Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

And you thought US Nationals was your last chance for Championship Points...

Translation - no one wants Jimmy Ballard and myself to just make a "Grinch" run at this title!!!!

I think it is going to be a bizarre event, with a lot of questions at the table asking "how many points do you need?"

I frankly don't think I'd enter, if I was paired against a player who was close, that would make me have to lose, even in round 1 and end my event.

After some scenarios with players LYING about their points, I may require a printout from someone showing me their CP before I would scoop.

All in all, I hope to be battling for the cup at that time anyway!

Vince
 
I agree the point of the tournament is points, The only thing points really do is get you to worlds. So why let someone who can't get to worlds in? I could see you maybe lowering it to maybe 120 Point minimum as if they make T16 in the National tournament that puts them within range but the fact that people want to make it to worlds is the important thing, If someone who has just come to play in this event after not playing at all the whole season performs well it does nothing for them... and get's rid of others opportunities to make it into worlds.
 
Pikajew1213 said:
I agree the point of the tournament is points, The only thing points really do is get you to worlds. So why let someone who can't get to worlds in? I could see you maybe lowering it to maybe 120 Point minimum as if they make T16 in the National tournament that puts them within range but the fact that people want to make it to worlds is the important thing, If someone who has just come to play in this event after not playing at all the whole season performs well it does nothing for them... and get's rid of others opportunities to make it into worlds.
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According to the new schedule for Nationals, the top 16 will have taken place the day before, so those who lost there will have already earned their 80/60 points and if those points put them over 200 they will be over 200 before the LCCP tourney starts. If they limit it (which I do not think they will) it will be for those who are within 200.
 
Pikajew1213 said:
I agree the point of the tournament is points...
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Then you probably should go back and re-read some posts:

Professor Dav said:
Your* purpose for the tournament may be for more people to get to Worlds, our purpose is to provide the *opportunity* to get the points necessary to qualify for Worlds, and to provide additional value on Sunday for Nationals.

Our intent is to let anyone who wishes to preregister go ahead and do so, and if they make the T8, they'll be asked to drop from prereg (or, we'll simply do it for them) as they will have the points necessary at that time to qualify.

Thank you,
Prof Dav
Click to expand...

Emphasis added.
 
Pablo said:
Yeah Mexico got 5 States, and the US equivalent would be being able to attend States in New York and in California. Not very feasible even if they're different dates right?
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I understand, honestly Texas is a large state - OK is 8 hrs away and Louisiana is 8 hrs away. We do however have regionals as from what I understand Mexico does not have.

Assuming from what other people said here, Mexico has a decent size player base (compared to the other organized play countries), but has a small nationals (compared to the US).

Also Dav mentioned allegations of shady stuff, now I do not live in Mexico but his post seemed out of place.
Plus since Dave's here is there going to be a LCQ at worlds?
 
Great idea, but should obviously be open only to those with 200-399 CP at the close of play on Saturday evening. You can't with any sort of logical consistency prohibit those with 400 or more CP from entering the tournament while simultaneously allowing those with under 200 CP to enter. Every round you are going to have players asking their opponents whether they could possibly qualify or not, and when some of those players inevitably play against someone who cannot qualify, not only is there is going to be a bunch of natural pressure on that player to scoop, but there is going to be an incentive for the other player to bribe. You are going to have people qualifying for Worlds just because they were lucky enough to play against people who couldn't qualify. Not to mention the possibility of collusion.

I know it would be logistically difficult to figure out who can qualify and who cannot between the close of play Saturday evening and the start of this tournament Sunday morning, but this could be a really ugly event if you don't.
 
So, let me get this straight: Everyone has known from last Fall what the requirements for a World’s invitation are, namely 400 CP. The player base has had all season to get the CP if an invite was their goal. Then reality sets in, and some people realize they will not make it. We cannot all win all the time.

But wait, out of left field it is announced that there will be the Last Chance for CP Tournament. A second chance so to speak to get to 400. If I were a direct beneficiary of this stroke of luck, I would be so happy at the opportunity to earn the needed points, REGARDLESS of the competition. But, NOOOOOOOO? Almost everyone here thinks it has to be made as easy as possible for people to get an extra 200 CP. Think about that, what other tournament can you play no one in the roughly top 50, and get 200 CP? What other tournament can you get 200 CP, period?

If no one thinks that this tournement can be run without collusion, bribery, etc., then we all need to stop playing the game because it has no integrity.

