefit that these cards add to decks. But its sad that someone says "no, I want to make an attempt at doing somthing else" and this is the type of response he gets. He didn't make this thread because he likes to lose, if that were the case he'd enter the tourneys with a starter deck. Saying that you don't want to play with claydol or uxie does not = I want to lose. He asked what could be suitable replacement for such cards. And to the people saying "well he's only saying this because he doesent have the cards" my rebuttle to that is, so? Were talking about the 2 most expenive non lv.X cards. So the dude may not have them, big deal. He asked what might be suitable replacements. He didn't ask for for a online beatdown, if that's what he wanted, he would have named the thread "(leave insult here)" But to the creator of this thread, you are being a little stubborn. Some people did offer some polite soulotions and you just said no. Also not cool. But I guess id be a little stubborn after reading the majority of posts in this thread. RA, I really hope you close this thread. This is just a repeat of ghetto overlords thread on expert belt.

P.s (to the creator of the thread, if your a "She" maa bad.)
 
Honestly, I don't care if he has the cards or not. Infact,
I don't even have the cards. Which is why I'm so eagar to get them at the Poke League.
The game is broken with the fact that this one card named Claydol is being overused everywhere.
But it's broken, and it's a good card.

But my best deck doesn't even use it. So I really don't care. But I'm not gonna go around and tell people I'm so original
just because I'm not using them. And the other silly thing is, to not use them just for the sake of not using them.
If your deck doesn't use them because it's better that way, then go ahead. But to say you don't want to use them just because... and then list a bunch of inferior alternatives... it makes no sense whatsoever.
 
If someone says 'I don't have Claydols or Uxies, can you help me to build a deck without them?', they will likely get a sympathetic response. If they say, 'I would like to try some decks that don't use Claydol and Uxie', they will probably get a lot of help.

If someone says . . .

I hate how everyone uses Claydols and Uxies
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The cards themselves I dont hate I just dont like how everyone uses them because it is annoying that people think they have to have it in their deck.
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I am not being stubborn I am just trying to reinvent this card game
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Then they are making an implied attack on players who DO use those cards, so it isn't surprising when people defend/explain their use. It just comes off as arrogant . . . like they are re-inventing the game with their originality, while the rest of us are just blind sheep.
 
jo3bro said:
I've read this thread post for post, and I am extremly angred at what I've seen here. Its pretty redickulus to completly flip at this guy simply because he doesn't want to use what everyone else is using. And I agree with him. Its bad for the TCG to have 2 cards that every deck must have. That's kind of crazy. I do reconize the benefit that these cards add to decks. But its sad that someone says "no, I want to make an attempt at doing somthing else" and this is the type of response he gets. He didn't make this thread because he likes to lose, if that were the case he'd enter the tourneys with a starter deck. Saying that you don't want to play with claydol or uxie does not = I want to lose. He asked what could be suitable replacement for such cards. And to the people saying "well he's only saying this because he doesent have the cards" my rebuttle to that is, so? Were talking about the 2 most expenive non lv.X cards. So the dude may not have them, big deal. He asked what might be suitable replacements. He didn't ask for for a online beatdown, if that's what he wanted, he would have named the thread "(leave insult here)" But to the creator of this thread, you are being a little stubborn. Some people did offer some polite soulotions and you just said no. Also not cool. But I guess id be a little stubborn after reading the majority of posts in this thread. RA, I really hope you close this thread. This is just a repeat of ghetto overlords thread on expert belt.

P.s (to the creator of the thread, if your a "She" maa bad.)
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No it is a guy and I like how you see whta I am trying to get at here. I tried not being harsh to people who have actually helped me but I am not making and SP deck and one person even gave me a deck list to try of a Scizor deck. I am thankful for the people who actually help me with what situation I am getting at.

AzNightmare said:
Honestly, I don't care if he has the cards or not. Infact,
I don't even have the cards. Which is why I'm so eagar to get them at the Poke League.
The game is broken with the fact that this one card named Claydol is being overused everywhere.
But it's broken, and it's a good card.

