Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Is the TCG going downhill?

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afstandopleren

afstandopleren

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Okay, after watching the sidelines for a while, I decided to open this discussion with Pandora's box potential effects.

So, with PL and RR, there are more winning meta decks to choose from, thought I am worried by the huge amount of Donk ability. I mean, loads of meta decks can get T1 kills, provided they are playing cards like Level Max, Flint's, Energy Pickup, Crobat G etc. etc. etc. since just about everything can do 60 or more for just 1 or 2 Energy.

And besides the Donk fest trend that seems to be going on, a lot of the meta game decks seem to be rather easy to play. And don't give me "But the decisions you have to make in a game is what makes the deck difficult and gives your brain a run for the money.". Yeah, it's such a hard decision to go for the kill and completely cripple you opponents setup with Luxray GL LV.X while building up your Infernape 4 to shoot down everything the opponent tries to throw at you. Or it's such a difficult decision to go for the T1 win or play a good game and give your opponent the chance to set up and have an actual potentially fun game that's not hindered by uber bad luck.

Sure it's a 'kids' game, but I don't think winning T1 or not even give your opponent a chance at a decent game falls under the 'Good/Great game' category or even hold any educational value, besides getting to know what Yugioh must be like.
 
afstandopleren said:
And besides the Donk fest trend that seems to be going on, a lot of the meta game decks seem to be rather easy to play. And don't give me "But the decisions you have to make in a game is what makes the deck difficult and gives your brain a run for the money.". Yeah, it's such a hard decision to go for the kill and completely cripple you opponents setup with Luxray GL LV.X while building up your Infernape 4 to shoot down everything the opponent tries to throw at you. Or it's such a difficult decision to go for the T1 win or play a good game and give your opponent the chance to set up and have an actual potentially fun game that's not hindered by uber bad luck.
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You can make ANY deck seem easy to play if you simplify the strategy like that.

The SP decks are probably harder to build and play right than the top decks were last format (G&G, Magmortar, Empoleon).

I don't like the T1 wins either, though. I know they have always happened, but I have no idea why they wanted to increase them. It doesn't make the game any more fun to play.
 
I know over 10 people that are quitting after this season (including me) because it really is not fair to win on your first turn. I liked this game better when they actually had slower Pokemon and the games were actually good games.

Donks are just not cool IMO.
 
The meta doesn't matter.

1200 people at Nationals. That matters.
 
The power creep is just wayyyyyy too high. I mean look at some of the old base set cards or anything from the WOTC era... You'll see 90 hp stage 2's, 3 energy attacks that do 50-60 tops. Now 130-140 hp is normal for a stage 2, we have 1 energy attacks that do 80... the game just not fun anymore when you sit down to play a game and expect it to only last 2-3 turns tops. Whoever thought making a card that could KO one of your pokemon on a coin flip was a good idea? What's the point of even playing if I know my opponent only has to get 2-3 legitimate prizes now? I mean some of these cards they're making are ridiculous. Machamp is ridiculous. Dialga G's first attack + body is ridiculous. So now I can't play 95% of the cards in the format because of two single cards. Well thank you PUI, I guess that means I'll spend 95% less on cards.

On the flip side, compared to other formats there are plenty of decks that CAN be legit, it's just that they're making these cards ridiculously powerful meaning that you either play them, or expect to go 1-4 at a tourney.
 
People are almost forced to play SP decks because only the only way to kill them T1 is with Macheap (With Toxicroak G being an exception) since they tend to have enough HP to withstand a 60 damage hit. Besides, it's the meta that DOES count IMHO. It determines weather or not your deck is playable if you want to win.(God, if 1200 players all want to win, that must been a heck of a boring day imo) But all the decks in the meta are build so much for the win, that there is no more room for playing something else (Almost any rogue that's not combo'd with Gyarados SF). I seriously can't think of a worse meta atm for the creative minds. G&G's dominance seems to pale in comparison to T1 wins that are within everyone's range now and the annoyance that Lucksack*ape provides just to name an example.

Also, the decks in the current meta, are generally easy on the brain. Sure you have to know when to play what, but it's not that hard to get the hang of swarming and hitting hard for just 1 or 2 NRG, right? I'd love to see a meta deck that would require using your brain for a change because I think the more effort you put into your setup, the more satisfaction and fulfillment you get after getting setup, making winning or losing not even matter anymore. Doesn't mean I don't get why people want to win, but it just seems to be at all cost and with any (sadly available) means necessary . I mean, even noobs can with with Macheap if they get the right card. That's not very fun when you, as skilled player, get cheaped out of your chance to advance, right?
 
Donks used to be something to complain about.
They ONLY happened under extreme circumstances where your opponet got a GOD hand like Squirtle, rare candy, blastoise ex and 4 water energy. That was a REAL donk.
Now a days donks are so common that you shrug them off as crappy luck and move on, they aren't worth complaining about anymore.
 
according to you maybe. But for other people, the experience is different obviously. I for one don't think it's something to shrug off. It's so annyingly there in your face, almost laughing at you. It increases the luck factor to a ridiculous degree where you need a second Basic or Call NRG or you are dead screwed. There is nothing you can do about the luck factor, making your example pretty worthless IMO since you don't need GOD hands anymore to donk.
 
