Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Is the TCG going downhill?

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Professor Elm said:
Well, we saw this trend from the start of Diamond and Pearl. PCL started making cards more and more broken with the release of each new set.

I really must agree, I miss the days of RS-on and HL-on that involved steady, slow-paced, setup decks, with those 1 or 2 speed decks that could also do fairly well.

I dunno what happened, but this whole SP nonsense has turned the game around completely. Now everything must setup within turn 1-2 or else you essentially lose. And due to SP pokemon all being basic, they are naturally fast, and PCL has to create cards like BTS just so that setup decks can compete.

I think what happened was PCL wanted increased diversity in deck choice, to where kids could choose their favorite Pokemon to base a deck on and still be able to make it slightly competitive, but by doing this they also increased the donk factor in the game, and made the game much more speed based.

The game is still thriving though. We have seen amazing growth. And with a larger player base comes more complaining, and increased problems. AND, I do believe that there is a healthy future for the game. Yes, we will have to embrace this fast paced environment BUT in the next couple sets we are going to see cards like Spiritomb which will help slow the game down to a manageable state.

I dunno, next format will be the first format we have ever had where there is literally NO rotation of sets. I know I am personally a little scared. We will see how it goes though.
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Yes, thank you. I am glad to see someone who sees how lousy SP Pokemon were.
The way I see it, the format for DP-on was the best format I have ever seen in this game. That was at its inception with the release of Legends Awakened. I had my Magnezone deck which I had literally started drawing up right after Regionals last year had ended. Playing that deck is the most fun I have ever had in this game, and seeing the other ideas being put together and tried out. It wasn't like you were wasting your time to put something together to see how good it was. That is what I liked the most. The wealth of ideas that you could try. At Cities I would get excited just to see what people were doing. I would see an idea I liked that maybe I had wanted to try but just hadn't because it was farther down my list of things to try. I would think "cool, I want to watch that person play and see what that deck looks like in action." Win or lose, I didn't really care all that much simply because it was so invigorating to see so many cool ideas around, and a lot of them, and I mean a lot of them were working just as well as any of the others. I was excited for a truly open metagame, where you could take any card out of the available pool of cards that you liked, and if you worked hard enough at your list and practiced to get good at playing it, you could make absolutely any card you wanted into the center of a tournament-winning deck.

As soon as I saw Platinum with all of the SP Pokemon and all of the stupidly cheap Trainers they would get, I knew it was all going to end. I knew unless the set also contained something else ridiculously over-powered to counter them or at least something new and powerful that I could work into my Magnezone deck, it was all but history. With my hopes high, I tried Manectric. While it does have some pretty nice perks, it simply doesn't have the offensive power I need. My list of ideas to try out was all but completely obliterated, as those who know me know I am a thinking player, and I prefer to play setup decks with deep strategies over rushing decks with simple objectives. Inevitably, the SP Pokemon took over the format, and while those that favor the rushing decks got a lot of nice things to work with in addition to what they already had, those like me who prefer setup decks were left with very little to work with. Since the release of Platinum my interest in Pokemon has decreased dramatically as there just isn't anything I feel like playing. I certainly doubt I will ever want to play an SP deck. They just aren't right for me. Sure there are some ideas out there worth trying, but it's nothing compared to that huge wealth of ideas that were once worth trying out and exploring. It isn't a format anymore where if you work on an idea enough you can make it something worthy of winning tournaments. So yes, I think Pokemon tcg has been going downhill since the release of Platinum.

However, I read that there are only three SP Pokemon in that Advent of Arceus set, so it looks like these dark times (for me at least) are going to pass eventually. This idea of retaining the format for a year is indeed fascinating and I am glad I will at least be able to continue my work with Magnezone DP. And recently, I gained a new reason to put Project Paralyze back in the think tank and try to redevelop it.:wink: But for now, I'm out of the game, at least until the start of next season. Maybe now's about the time to start drawing up a totally new idea up for next season.:wink:
 
Unless, of course, the next set is HeartGold and SoulSilver themed, and you have more Pokémon-SP.

I'm not a player anymore. I can't afford it. However, I tend to see it like this: When you play any game, there are going to be things you don't like about the game. the Pokemon TCG changes. This is one benefit it has. It's sometimes going to change away from how you like it, and sometimes it's going to change how you like it, but ultimately, you can't dictate how it's going to go, nor would you want to, else the game would become boring and stale.

Fast games? Does anyone remember when Base Set was still tournament legal? And you might have a guy use 4 Bills and 4 Professor Oaks in a round? I don't think things have changed all that much, only what you can rely on.
 
The only things I dont like are donks that are supposed to happen like machamp or sableye. Other than that I like the game right now. There are many decks and combos to choose from.
 
Varna said:
This along with the new games Pokémon Arm and Pokémon Leg.

On topic, the power creep that the new sets are bringing just sickens me. Who even uses cards from DP anymore?
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DP was a terrible set, back when it just came out it was ok because there was Ape, Empoleon, and Mario, but the rest of the set stunk except for Dusknoir which was used in GG.

I think the game is gonna get better, slowly. very slowly. One mor season and these donk decks will be gone completely and they might even bring back DRE and Scramble since Garde/Gallade will be gone.

However for the time being, I think worlds is gonna be a joke, well at least for seniors and juniors. I mean you look at the top 2 matches in each division from nats, and you will see that they all ended pretty much in under 15 minutes.

Darrel got a terrible hand against Kyle and then got donked in MASters (15 minutes)
Aylam donked LJ twice I heard in SEniors (10 minutes)
Game 1 Donk, Game 2 donk, Game 3 donk in Juniors (5 minutes)

Howeverif you look at the upcoming sets, the cards are really powering down, SP is gonna get murdered by relicanth and the cards just really aren't that great until next year.