But my best deck doesn't even use it. So I really don't care. But I'm not gonna go around and tell people I'm so original
just because I'm not using them. And the other silly thing is, to not use them just for the sake of not using them.
If your deck doesn't use them because it's better that way, then go ahead. But to say you don't want to use them just because... and then list a bunch of inferior alternatives... it makes no sense whatsoever.
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I do believe I never said my decks are original becasue I dont use these cards. I am simply saying that there are alternative ways to make a deck work and not ahving to use the same card in every deck even if it is just a sitting duck out in the deck.
baby mario said:
If someone says 'I don't have Claydols or Uxies, can you help me to build a deck without them?', they will likely get a sympathetic response. If they say, 'I would like to try some decks that don't use Claydol and Uxie', they will probably get a lot of help.

If someone says . . .






Then they are making an implied attack on players who DO use those cards, so it isn't surprising when people defend/explain their use. It just comes off as arrogant . . . like they are re-inventing the game with their originality, while the rest of us are just blind sheep.
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Yet again I never said I was original, but I am saying that creativity is good and that going out there adn coming up with their own ideas is better than just going like everyone uses this card so i need it in a deck and everyone is using this deck so I need to use it in order to win.
 
Not Sure if you got this MEssage was on Page 2.
I like What Jo3Bro Said Hes 100% correct, This is not a thread to bash him for not using uxie's and Claydol's And I Do not like alot of the way people think here. I noticed along with my Deck Post even had details on how it will work, they Bash Alot of Deck's and Statements just Because it doesnt involve "Flygon/Gengar/Palkia/Dialga/Claydol or the Current MetaGame. They were telling me id get destroyed by Bibarel Mismagnius.... yea... idk where they are playing but my Meta game is definatly not Bibarel. Also told me because i ddint run 4 bebe's My deck would be inconsistant. Technically i have 6 Bebe;'s Because i run Porygon which happens to use the Supporter in Play. Anyway enough ranting.

Here were my Ideas If you Missed them.

Actually although You Guys are 100% Correct a Deck with Claydol/Uxie will most likely Function better Then one without. However their are Ton's Of engines to Use which i prefer to COMBO with a 1-1 Claydol to make it even stronger however you do not have to.
Kayle Although your First Statement I liked i do not agree with this one "You can't come here, ask us how to make a deck given crazy restrictions, and then when we TRY to help you, say "No". Which you just did."

"what should I use in my deck since I will not be running any of those cards." He doesnt want our opinions on ClayDol and uxie, What he wants is Deck's. Its His Funeral at least try to throw him a Shovel.

Here are some Examples of Card's That can do well in this Series Without Claydol.
Snorlax/Snorlax Lvl X - Draw Card's until you have 6 in your hand then Snorlax is now asleep WHich Comboes with Snorlax Very well. Sitting with 130 Hp, Super Effective to Flygon, 50 damage for 2 Colorless, and can Heal itself,

Happiny/Blissey You May Take as many cards in your Hand up to the Amount of Energy Attached to Blissey and put them on top of your Deck, Shuffle and Draw That many.
Sitting at 120 HP, Super Effective to Flygon, 2 Energies For a Energy Retreiever and 50+. Can Combo with Alot of Pokemon and Trainer's. Like DarkRai/Arcanine-Energy Link + Another Pokemon.

Sableye/Evoluter Search Your Deck for a Supporter Card Discard it and use the Supporter Card's Effect.
With 60 Hp, 1 Dark 50+ PP/Snow Point/ExpertBelt/Plus Power.

4 Felicities/4 VS Seeker/Call Energy Intense Draw Power Combined With Call can Get you Set up Extremely Fast Especially with QuickBall/Luxury Ball.

FrossLass/(Any Pokemon) one During your Turn When you play FrossLass From your Hand Choose 1 Crd from your Deck and Put it into your Hand.

Jirachi/Lucky Egg/Ball Engine/Volkner Energy Basically Use Jirachi to Search Your Deck
For Any Card and when it dies Refill your Hand.

If you Would Like me to make you a Custom Deck Send me an Email at [email protected] if not I hope these Suggestions have Helped.
 
Question to OP:

Have you ever tried Uxie or Claydol in your deck(s)? If not, try it for a few days. Then tell me what you think.
 
The question is what cards substitute Claydol and Uxie to a degree where it can be feasible. Let's try and stay civilized, guys.

Anyhow, Volkner's, Felicity's Drawing and Sableye are your best bets. If you have no Uxie, you need to substitute it with a quick way to get Supporters or a quick way to substitute for a Supporter.