I am nowhere near 200 CP, but I might play in this tournament. I might even beat one of you. You can then call me all kinds of names and label me a Grinch. But how is this tournament any different than any other tournament I played in this year? I was not playing to earn a World’s invite in those either, I was playing for the fun of it, and I have over 40 Play Points, so that was quite a few tournaments. Since many of my opponents were trying to get invites, the logic displayed here must dictate that I should have scooped every one of my matches against a “competitive” player, else I would be grinching them.

Heaven forbid people EARN their CP and EARN their invitations at the table.
 
Ness said:
Yes, absolutely! Top 256 with awards for Top 16 or Top 128 with awards for Top 8... it's the same thing, except with the latter you won't have as many shenanigans and hurt feelings. (An alternative of Top 128 and less points is an option, too.)
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Well, Dan said in a smaller field like this they'd only award to T4 or T2 maybe. It an interesting question....how big should the field be to merit 200 points to 4 players, 100 pts to the next 4, and 50 pts to the last 8?

If less points is an option as you say (100 CP max instead of 200 CP), well, then you're narrowing the field even further by preventing the 200-300 range from registering.


mattalvis, you explained the problems that might manifest very well. I'd be curious if you can see a way to impose the additional registration restrictions yet make a tournament worthy of the point awards being discussed?
 
Yeah^ 200 points gets me worlds and as I only have 212 Even t16 then 100 points from this will not put me through I essentially need the 200 points from this....
 
losjackal said:
mattalvis, you explained the problems that might manifest very well. I'd be curious if you can see a way to impose the additional registration restrictions yet make a tournament worthy of the point awards being discussed?
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I assume your concern is that if you limited it to players with 200-399 CP that you wouldn't fill 256 seats? That's definitely a fair concern and one wouldn't be wrong to worry that you are giving out all these points for a tournament that draws only 100-150 players, if that. But you could argue that point-getters in a <400 tournament are just as "unworthy" of the CP's because of the scooping concerns.

I would limit it to those with 200-399 and suggest a CP structure that both varies with attendance and is appropriately spread out (although not TOO spread out, because then you create scooping concerns if a player reaches 400 CP in too early of a round - this will probably be a problem no matter what you do).
 
More correctly stated, but you do mean players within 200 points of an invite not 200-399 cp right alvis?
 
Just sharing my opinion on what could be done.
The problems that someone pointed out of heyfonte for facebook are:
1. If 400+ is being restricted, then 0-200 should also be restricted.
2. People getting points this way aren't earning them vs. the people who played consistently throughout the year.
If we fix the first problem, then we have a new problem, we open up the problem of not being enough people to reach the 128, 128, and 256 limits, and we might have like only 100 in the younger divisions, and 200 in the masters, just odd ball numbers that aren't powers of 2.
So that's partly why we need those others that are 201+ away from invite to play, is to create enough attendance. Being a single elimination tournament, the challenge is making a consistent list anyways. If you are good, and deserve the invite, you will beat the people in this tournament. You can't prevent scoops, and helping others in any tournament, of any size, high risk or low risk events.
One thing though that I could see, is we should make sure that its first come first serve, but, if you are within 200 points of invite, you are bumped to the front of the pack. If the pack were to go over 256, 128, and 128, then its first come first serve from those people. If we were to not have enough, like say in the masters with a guaranteed max of 256, and 170 show up that are within the invite range with this tournament, then we have too few people. So in another registration line that are for people not in range of invite, the first 86 in line will make it in the tournament. That way we made sure everyone that could get an invite is in, and that we have enough people for a legit tournament with the cp points for top 16, top 8, and winning top 8.
Now there will still be scoops, but that's something about tournaments. You need to do good no matter what. Think of this as a huge 5 or 6 round battle rounds, depending on attendance. There isn't a separated top cut, you must be the X-0 to win the event. There isn't a restriction in battle roads to play on points, many go for sabotage or to help friends, this event is the same. Someone might play against people they know for all the rounds, and if that happens, how does that affect you? They will probably do bad at worlds if they can't get a legit invite, but as long as YOU run hot, YOU chose a consistent list, and YOU outplayed your opponents when it comes to that, then YOU SHOULD NOT have any problems getting your invite. As long as YOU don't lose to those who have friends helping them in the round they get match-ed up with you, you will be just fine.
Just my opinion, if you do good, and with luck as all card games have, then you will be fine. Plus you probably shouldn't be relying on unexpected last chance tournaments. This is the first time they are doing it like this, I'm sure it will improve in the future as long as you nicely suggest options and give ideas.
 
