Scipio
New Member
So it is impossible to have a T1 Donphan 90% of the time (Or T2 if the Donphan player starts) but you will always have your T2 Ursaring + Unown + DCE + Claydol + Dusknoir on the field?
Myerp...
Ursaring Prime - Under estamated?
- Thread starter BlackBrock
- Start date
So it is impossible to have a T1 Donphan 90% of the time (Or T2 if the Donphan player starts) but you will always have your T2 Ursaring + Unown + DCE + Claydol + Dusknoir on the field?
Myerp...
Kayle
Active Member
derp derp derp.
Ursaring doesn't heal. If you tech in healers you will lose every game because you aren't fast enough to even pretend to keep up. Relicanth only hits for your opponent's tools if I read his attack correctly so Dark Palm just takes up space on your bench in that sense.
I played a real person with real cards. (OKAY FINE REDSHARK ISN'T 'REAL CARDS'. But unless you're stacking your deck every game, it's irrelevant and our results should be the same.) If nnaann had been using your list the result would have been even more obvious: a 6-0 sweep in prizes. I wasn't going to test using Luxchomp because I'm not comfortable in my own ability to play the deck, but you're making me wonder if it really matters.
I don't think I need to say much more, Scipio really summarized my thoughts.
Mach
New Member
Let's take a second to think about what happens when Ursaring meets meta decks:
Luxchomp: "Oh no," says Luxchomp. "If only I had some fighting typed staple tech Pokemon that is usually used to revenge KO opposing Luxrays and deals 60 for one Energy and a Gain, plus Poison, so the fact that Ursaring is Belted doesn't matter!" Toxicroak G Promo replies "What, am I invisible?"
Donphan: You're not winning this one. Don't even try. 120 for 1 > 90 for 3 methinks. You don't survive that 120 period you self damage, so Belted 130 HP can't save that. And if you have a Nidoqueen out to heal your self damage, well, Donphan has PlusPower/Buck's Training/Crobat G to reach those odd numbers.
Jumpluff: Hits 100 (You damage yourself, remember?) fairly easily, and can use Bats to reach 120. Or, maybe just a Belt. Either way, Jumpluff wins by spamming Jumpluffs, since they can OHKO for one, and you OHKO for 3-4. Oh, you're going to control your bench size? Well, Jumpluff still hits a minimum of 60-70 for one, 90 with a Belt, and there are still Bats coming your way. Dusknoir? Luxray.
Gyarados: See above, but remove the free retreat, Luxray abuse, and T1 speed and replace it with higher HP which puts it out of OHKO range under almost any circumstances (Gyarados has Belts too), the ability to disregard Dusknoir entirely, and that Toxicroak G that Luxchomp forgot about.
Flygon: As long as they're not running Machamp, Donphan, or any other side attacking line at all (i.e. straight Flygon, which isn't spectacular), then you would be able to pull this match off.
Beating random league decks doesn't really count as testing the ability of your deck, so much as the speed at which you can destroy Arcanine SV/Dragonite LA.dec . I'm not saying that you shouldn't try to be creative making a deck, but this is on the wrong side of the line separating "creative" and "bad"
Luxchomp: "Oh no," says Luxchomp. "If only I had some fighting typed staple tech Pokemon that is usually used to revenge KO opposing Luxrays and deals 60 for one Energy and a Gain, plus Poison, so the fact that Ursaring is Belted doesn't matter!" Toxicroak G Promo replies "What, am I invisible?"
Donphan: You're not winning this one. Don't even try. 120 for 1 > 90 for 3 methinks. You don't survive that 120 period you self damage, so Belted 130 HP can't save that. And if you have a Nidoqueen out to heal your self damage, well, Donphan has PlusPower/Buck's Training/Crobat G to reach those odd numbers.
Jumpluff: Hits 100 (You damage yourself, remember?) fairly easily, and can use Bats to reach 120. Or, maybe just a Belt. Either way, Jumpluff wins by spamming Jumpluffs, since they can OHKO for one, and you OHKO for 3-4. Oh, you're going to control your bench size? Well, Jumpluff still hits a minimum of 60-70 for one, 90 with a Belt, and there are still Bats coming your way. Dusknoir? Luxray.
Gyarados: See above, but remove the free retreat, Luxray abuse, and T1 speed and replace it with higher HP which puts it out of OHKO range under almost any circumstances (Gyarados has Belts too), the ability to disregard Dusknoir entirely, and that Toxicroak G that Luxchomp forgot about.
Flygon: As long as they're not running Machamp, Donphan, or any other side attacking line at all (i.e. straight Flygon, which isn't spectacular), then you would be able to pull this match off.
Beating random league decks doesn't really count as testing the ability of your deck, so much as the speed at which you can destroy Arcanine SV/Dragonite LA.dec . I'm not saying that you shouldn't try to be creative making a deck, but this is on the wrong side of the line separating "creative" and "bad"
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prodigal_fanboy
New Member
Dawg get wrecked. Donphan does 120 for 1. Toxipromo 130 for 1 assuming no prior energy gain. If the Luxchomp runs a Dialga tech, they could also just wreck ya with Lucario GL (70x2=140).