Decks that don't apply Uxie or Claydol to a huge extent, and with variants I've seen successfully run are Tyranitar and Gyarados. Both of them rely on Sableye to grab early supporters, followed by Volkners, Felicity's or both to discard and draw. Since you will be doing alot of discarding if you opt not to pick Claydol or Uxie, you will need to run with a deck that runs on the discard pile. Pokemon that draw energy from the Discard Pile or Pokemon that work on retrieving discarded objects are generally the best ones that can run without Claydol or Uxie and have a strong supporter engine. The upside is that a Supporter Engine cannot be locked; the downside is that they're turn heavy (1 Supporter per turn + Sableye's Impersonate is an attack).

The next feasible engine is one that's not used as often, but it's the Soviet Engine. The Soviet Engine revolves around a Supporter fetching Pokemon, such as Staraptor FB Lvl. X or Cyrus' Conspiracy. Despite Staraptor being a lvl. X, it is a fairly cheap card given there is not a huge demand for it. Generally the focus of the Soviet Engine is that you get to use two supporters per turn via Porygon2's Download Poke-Power. The problem is that Porygon2 is generally weak against Shadow Rooms from Gengar, and their attack is atrocious. Many run the Soviet Engine primarily in tank decks or in Porygon2 decks. The upside is that other than drawing, Soviet Engine can take on the form of whatever Supporter it downloads; the downside is that it's even easier to kill than Claydol, and once you run out of Supporters, you're out of steam.

The final feasible alternative is the Fishing Engine. Using a large number of Great Balls, Dusk Balls, Quick Balls, Poke Balls and a huge plethora of Drawers, Pokedexes and Supporters, you are given the ability to 'topdeck' like crazy, working on (favourable) probability of drawing what you want to be able to get what you need. This is primarily in Scizor/Cherrim, as the deck needs to function without using any Poke-Powers. The effectiveness of a Fishing Engine varies game-per-game, so it's the riskiest of the three alternatives, but is very effective in use with swarm decks. The upside is that it can be very fast and highly effective, burning through your deck like mad within the first few turns; the downside is the 'can' and the fact that this usually only happens in the first few turns - by then it runs out of steam.

The reason why people opt to choose Claydol and Uxie over alternatives is because most decks do better with them. They are very consistent, and in terms of per-card effectiveness, are the highest. A Claydol + Uxie engine generally only requires 5 card spaces (2-2 Claydol and 1 Uxie), and all the cards are searchable.
 
Garch said:
Question to OP:

Have you ever tried Uxie or Claydol in your deck(s)? If not, try it for a few days. Then tell me what you think.
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Yes I have and i just dont like them sitting there on my bench waiting to be sniped or dragged out and what do you know i am out of the one card needed to draw other cards. Although I will say that they help bring out the cards taht you need but if they bring out a warp point early on and i only have a stage 1 and a claydol on my second turn I am done for.

To ShiftingSky and jjkkl thank you for helping me out. The decks that you suggested Sky I dont particularly like except for the frosslas one. And to jjkkl I like the idea of the fishing engine and I do have a Staraptor that I sometimes use because it has a free retreat cost and can actually put up a fight in any deck since it is colorless and can do 70 dagame or use whirlwind to have your opponent retreat.
 
Ninjask88 said:
Yes I have and i just dont like them sitting there on my bench waiting to be sniped or dragged out and what do you know i am out of the one card needed to draw other cards. Although I will say that they help bring out the cards taht you need but if they bring out a warp point early on and i only have a stage 1 and a claydol on my second turn I am done for.

To ShiftingSky and jjkkl thank you for helping me out. The decks that you suggested Sky I dont particularly like except for the frosslas one. And to jjkkl I like the idea of the fishing engine and I do have a Staraptor that I sometimes use because it has a free retreat cost and can actually put up a fight in any deck since it is colorless and can do 70 dagame or use whirlwind to have your opponent retreat.
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Yes, instead you rely on all your draws being lucky top decks. Trust me on this. You will NEVER win a high level event with this kind of ignorant attitude. You can be creative WITH Claydol. Decks use it because it gives them a way to have consistency. With out consistency, you may as well just flip a coin before each battle and decide the outcome on that. There is being different and original, and then there is being stupid. You sir, are being stupid. I'm not saying that you ARE stupid, but what you're doing is stupid. Only bad players build decks with cards that were never ment to be competitive. You can't seriously think that ALL cards ever printed were meant to played competetivly?

Do you have RS or appr? I would very much like to battel you sometime. I would like to see how your deck stands up to a real competetive deck... not the below average junk you seem to be facing at your local tourneys.
 
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