Once it is platinum on there will be no more call energy or donk decks, cards like Spiritomb and Electivire FB offer promises of Starters again. Our draw support will be much more balanced, and the ability to set-up in your deck will become essential once there is no Claydol or Uxie.

Just gotta be patient for 1 more year
 
Yeah, you see one major step at slowing the pace of decks with the release of Spiritomb in the newest japanese set.

It's body stops all players from using any trainers while active. And without Warp Point, who knows how long he may stay up there. This will significantly add some power to setup decks. Also, as mentioned, Relicanth will hurt SP decks a lot, and is very techable.
 
TBH what this really sounds like is that someone is still sour about his little dusknoir deck being too slow for the current format. Adapt, get a new deck, move on with your life.
 
I thank DarthPika for all of his statesments, because he is giving solutions, and not whining.

I personally think the format could be better, but the game is at a great high point right now.

As for people talking about the whole "play this or win". Who said winning was everything?

I suck up A LOT of tournaments, yet I still have fun because of the community and my friends that play this game.
 
Professor Elm said:
Yeah, you see one major step at slowing the pace of decks with the release of Spiritomb in the newest japanese set.

It's body stops all players from using any trainers while active. And without Warp Point, who knows how long he may stay up there. This will significantly add some power to setup decks. Also, as mentioned, Relicanth will hurt SP decks a lot, and is very techable.
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My thoughts on Spiritomb exactly.
Setup is back, baby!
 
Professor Elm said:
Yeah, you see one major step at slowing the pace of decks with the release of Spiritomb in the newest japanese set.

It's body stops all players from using any trainers while active. And without Warp Point, who knows how long he may stay up there. This will significantly add some power to setup decks. Also, as mentioned, Relicanth will hurt SP decks a lot, and is very techable.
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Warp point is a trainer.

On topic: I think that a huge part of the TCG is going downhill. That is deckbuilding. Basically all you have to do now is put your pokemon in, put in the standard trainer engine, put in Claydol/Uxie, and put in energies. I know that that is not how it is for the more advanced players, but for the majority of people, that's what they do.

The power creep will sort itself out. Be patient, and most of all, don't stop having fun.
 
On the whole "play this or lose" thing.....

You did not play in Rocket-On, Neon, or HP-On. THOSE were truly "Play This Or Lose" formats (respectively, G8rExchange, G8rSect, GG). This format, at least, offers a wide variety of plays that are all pretty much equally potent. I was just one win away from T128 with a speed Flygon/Weavile build.

This is the most diverse format I've ever been in, including the Delta format.
 
I'm still standing by what I've said all season: if you're getting donked consistently, you're doing something wrong.

I played a total of 20 games at nationals, and was donked in zero of those games. My friend Emily who played the same list as me played a total of 15 games and was donked only once, during top cut, but won the other two games in that match. A lot of my friends that played similar decks to mine went 8-0 or 7-1. Couldn't be too many donks there.

In a donk format, the first thing you should always check when testing a new deck, is how susceptible to donking it is. This is easy. Just shuffle the deck and draw 8 cards. How many basics, calls, roseannes? If you start with lone Baltoy or lone Unown G or lone tech basic pretty often (say, 1 in 7 hands), you might want to consider revising your deck. Because in a tournament setting, that 1 in 7 bad start means you're going to be losing one or two games just by being benched T1 or T2.
 
legotack said:
Warp point is a trainer.
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Which is why he said WhITHOUT a warp point, meaning you can't use it to get spiritomb out of the way. You could counter it with something like zangoose PL though, that can bring up something from the bench.

I see the power of cards rising, but to me I just see more and more strategies pop up, especially with the older cards. The format is fine how it is IMO, and I think the OP and others that can't prevent a donk should either change their deck or find a new one that works better.
 
nardd said:
Which is why he said WhITHOUT a warp point, meaning you can't use it to get spiritomb out of the way. You could counter it with something like zangoose PL though, that can bring up something from the bench.

I see the power of cards rising, but to me I just see more and more strategies pop up, especially with the older cards. The format is fine how it is IMO, and I think the OP and others that can't prevent a donk should either change their deck or find a new one that works better.
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I agree with you 100%. Yes, the cards are getting stronger in some ways, but there are also a lot more options.
 
Here is why Pokemon may be going down hill:

Machamp (Skyridge)

[F][F][C][C] Hurricane Punch 30x
Flip 4 coins. This attack does 30 damage times the number of heads.


Machamp (Stormfront)

[C][C] Hurricane Punch 30x
Flip 4 coins. This attack does 30 damage times the number of heads.



Fearow (Jungle)

[C][C][C][C] Drill Peck 40


Fearow (Majestic Dawn)

[C][C][C] Drill Peck 60


Cards are too good and set up too fast!
 
DarthPika said:
I agree with you 100%. Yes, the cards are getting stronger in some ways, but there are also a lot more options.
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There are always a lot of options. Just some are (way) better then others obviously. Today there is little that distinguishes good and bad cards apart besides that one just has broken support or what not.
 
Was Skyridge Machamp and Jungle Fearow ever played competitively, though? (I dunno cos I didn't play then).

If not, then the attacks were obviously too expensive/too weak even when they were originally released.
 
Plus, jungle had double colorless energy to speed up that attack, which back then was significant damage, though scyther could do thirty for {C} {C} {C}
 
And now we have Upper Energy. The point is, attacks are a lot more like Toyota Priuses instead of Hummer H2s, and they still do more damage.
 
But the HP has also risen significantly, which balances out the damage increase. The game has changed, and I think for the better. Referencing old cards from 4+ years ago doesn't really matter in terms of the current gamestate
 
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