Will Nationals be in St.Louis in 2010?

[Pokeric]

This was my first Nats so I obviously had a good time and obviously have nothing to compare it to. I didn't like the card place though. They paid me $4 for my Hitmonchan reprint, Shiny Duskull, and Dusknoir SF #1 (and 1 other thing I think but I forget what) and the cards were mad expensive then. They did however have some pretty sweet 36 count clear dice I got for a decdent price. The other guys that were there the day before in the hall way were a lot nice and a lot cheaper they just didn't have a huge selection because they didn't have a stand or anything. The hotel people were eh. You could tell they didn't really enjoy all the Pokemon players there but I don't think I would either if I was running the Holiday Inn. They coulda been a little nicer but were still helpful when you asked for something. I liked how they kept the ball room open all night Sunday for the tourny but I think the America Center should have stayed open longer. I also wish there were more food places within walking distance. The league play was fun though and I got some pretty good stuff from it.

 

[Absoltrainer]

If I may point out. PUI has listend to the players in the past. I have a feeling they'll do it again.

Most likely Nats will not be in St. Louis next year....that being said, it will probably not be in Ohio either.

 

[Pokemon No Baka]

Also, I'd love to play you at Worlds. I don't think I'm going to make it, but we'll see!

^_^ Oh, I'm not making the big dance but I'll be there for the LCQ... so I'll keep my fingers crossed for you!!

Most likely Nats will not be in St. Louis next year....that being said, it will probably not be in Ohio either.

New place means new research for me! I'm in travel, so I get away with it!

 

[Riq]

STANDINGS should be PROJECTED !!! Simply get 3 HUGE SCREENS (venue probably has them!), hang 'em high, and scroll the standings. Then anyone can see their table/matchups/roster from anywhere in the playing area. You can do the paper-posting for side-events. Projecting main event standings would make it seem more like "a main event" / big deal

You can scroll other information on those screens as well which would cut down on all of those DISTRACTING announcements throughout the TCG main event! I'm surprised I top-cut as much as I forgot my move everytime I heard "ATTENTION: TCG POKEMON PLAYERS .. .ATTENTION: POKEMON TRADING CARD GAME PLAYERS... " There's nothing wrong with announcements, but they were just way too frequent.

i also have to agree with this. me and some of my friends were talking about it as well. i saw that the Pokemon Video Game Championships had this and have always thought this would be MUCH easier and less time consuming by just easily looking up, find the seat #, and sit down, instead of standing in a line for 5mins. looking for your name, etc. They also do this on the Pokemon TV show!

 

[Gathering Ground]

I totally agree. Lady cashier was definitely not suited to be dealing with children.

Hi All,

I just wanted to say my main concern was in keeping the line moving. I knew people were getting anxious waiting in line and needed to get back to playing. Honestly, I have a 2 year old son myself so dealing with the kids does not bother me at all! It was just there were a couple of times things got a little hectic and I was doing my best to keep people from having to wait too long. Also, people were getting upset because it was really difficult to keep a clear line formed and people were either cutting in line, not waiting their turn to ask me for help, or others were complaining to me that they could not see in the cases because the line had moved in front of them. As far as counting the change, I was actually excited to see people come with it as I was going through it like water so much that by Saturday I had ran out and I was asking everyone I could for their change. So, really I do not know what that is about. Again, sorry if I came across as "straight faced" or strictly business at times it's just I had a lot of weight on my shoulders to get everyone checked out and keep the line moving so they could get back to playing. I guess it's one of those can't win for losing situations. Next time we will for sure have more than one register!

-Amanda
Gathering Ground

 

[Ruiner]

A few more points/clarifications:

Origins needs Pokemon far more than vice versa. Yet I do feel that Pokemon BENEFITS from being at Origins as well. It is mutually beneficial to both parties involved, even if it favors Origins more so. I know this is a POKEMON tournament being held, but I'd be willing to at least wager that 50% of the players who attend do not play Pokemon exclusively. At the very least, you could pick up new board games, or non collectible card games to play, plus random attractions at the events. I'm sorry, but if your playtesting Thursday and Friday for Nats, go into Nats, and play 8 rounds and wiff cut, your a bit burnt out on Pokemon, regardless of how much you love the game. It doesn't make you a bad, unloyal player for wanting to mix it up. I can play game after game after game, much more than most people can, but I like a bit of variety. The nice thing with Origins is theres stuff to do AFTER the Pokemon events close. It is a much better place for gamers as a whole.