At nationals, I would say that 1 or 2 games every round had a donk.. which isnt bad considering how many matches were going on.
 
Donks were less of a problem at Nats than they have been. Some would say the final match of Masters was a donk but Kyle had to have just the right cards in his hands.

If 10 of you are leaving because you are getting your feelings hurt over donks....well I guess you really do not know the game well, because things shift.

The format is wide open...many people cannot stand that as they MUST know what the main deck is going to be so they can play it. New sets come in and change everything again.

Stick around...I think the game is strong as ever but evolving into something that isn't one where everyone will play Blaze, LBS or GG.
 
Well, instead of confirming the Donk capacity of many cards and how lucky most of you people are not experiencing multiple Donks in a row, I don't want this thread to be just about Donks.

I am just asking a question here, looking at the so called powercreep in terms of cards being close to broken for example, which is imho, bad for the game. Until SF came, I was pretty fine with the meta. There was no GG, just Kingdra's but you played Leafeon for that, which has a C4F attack that prevents Kindumb from Donking 99% of the time. and play it possibly with Mew2 X tech in case of AMU or PUMA. But then Gengar with Fainting Spell and Machamp with Take Out came and then the amount of fun and strategy just dropped for me. it was no longer about clever combo's since it would not matter anyways because your whole setup could be screwed by the flip of a coin, or the lack of Unown G.
 
Heck no it's not going down.

The numbers are way up at every level. With few exceptions, there is more participation in Battle Roads and Cities. States we way up, as were Regionals. And the US Nationals numbers speak for themselves.

Is the format stale? Maybe a little, but it always is at this time of the season, right before Worlds. But it should be fascinating (and I really mean FASCINATING) to see how the decks progress this year in light of no rotation of cards. This should be fasci... er, INTERESTING!
 
-.-' I meant the playing quality with all the negetaivity factors. And don't present the numbers of your awesome big American Nats, I would just not get it as European what 1200 peeps of different ages have to do with the quality of the game going down...
 
Is the game going downhill? Of course not. Our attendance numbers climb every year. This format is one of the best I've seen (I know many would disagree with me on this). Why is it the best? There IS no dominant deck. Every archetype has a chance in this format, which is how it should be. However, this can be a double edged sword, because having this makes it hard to make deck choices and it's hard to know what you need to tech for. Gengar isn't very hard to play around, nor is Machump. If a donk happens, oh well, move on.
 
-.-' Am I speaking gibberish or something? Or do you people just don't get that numbers don't always have to proof that somethiing is going up or downhill?

I'd be glad if someone got it and would say something along the lines of:"It's going downhill for die-hard fans, and Up for the rich noobs who are obsessed with the anime and uber legendaries."
 
afstandopleren said:
-.-' Am I speaking gibberish or something? Or do you people just don't get that numbers don't always have to proof that somethiing is going up or downhill?
Click to expand...

A prime example? 4Kids dubs! (... God, I might get banned for that one.)

Anyway, I don't think the game is suffering as much as it was two sets ago. Stormfront WAS bad for us, not just for Machamp and Gengar. We also had Dusknoir. Anyone remember that fellow? He was a BEAST. However, two sets later, we only have Machamp and Gengar to 'worry about'. Why? Because people consider them easier to play.

I'm sorry, but Machamp and Gengar aren't just awful because of their attacks and abilities. It goes beyond that. The two are Auto-Pilot decks, regardless of what anyone says.

Fortunately, neither of these Auto-Pilot decks won Nationals; LuxApe did. I have more distaste for Luxray than a lot of you; I really didn't see what was so amazing about the Level X (woohoo, you get the same effect as Gust of Wind and an attack that hurts your own Pokemon. Oh, by the way, ALAKAZAM FOR YOU.), though I give the basic itself credit. I love Infernape, though, so it came out well in the end for me.

My point from all of this rambling? Machamp and Gengar aren't the biggest concerns at the time. Notice how neither placed in the Top 4 at Nats for Masters? (Gengar may have... I can't remember.)

People have obviously learned how to play around it, for the moment.

Just wait until SV, when we get Relicanth...

Ahem... In spite of this, some of my friends are leaving the game. They just can't stand all of the donks, and that's because of the fact that they either (A. cannot prepare for it, (B. will not prepare for it, or (C. cannot acknowledge the fact that their decks just might not work, given the conditions of the format.

Like I said, Machamp and Gengar aren't much to worry about anymore (in my opinion), but that doesn't mean any old deck will work. This coming from a Snorlax player probably isn't very convincing, but I understand when an idea won't work and move on afterward. (Or I just keep that idea for league play and surprise people at tournaments, give or take.)
 
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