Raikouthelegend7 said:
Just sharing my opinion on what could be done.
The problems that someone pointed out of heyfonte for facebook are:
1. If 400+ is being restricted, then 0-200 should also be restricted.
Click to expand...

Not at all. If I was in the country or if I had the funds to come to US Nationals (Which is something I want to be present at one day) Then I'd like the chance to enter. We only need 200 CP to Qualify in APAC, not 400. So if I am at 150, I only need 50 points - that to me seems like I am finishing off my invite, and makes me apart of the target audience for this event.

A better rule IF they were going to restrict it; NA players with 0-200 cannot enter. That would make more sense.

And people are still forgetting about the Grinder at Worlds - there is no confirmation on how that will be structured. So if you can get CP based on how deep you run, then that makes this event relevant for those in NA who are at 0-200 CP.
 
I agree with RaikoutheLegend, in the fact that if we only allowed those within 200 points, we would not max out event attendance. I think the major point has to be that those within 200 points of their invite should be FIRST on the list of entrants. This way nobody with say 50 CP can bump out somebody who actually needs it. Then after those within the 200 range anybody is also free to enter, but may be bumped out if people in the range continue to join. This way, it achieves both of P!P goals, in giving a last chance at Championship Points, as well as giving more event opportunities on Sunday. Also to those who complain they might be knocked out of the tournament by someone who doesn't need the points, the whole point is that you need to perform very well in the tournament in order to earn those points, so just get over having to win games of Pokemon. It's kind of the whole point of the game. If you can't win games to earn those points, no matter the opponent, you don't deserve them.
 
mattalvis said:
...giving out all these points for a tournament that draws only 100-150 players, if that. But you could argue that point-getters in a <400 tournament are just as "unworthy" of the CP's because of the scooping concerns.
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I see what you are saying. If the tournament only consists of people within invitation range, theoretically there is no scooping.

However, yet another problematic filter remains: of those people, how many have no plans or means to get to Vancouver the next month? Arguably they stand to gain nothing with this tournament other than recorded number of points, so the possibility of intentional scooping appears again.

Said another way, if you're going to limit it to exclude people who have qualified already, or don't have enough points to qualify, you could also exclude players that won't travel to Vancouver. Where do you draw the line? TPCi made a choice.

mattalvis said:
I would limit it to those with 200-399 and suggest a CP structure that both varies with attendance and is appropriately spread out (although not TOO spread out, because then you create scooping concerns if a player reaches 400 CP in too early of a round - this will probably be a problem no matter what you do).
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Right, but is 200 points fixed? Because if that's suddenly a variable, then it alters who you let into the tournament. It's all relative. TPCi chose to award half an invitation to 4 players, and to justify that they decided they need 256 players. Again, it's just one way it could go. The suggestions coming up on this thread aren't addressing the whole situation.

LionheartEX said:
And people are still forgetting about the Grinder at Worlds - there is no confirmation on how that will be structured. So if you can get CP based on how deep you run, then that makes this event relevant for those in NA who are at 0-200 CP.
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I don't know when this was published, but it does set expectations for what players can expect at the Worlds LCQ:

http://www.pokemon.com/us/play-pokemon/championship-series/world-championships/lcq/
 
Raikouthelegend7 said:
Just sharing my opinion on what could be done.
The problems that someone pointed out of heyfonte for facebook are:
1. If 400+ is being restricted, then 0-200 should also be restricted.
Click to expand...

Why?

Remember, it was clearly stated that the purpose of this side event is to add value to Nationals. It is completely at the discretion of TPCi whom to allow. Those with over 400 points aren't allowed to prevent "grinching"; the practice of winning to prevent others from qualifying.

So besides some people possibly attending from countries with lower points requirements for Worlds, we then come to the need to make the tournament competitive enough to justify awarding points at all. Again, as has been stated they will award less if they restrict attendance further, and if players engage in rule manipulation don't count on this happening again.
 
Otaku said:
Why?

Remember, it was clearly stated that the purpose of this side event is to add value to Nationals. It is completely at the discretion of TPCi whom to allow. Those with over 400 points aren't allowed to prevent "grinching"; the practice of winning to prevent others from qualifying.

So besides some people possibly attending from countries with lower points requirements for Worlds, we then come to the need to make the tournament competitive enough to justify awarding points at all. Again, as has been stated they will award less if they restrict attendance further, and if players engage in rule manipulation don't count on this happening again.
Click to expand...

well, it's not fair to only add value for people of less than 400 CP.... This is what people are arguing.
 
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