I don't believe a single person who said they wouldn't attend Nats if it were in X city. If they held Nationals in a quarry in the middle of no where, I'd go, and I'd have a blast. It wouldn't be as fun as it was in St Louis, which wasn't as fun as it was in Columbus, but I'd still enjoy myself. The event was FAR from bad, in fact it was still a great event. It was just a VERY noticible step down. But I am sure PUI had reasons for parting with Origins, justified ones, and there isn't much they can do about that. They put in the effort, and it wasn't a disaster. Things need work, but this is their first Nats outside of Origins. Despite being very critical myself, they deserve SOME slack.

I'd really appreciate if they scheduled opposite of Origins and Gen Con though. I was HONESTLY 50-50 as to which event I'd attend this summer. Sitting out Nationals due to having my invite made Origins a very real choice to me. I know others who DID skip Nats for Origins. Both events would benefit from being different weekends. Gaming conventions thriving is better for the gaming community as a whole. Plus, even if you don't hold Nationals at Origins, it may be possible to have non sanctioned events there so that the game gets further exposure.

To whoever referenced the fact that GG had gathered say 100x copies of certain cards and had no desire to buy them anymore...WOW, wouldn't THAT be fixed by adding extra vendors? Once one store sells low on a card, prices go up ( example: Toxicroak ) and once they fill up, they stop buying. This is fixed by having multiple vendors. If one vendor doesn't want to buy, go to the next. It keeps prices fair. I know its "smart business" because its unlikely those cards will be moved, but it doesn't change the fact that A.) they were rude and B.) the situation would have been completely avoided without the monopoly. They were selling Uxie Lvl X for 39 dollars...I can buy those off of friends for 15...and of course, a threat to be kicked out of the event? What a joke.

 

[dtrain]

Like everyone else said my experience at Nats was ehhhh. The main event was awesome, however:
1. Practically no where to eat.
2. Gathering Grounds insane prices and being as rude as you can get.
3. Security going nuts with people blocking some parts of the walk way.

I really hope Nats next year will not be in STL. If its is I don't plan to go back. Please have a location where there is food and I don't have to starve -_-

 

[ApachePrime]

A-P...I know you love the game.

I hated the food situation.

It has to be addressed and fixed wherever we go next year.

I will see you all there!

Vince

Vince, my girlfriend said I sounded a bit different than I meant to up there. I want you specifically to know that I couldn't not think of a better staff for the event, you and your staff represented St. Louis amazingly. Every local person I played was the epitome of spirit of the game.

My complaint is only with the SPECIFIC location. I really had a great time. If there's another convention center in St. Louis, I'd be happy to give that a try. However, I will not be returning to the America's Center. We're on the same page, but I wanted to put it out there that the St. Louis players were a great bunch, and even with my criticism I had a FANTASTIC time in St. Louis.

 

[The Gorn]

Origins needs Pokemon far more than vice versa. Yet I do feel that Pokemon BENEFITS from being at Origins as well. It is mutually beneficial to both parties involved, even if it favors Origins more so. I know this is a POKEMON tournament being held, but I'd be willing to at least wager that 50% of the players who attend do not play Pokemon exclusively.

We chose to skip Nationals and attend Origins.

I'm not sure that either Origins needs Pokemon or Pokemon needs Origins.

Origins has been around a lot longer than Pokemon. And while there's no doubt that Origins benefits from Pokemon being there (that's a lot of badges) my experience is that I rarely see Pokemon players doing other games (other than maybe Are You a Werewolf).

From PUI's perspective, was Nationals in St. Louis a success? Absolutely. The numbers were huge. If PUI held Nationals again in St. Louis next year, would there be as many attendees? Absolutely.

So why would Nationals move from St. Louis? (I didn't think St. Louis was a good choice, but the attendance speaks for itself. It met expectations so obviously PUI knew what they were doing.)

As for Origins, I spoke to several people running games. (All the events we participated in were full, btw). They said the biggest difference was the noise level.

 

[Prime]

League play was a blast! The generous prizes motivated me to actually play someone besides my family for the first time. The two gentlemen working the prize table were INCREDIBLE! Sitting there and cheerfully dealing with the continuous lines for 3 days with few if any breaks could not have been easy. THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!!

Happy you had fun :thumb:

The Pokemon Company International was incredibly generous with the league prizes, as they always are. We tried so hard to give away everything, but still had boxes of binders and other stuff left in the end. I guess that means more swag for Worlds.

 

[spazcrackers]

Ruiner made the first post about the Gathering Grounds and their under-cutting on offers and the bald guy being rude after talking about the store's reputation being a priority;this is all truth. I seriously hope the higher ups of Pokemon consider having multiple vendors at future national events. The voice of the players will be heard and from what I'm hearing so far they are not satisfied with the lone vendor at all.

