Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

What Will Win Battle Roads?

MACHAMP CAN NOT WIN WITHOUT CLAYDOL
if they use JUDGE...You LOSE
If They Use Spiritomb... You LOSE
if they play vileplume.. YOU LOSE
If They Play Donphan... You LOSE
IF They Spray Your Uxie early... YOU LOSE
 
uuuufff said:
Am I on Punk'd?! How much does a 1-1 Claydol DECREASE your chances of getting a T1/T2 Machamp. very little!

How much does it benefit you in the long run? heaps! I don't even know why i'm arguing this, it's so freaking obvious.
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Bright Look GG bro

Bring up a Claydol and snipe around it with Drifblim FB or Garchomp C Lv.X. If you do that the WHOLE game, a 1-1 Claydol will LOSE you the match.

No Dol>Dol in Machamp...every time
 
That doesn't even make any sense. If your build can't deal with having a Claydol brought up (either by way of not playing warp point, unown q etc.) then just don't play down thre 1-1 Claydol vs. SP. It's useful in every other match-up, and if your build doesn't run the cards to get it out of the active position, don't play it down vs. SP! You people are nuts.
 
Muk Man said:
MACHAMP CAN NOT WIN WITHOUT CLAYDOL
if they use JUDGE...You LOSE
If They Use Spiritomb... You LOSE
if they play vileplume.. YOU LOSE
If They Play Donphan... You LOSE
IF They Spray Your Uxie early... YOU LOSE
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Vileplume/Spiritomb will likely be run in the same decks in this format, so those points are the same. Machamp has as good a chance without Claydol as it does with vs. Donphan (Remember, most Donphan builds don't use Claydol either). The deck goes through enough cards to AT LEAST get 2 Uxies by T1 (or T2 if you go first). Also, with so much drawpower in the deck, a judge is not likely to mess you up unless you get really unlucky.

Really, out of all those points, I think Tomb/Vileplume was the only viable argument, and every deck nowadays has autolosses or near-autolosses.

Also, for uuuuffff, not playing the Claydol down vs. SP could limit your draw power if you were to draw into them. The deck should have Warp Points anyways, but you can't always rely on that, and I would rather have an Uxie/Unown R Bright Looked than a Claydol (especially since they can repeatedly bright look Clay).
 
So you wouldn't even play just a 1-1 Claydol in Machamp because of the chance of drawing into it vs. a Luxchomp (don't say "SP", Dialga/Garchomp and Sablelock are not capable of absuing Claydol's 2 retreat cost). Luxchomp was a favourable match-up to begin with, why not put in 2 extra cards which improve your OTHER match-ups heaps (which might not be as good) even though they might be dead weight vs. one of your best match-ups (even though it really isn't dead weight, assuming you play warp points etc. which you sohuld be doing).

Not that it's a really relevant argument lol but yeah
 
I don't see how anyone can discredit a 1-1 Claydol line in Machamp. It's a great counter to Hand Disruption, gives you the options to play another Stage 2 tech, boosted consistency and loads of other benefits. Uxie's give you a quick Machamp and a form of drawpower against SP builds with Luxray in.
 
DonphanAtoZ said:
Discussing past formats won't get you anywhere.
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The best way to plan ahead is to learn about mistakes made in the past.

I think it's a good discussion that is relevant, you can see what Machamp has lost from the rotation as well as the pros and cons of an Uxie engine over a Claydol engine.
 
Kayle said:
So I am going to derail the discussion lololol

Sableye vs Vilegar, how does this work? It's very hard to get out a KO vs the tomb fast enough to mean anything, slaying the Vileplume is nearly impossible without Energy Gain and Turn, and the resulting Gengars will just beast you anyway; no viable counters to Gengar exist because of Fainting Spell, so there's no way to just run through them.

Vilegar seems relatively vulnerable to well-placed Initiatives, but obviously I can't rely on that - so is that the extent of my matchup, hoping I can screw them up early on with Initiative and then going for weak kills for the rest of the game?
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i totatly agree dude:pokeball:
 
nnaann said:
I don't see how anyone can discredit a 1-1 Claydol line in Machamp. It's a great counter to Hand Disruption, gives you the options to play another Stage 2 tech, boosted consistency and loads of other benefits. Uxie's give you a quick Machamp and a form of drawpower against SP builds with Luxray in.
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I think this post sums it up the best. My point, at the very least, is that Machamp without Claydol is still good, and still just as fast early-game. It's proven to stand up to SP decks in testing. Also, aside from Vilegar, I don't see very many S2 decks making the top tables for BRs.
 
vegitalian said:
Vileplume/Spiritomb will likely be run in the same decks in this format, so those points are the same. Machamp has as good a chance without Claydol as it does with vs. Donphan (Remember, most Donphan builds don't use Claydol either). The deck goes through enough cards to AT LEAST get 2 Uxies by T1 (or T2 if you go first). Also, with so much drawpower in the deck, a judge is not likely to mess you up unless you get really unlucky.

Really, out of all those points, I think Tomb/Vileplume was the only viable argument, and every deck nowadays has autolosses or near-autolosses.

Also, for uuuuffff, not playing the Claydol down vs. SP could limit your draw power if you were to draw into them. The deck should have Warp Points anyways, but you can't always rely on that, and I would rather have an Uxie/Unown R Bright Looked than a Claydol (especially since they can repeatedly bright look Clay).
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Machamp without claydol=0 battle road wins...
 
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