Gengar Prime Not as Broken as it's Hype says??

[Beltiger]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Gengar sucks or anything. But this just goes to show that Gengar isn't the (theoretical) problem, Lost World is.

Without that Stadium card, this discussion probably doesn't happen.

The real trick is NOT to play the Stadium until six Pokemon are in the Lost Zone. So they will be HOLDING the Stadiums until needed. Uh...Poltergeist anyone?

Gengar Prime will change a few things and make people think. That's what the game is about. Making people think.

We can argue about it all day, but the truth is that later this month we will all get some experience with Gengar Prime and see how it really fits into the MetaGame where we play.

Until then, the best laid plans of mice and men........:thumb:

 

[Kayle]

You could just Judge/Initiative their Lost World all day...

Sablock will love this card. If enough people play it, I see Sablock winning 50%+ of cities. Callin' it right here.

You will be so wrong. So, so wrong.

Sablelock won't like it at all. It will be just another deck. The only thing it might like is that it means more Gastlys (which are easily donkable) see play. That's about it.

Sableye runs at most 2 Judge and 3 Initiative. The former is dangerous, the latter is flippy and also generally only used early game. How are you going to stop them from Huntering + Uxie-ing or PONTing to get their Lost World, and how is it going to help you for long?

---------- Post added 10/17/2010 at 09:25 PM ----------

We can argue about it all day, but the truth is that later this month we will all get some experience with Gengar Prime and see how it really fits into the MetaGame where we play.

Until then, the best laid plans of mice and men........:thumb:

This basically summarizes the rest of what I want to say about Gengar.

I think it will be a format-altering deck, but that doesn't make it BROKEN.

 

[Mewtral]

Not that it's going to be big, but Weavile UD would be the ideal counter here. As stated above, the stadium makes gengar prime powerfull, so attack the stadium directly. There are not many cards that can grab stadiums in the discard pile, and you can almost predict when they'll play Lost World. So, find a way to drop this card to your opponents discard pile, or lost zone, and they suffer.

@Kayle:
Jumped me, but if they want to use twins, that's an even harder card to get around. Unless, your tied on prizes. Then, the situation starts taking a turn, because if either person's prize count lowers, it allows twins to be seen. And neither side wants it to be seen. So, time would probably be called, but before time is called, whoever's turn it is before then would quickly grab a prize. That, or someone draws into what they need. I do agree with you though, it isn't broken.

 

[Kayle]

That's very clever, but since I doubt they will run less than 3 Lost Worlds, it will be hard to use Weavile to take out all three/four in quick succession before they can find and lay another one.

 

[Mewtral]

That's very clever, but since I doubt they will run less than 3 Lost Worlds, it will be hard to use Weavile to take out all three/four in quick succession before they can find and lay another one.

It's all about the twins. How fast can a stadium be grabbed compared to a stage1. And, SSU and Hunter also cause for multiple disruption. I have a feeling that a weavile deck, made just to counter a gengar prime deck, wouldn't focus on grabbing a single prize before handling the Stadium issue. Wether it be by taking out twins, or lost worlds along the way. Maybe even the whole hand. Either way, the hand is the target, not gengar.

 

[Kayle]

You knock their twins, what if they PONT and draw it?

A pure Weavile deck would be wrecked by whatever is left of the format (mostly Dialga), ESPECIALLY if it has trouble taking prizes, which I would guess to be the case if you're saying it will be able to out-twins Gengar...

 

[Mewtral]

@Kayle:
Luck is Luck. Drawing into one early game means nom nom for Weavile. Drawing one on time is noes noes for Weavile.

I never said it would be bad at drawing prizes, just waiting to strike. But your right about the dialga. If anyone needs a specific counter right now, it's dialga. XD

 

[waynegg]

It would be a very stupid Gengar player to allow you to hold that Weavile in your hand so you can use it at the most opportune moment...

Edit: Dialga G counter all you have to do is drag up a non SP Pokemon (e.g. a Pixie) and lock it active. It's not 100% fail safe, but it does the job easily enough. It's built into the deck and you only need it to work for a single turn.