I am sorry, but if you want to spend time making something slow work, choose something a little better to go with.
ryanvergel
New Member
You guys have been arguing the same points.
Some people won't accept that most decks play a fighting pokemon who would destroy this deck.
Is it underestimated? No. It is appropriately estimated to be a horrible deck.
Some people won't accept that most decks play a fighting pokemon who would destroy this deck.
Is it underestimated? No. It is appropriately estimated to be a horrible deck.
TheDoctor
New Member
Donphan won Nor Cal Regionals, we do have some of the best players...
ryanvergel
New Member
Donphan has been all over the south and west- if you're not aware of it, you should be doing your proper research on the metagame ;x
Kayle
Active Member
How is a deck based around T2 90 a very inferior deck? Make whatever you like and I'll wreck it on Redshark all freakin weekend.
You shouldn't defend bad cards as metagame capable.
How are the decks that we test inferior when they beat ursaring? Almost everybody agrees on this and people have tested it on redshark. And why shouldn't we bash a card because we don't like it? If we didn't there would be no arguements.
Kayle
Active Member
Bashing a card because you don't like it is weak. Bashing a card because you know it won't work ("don't see its potential" -> see its lack of potential) is more appropriate.
And I think he's talking about the Ursaring deck that we tested against. But I don't think you could make a better one.
And I think he's talking about the Ursaring deck that we tested against. But I don't think you could make a better one.
baby mario
Front Page Article Editor<br><a href="http://pokeg
I think he's saying that the Ursaring builds that are being tested are inferior.
They must be . . . Ursaring owns all meta decks (apparently).
They must be . . . Ursaring owns all meta decks (apparently).
Scipio
New Member
Hey, if anybody can show me an Ursaring list that:
- Will be doing 90 damage T2...lets say 75% of the time
- Can keep spamming Ursarings constantly
- Can engage in price-tradeoffs with Jumpluff
- Does not get wrecked by Toxicroak G/Dialga G/Donphan
- Has a surefire way of always getting that DCE in time
- Can actually survive hits from pretty much every other deck in the meta
Then, and only then, I think we can accept Ursaring as a good deck. As it stands now though, with the means it has...it clearly is not. Even if you can spam your T2 Ursaring all the time, you set up ONE 110 HP 3-For-90 attacker every TWO turns. Jumpluff sets up ONE 90 HP 1-for-120 attacker every SINGLE turn. With that I include the energy attachment. All Luxchomp needs to do is make sure that the active Ursaring is the only one with energy (Hello there Dragon Rush/Bright Look Flash Impact on your benched charging-ups) and voila, that random Toxicroak G just set you two turns back. If they get the heads on Leap Away you're completely doomed.
No. Ursaring cannot win big events. BUT it is a truckload of fun to play at league.
- Will be doing 90 damage T2...lets say 75% of the time
- Can keep spamming Ursarings constantly
- Can engage in price-tradeoffs with Jumpluff
- Does not get wrecked by Toxicroak G/Dialga G/Donphan
- Has a surefire way of always getting that DCE in time
- Can actually survive hits from pretty much every other deck in the meta
Then, and only then, I think we can accept Ursaring as a good deck. As it stands now though, with the means it has...it clearly is not. Even if you can spam your T2 Ursaring all the time, you set up ONE 110 HP 3-For-90 attacker every TWO turns. Jumpluff sets up ONE 90 HP 1-for-120 attacker every SINGLE turn. With that I include the energy attachment. All Luxchomp needs to do is make sure that the active Ursaring is the only one with energy (Hello there Dragon Rush/Bright Look Flash Impact on your benched charging-ups) and voila, that random Toxicroak G just set you two turns back. If they get the heads on Leap Away you're completely doomed.
No. Ursaring cannot win big events. BUT it is a truckload of fun to play at league.
Politoed666
New Member
Ursaring is mediocre.
It's not bad. I mean, anything that can utilize DCE and do big damage isn't bad. The problem lies in that it's not strategically sound (it's basically a beatstick) and the metagame is absolutely full of counters to it.
It's not bad. I mean, anything that can utilize DCE and do big damage isn't bad. The problem lies in that it's not strategically sound (it's basically a beatstick) and the metagame is absolutely full of counters to it.
Would you put money on that? Then I would show you.
You can't bet money on pokegym.
Phazon Elite
New Member
I hate children. So badly. They ruin everything. They even managed to ruin the raw power that is Ursaring Prime.
BlackBrock
New Member
hahahaha beat a SP Deck today... hahahaha Lone Ursaring in play and Pokehealer + and Life Herb FTW !!! hahahaha !! Garchomp aint got nothing on Ursa ^_^. Red shark is a joke lol test all you like, its not as accurate as ya claim.... if it is, explain how my Lone Urasing with Expert Belt and 4 Energy survived 6 Turns and ended the game with 60 HP on it, taking out Garchomp as its first meal of the day? HAHA dont beilive me? send a PM to Muddy68 on PokeBeach fourms... ask him how annoying PokeHealer+ was. (o and to make it even more funny, i used only 1...thats right....1...pokehealer+ to keep his HP up and rollin)