As for the tournament being in St. Louis,I enjoyed it. Cheers everyone.

-spaz

 

[Rogue Archetype]

The problem with planning the 8-person tournies is that since you never know when one is going to start or how many will be running at any given time, it's extremely difficult to plan judges for them. Obviously you want to keep the bulk of the judges in the Nationals tournament, since that's the one that's the most important. You can only "plan" for so many judges to be open at any given time, and thus you're stuck with trying to locate an open judge when you get 8 people. I don't see how you can work around that, really.

As for the not wanting announcements during the cut rounds Sunday, well, if you need to find somebody, you need to find somebody. How else could we really accomplish that?

These issues are easy to remedy.
"Planning and logistics" is my thing

I liked the layout of the 8-man. The floor placement and the physical logistics were laid out nicely. They had it in a great location and the table arrangement made logical sense (i.e. 8 to a table!)
The crash-n-burn came from uninformed staff that appeared to be THROWN into judging/organizing it.
Roles were not discussed and materials were not adequate.

I actually witnessed a situation where players that were halway through their tourney were sitting there shuffling and waiting to begin their games only to be told "ok, we're starting over because I just got here and I don't know WHAT's going on with this one."

It wasn't a big issue at all because the staff just pulled up their bootstraps and made the thing happen. I've just been in charge of event organizing enough to feel-their-pain from their perspective.

I appreciate that the makeshift staff got it done with a GOOD attitude instead of just complaining and being grumpy with the confusion. They kept their wits, they kept their sense of humor and they ran the events. :smile:

HERE ARE SOME MORE SUGGESTIONS:

Announcements:
PROJECT THEM ONTO A BIG SCREEN and highlight them VOCALLY between rounds as opposed to DURING ROUNDS. This, not only, would make the atmosphere less hectic (because sometimes it was a bit noisy) but there would be LESS misterpretation of information. I would, literally, hear one thing, walk 10 steps in any given direction and hear groups of people with varied understandings of the information. Written word that is reinforced by spoken word is always solid.

8-man Side-events

If we're going to have staff "TAG IN" then create a system that lends itself to this aspect.

1. Simplify the paperwork so the judges can focus on judging and collecting bracket-rosters.
Why not a "Side-event computer table?" We had sign-ups for modified side. Just have a table with a couple of people typing and printing off a bracket with player names. That paper is given to a staff member who will lead their 8 people to a table and begin. Once the round ends, the judge calls time and the winning players write their own names onto the bracket sheet. The only thing that a judge would do is call time, judge, and pick up the completed sheet. Single-Elimination tourneys makes this process fast and fun. You lose, you sign up for the next and try again. Top 3 can get packs (i.e. 6, 4, 2)
In a single-elimination format with player-filled bracket sheets, any judge that shows up as an 'in-between,' will simply call time and continue the next round. The sheets do all the work :thumb:

2. If you have 2 staff, you have 2 tables. When you get more staff, you have more tables. People shouldn't even be in the play area because the sign-ups will be at the computer table. This takes the turnmoil and confusion away from the play area itself.

Anyway, like I said before, the staff that ran it, handled it. It's our responsibility as FREE attendies to respectfully help the event improve. So, I make observations and suggestions out of appreciation for what has been done; offering my family a fun family hobby with fun events. I KNOW what it's like to be responsible for the planning and seeing people complain without being willing to offer fixes (i.e. Complaining for the sake of complaining).

I hope these suggestions help.

P.S.
It would be nice if people would stop saying "if ___ then I won't be there" as I am inclined to smirk and say "then DON'T!" Really people, it's a FREE event that is HUGE and EXPENSIVE for PUI. Show a little appreciation and work with it. Alot of people put in alot of VOLUTEERED EFFORT to bring you something incredible. State the suggested fixes and rock on.

 

[vanderbilt_grad]

Just to add to the discussion ... in the white pod I couldn't hear the "start" and "time" annoucements much of the day. In game I probably wouldn't be looking to a projecter screen much, but I buzzer, bell, or some such might work well for that.

 

[bytor]

Interesting thread

This particualr thread is kinda interesting. I hear a lot of hope and honesty in every post. Compasion enough to elicit what appears to be very sincere interest in the game as a whole.

Surely driving a long way and being dissapointed is a real drag. And like some say here, they would travel anywhere to play the single most competitive tourney of the year.

Is it a changing demographic? If the game got your attention in '99 and you were, say 8, you are now 10 years older and may actually have a car and a job and can now go anywhere (within reason) to all the pokemon tourneys held in the US all the time to seek out that desired competition!