 

[Mewtral]

@waynegg:
... ... ... waynegg-1; mewtral-0
However, Weavile isn't always going to be in the hand. SSU, Hunter, and BTS add to the drama. But you are right.

Just a randomn question, is there a pokemon that has an attack that looks at the hand then discards one card? If so, that should probably be played as a counter.

 

[waynegg]

Umm...Gengar itself? Just it has to be a Pokemon and it goes to the LZ instead? There are a couple to discard a random card but I'm drawing a blank on any that do exactly what you are asking for.

 

[indercarnive]

also heres a newe thing to consider. next set rotation! if platinum gets knocked back. sps lose so much speed and sablelock dies. alot of cards now here we're saying to kill it might be out next rotation. most cards in geng prime decks are form the hs series. meaning this deck can outlast most of its killers.

 

[Kayle]

The season JUST STARTED. No one is thinking about the rotation yet! ;P

 

[Yoshi-]

The season JUST STARTED. No one is thinking about the rotation yet! ;P

I do, all the time, the only reason I havent already sold all my cards :/

@Topic
Gengar is broken, I'm pretty sure, but I still havent really figured out the best way to run it, oyu have a lot of possibilitys

 

[Banette EX]

Its so many cards that benefit thhis deck. Does 40 to anything in anyway is nice if you want to spread and use the Lv.X. 2 Prime is all thats needed tho, since once u get one with 2 energy, you will be able to use its attack twice to hit 1-3 pokemon. Lookers, Mr.Mime, even Mime Jr can be throw in this deck to just discard top cards.

 

[arMILO]

it is THAT broken. don't kid yourself

 

[waynegg]

Being that 2-3 T/S/S are going to be absent from the set (barring Hunter being translated as Assassin or another T/S/S being translated with something alphabetically before 'BL") they could very well be Hunter, Lost World, and Twins which would make this discussion completely moot.

 

[Ninja]

idk... Weavile can be a force to be reckoned with...

And dont forget theyre gonna be spamming hunter as you said lol
pick up weavile and use its power AGAIN!
unless they lost zone it o.o


but Im sure you can use your own hunters to make it difficult for them...

also weavile can stand a chance against A LOT of decks... the main factor, destroy their recovery, their level Xs, and their main attackers...

It can pretty much make a deck useless... more than gengar can...

Simple as that.... Run it with a similar type or something completely different and proceed to destroy... I mean you use its power at the right time and it can destroy your opponents, especially if they only run 1 palmers/ flower shop girl...

 

[Kayle]

Being that 2-3 T/S/S are going to be absent from the set (barring Hunter being translated as Assassin or another T/S/S being translated with something alphabetically before 'BL") they could very well be Hunter, Lost World, and Twins which would make this discussion completely moot.

Source on this? I am excited to hear it, even if it completely messes up my theorymonning.

 

[Muk Man]

Gengar only needs to get 6 pokemon in the lost zone right?...Well if im right sp runs like 15-17 basic pokemon.. theres only 6 bench spaces... and as seen in battle roads with Vileplume/Gengar getting cards outta your hand is harder than you think.

This format is gonna be Gengar vs Gengar... if someone creates a CONSISTENT gengar counter, they will go down in pokemon history

---------- Post added 10/18/2010 at 11:13 PM ----------

Gengar only needs to get 6 pokemon in the lost zone right?...Well if im right sp runs like 15-17 basic pokemon.. theres only 6 bench spaces... and as seen in battle roads with Vileplume/Gengar getting cards outta your hand is harder than you think.

This format is gonna be Gengar vs Gengar... if someone creates a CONSISTENT gengar counter, they will go down in pokemon history

By the way... Gengar prime has Pure Power.. with Litterally swept pokemon for an ENTIRE YEAR!

 

[waynegg]

Source on this? I am excited to hear it, even if it completely messes up my theorymonning.

Look at the card numbers from what has been revealed. Or you can look here. I missed the post too. Baby mario brought it to my attention.