If you are 20 and adventurous and hanging out with your buds, the big city may be the coolest thing ever. Awfull smells and everything! Why not? It is cool.

If you are 45 years old and have 3 kids and all there crap with you, just point me to a place where I can sit down and try to relax!

Quite a difference. A huge gap. How do you please from end to end?

Such passion.......

...................................please don't say you won't be back......................................

 

[pokeking11]

...Im gonna go for the kill and ask PUI to bring Nationals to Denver...
Because, um... I dont really have a good reason.

But I guess its more centrical? What other options are there?

i second this 1st of all for for a personall reason its a hour away from me second the fact that there is so much to do there theres food all over theres several theme parks to do later that are a blast and it is more central

 

[fabulousTaz]

wow, st louis worst then ohio?

i didnt go to st louis as im going to san diego for worlds this year, but i definitely dont want nats at ohio next year. I HATE origins, its a lame con and ohio is hella boring. At least in st louis i can go to a baseball game and see the greatest hitter in the game. Pujols> All of Ohio

Good Game

 

[deogg]

I say why not Indianapolis. It has a great convention center with a lot to do a mall attached to the convention center, with movie theaters, an arcade and a food court another good thing is the majority of the downtown area is connected by skywalks. (We enjoy not having to walk outside in the weather to get where were going). There are a ton of hotel spaces available. Parking is cheap and free along with many hotels. That is why gen-con, Star wars, and many other large conventions use it. That’s also why the NFL chose Indy for the 2012 Super Bowl. I often take my daughter to the convention center for cheer competitions where they have 10,000 + people in for the weekend. It is in a centralized location much like St Louis which makes it a convent drive for a lot of people. I can also say the downtown area has plenty of choices for food other then the mall. In the summer months the convention center space is pretty cheap. (I was on a committee that booked it for a collage graduation.) I like many others had issues in St Louis. However cannot say my motive is completely selfless because I live in Indiana and it would be a fantastic to have this event here.

Now THIS is one city I would wholeheartedly agree on seeing Nats at! The downtown area has sufficiently handled GenCon AND a Colts preseason game on the same day. If they can handle gamers AND Colts fans all at the same time, then they could definitely and VERY easily handle approx. 2000 Poke-players/Families/Support staff.

 

[Naki Feralkin]

I say why not Indianapolis. It has a great convention center with a lot to do a mall attached to the convention center, with movie theaters, an arcade and a food court another good thing is the majority of the downtown area is connected by skywalks. (We enjoy not having to walk outside in the weather to get where were going). There are a ton of hotel spaces available. Parking is cheap and free along with many hotels. That is why gen-con, Star wars, and many other large conventions use it. That’s also why the NFL chose Indy for the 2012 Super Bowl. I often take my daughter to the convention center for cheer competitions where they have 10,000 + people in for the weekend. It is in a centralized location much like St Louis which makes it a convent drive for a lot of people. I can also say the downtown area has plenty of choices for food other then the mall. In the summer months the convention center space is pretty cheap. (I was on a committee that booked it for a collage graduation.) I like many others had issues in St Louis. However cannot say my motive is completely selfless because I live in Indiana and it would be a fantastic to have this event here.

I must say I also concur. I'm from Ohio and I can definitely say Indianapolis is definitely a GREAT location. There truly is a lot of food locations around the convention center (The Hyatt we stayed at for Gencon was right across the street from a Mall AND had numerous resturaunts inside and outside of the con center), and there is also plenty of lodging for the area (We moved around like 3 times due to accommodation problems also) and the city really is not that bad. It is constantly busy during the daytime and evening, and there was plenty to do.

I'm from Ohio and I greatly dislike all 3 of our major cities, finding Indianapolis was such a nicer location than any of them.

 

[icemelter1001]

So it seems that if you are not 100% satisfied with the event and let people know about your problems you are complaining?

Are we not entitled to our own opinion?

I was fine with the even itself, it was great and I enjoyed seeing the people I only get to this time of year.
Outside of the event, well, was pretty much a dud which a lot of other players have expressed as well. The Nationals staff did as best as they could and I will be attending Nationals again wherever it may be, even in St. Louis. If I came off as a complainer that was not my goal. I was just trying to express common problems in hope that they would be looked at and fixed next year. Which it seems they are trying to do.

 

[Ruiner]

I want to also suggest Indianapolis. I've been there for Gen Con, and for a Magic 5k, and the whole area by the convention center is FANTASTIC for events like this. Good lodging, great convention center, plenty to do downtown ( right next to a mall...less than a 5 minute walk ) and PLENTY of food, all well priced. Parking is plentiful as well.