International OP Programs
- Thread starter J_Nack
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DaytonGymLeader
New Member
Rocket's Mewtwo was the June BZ Promo.
Ian and company - give us an address where we can send care packages to you guys to keep things running. I'm pretty sure that some, if not all of us, can scrounge up something that we're not already doling out for our own leagues.
Ian and company - give us an address where we can send care packages to you guys to keep things running. I'm pretty sure that some, if not all of us, can scrounge up something that we're not already doling out for our own leagues.
When I read that there are many leagues in Italy or leagues in the UK, I just say WOW !
As far as I know, there are 2 active leagues remaining in Belgium. One with very young players, most of them playing with starter decks (the other players do play another game now), and another one with 18 YGO players and 2 Pokemon players. These are the two who have forgotten their YGO cards at home !
I haven't heard, for a couple of weeks, about 2 friends who were GL, and it is possible that leagues are active there.
You want to play a tournament ? Except small tournaments at the first mentioned league where you meet the same kind of decks, it seems to be the desert. No info at all and if you want to play a tournament, you have to go to Holland.
We're not talking about support or promos (even if the new promos would be great in my collection
), we're talking about places to play.
Will it change in the future ? I do hope so. But the whole OP system will have to be rebuild. It had taken a very long time to Wizards to build a good net of leagues, maintaining and creating leagues run by people who know the game, closing the leagues run by people who didn't even know that a trainer is not a basic, having TO's who ran regular tournaments, ...
Yes TheGame, Pokemon and YGO could live side by side. But most of the players choose one game only because their budget is not unlimited. I've talked with many people who played Pokemon who now say : Pokemon has stopped, we're not sure of the future, if it starts again how will it be supported and organized and for how long ? We prefer to put our money in a game that is developing now, especially as it is growing fast and as we play that game with our friends. IOW, better put money in a game that is played and that seems to have a future instead of in a game that I would be alone to play and that has a past.
As far as I know, there are 2 active leagues remaining in Belgium. One with very young players, most of them playing with starter decks (the other players do play another game now), and another one with 18 YGO players and 2 Pokemon players. These are the two who have forgotten their YGO cards at home !
I haven't heard, for a couple of weeks, about 2 friends who were GL, and it is possible that leagues are active there.
You want to play a tournament ? Except small tournaments at the first mentioned league where you meet the same kind of decks, it seems to be the desert. No info at all and if you want to play a tournament, you have to go to Holland.
We're not talking about support or promos (even if the new promos would be great in my collection
), we're talking about places to play.Will it change in the future ? I do hope so. But the whole OP system will have to be rebuild. It had taken a very long time to Wizards to build a good net of leagues, maintaining and creating leagues run by people who know the game, closing the leagues run by people who didn't even know that a trainer is not a basic, having TO's who ran regular tournaments, ...
Yes TheGame, Pokemon and YGO could live side by side. But most of the players choose one game only because their budget is not unlimited. I've talked with many people who played Pokemon who now say : Pokemon has stopped, we're not sure of the future, if it starts again how will it be supported and organized and for how long ? We prefer to put our money in a game that is developing now, especially as it is growing fast and as we play that game with our friends. IOW, better put money in a game that is played and that seems to have a future instead of in a game that I would be alone to play and that has a past.
Absolutely right NoPoke.
But the difference between you and some other European countries is probably that, in these countries, people think that advertising and tournament play (OP) must be done in collaboration with the companies that are involved in the game (and make money too).
You, in the UK, have kept on doing it alone, like you do for so long, with very little, or no support at all.
But the difference between you and some other European countries is probably that, in these countries, people think that advertising and tournament play (OP) must be done in collaboration with the companies that are involved in the game (and make money too).
You, in the UK, have kept on doing it alone, like you do for so long, with very little, or no support at all.
If I'm right :
- one (or more) distributor will be designated to be responsible of POP in each country
- people who want to be involved in POP will have to apply to that distributor only for beeing TO or LC or get support for the events
- no other people/company can be contacted in the country about POP
Is that legal ?
Imagine a country with 3 distributors. Only one of them, or maybe 2, will be 'official distributor' and will be responsible for OP in the country.
Of course, that distributor will work with their customers, and beeing customer will be the key if you want to have support. We're not talking about a game here, we're talking about money !
Why do you think you had (or maybe will have ) to have a shop selling cards and related products to have a league ? Responsibility, insurrance, ... ? I'm responsible of a soccer team and the kids want to play after the training, ... will I have a league ? The director of the school is ok for giving room for a league that could be organized on Saturday afternoon. Will I have a league and support if I don't have a shop or if a shop is not linked to the league ? NO ! The only link between leagues and shops is ... sales and money.
But let's say I have a shop and I work with the third distributor for a very long time. I have excellent contacts there, quick delivery, good prices, absolutely no reason to change of supplier.
But I want to have a Pokemon league because kids are interested in it. What will I have to do ? Will I have the authorization of running a league ? Will I receive the support (kits, info, support for events, ...) from a company with which I'm not in business ? Will I have to quit my distributor and buy to the 'official' one ?
Honestly, I don't believe that a distributor will give support to someone who buys products somewhere else, and I'm quite sure that beeing a customer will be an essential condition to have the league and the support.
I'm not a lawyer, but I think it's called a monopoly and it's illegal according to the EEC laws.
It is also unfair competition as a company has specific advantages and may use them to sell to other companies customers and force them to buy to that company.
Any comments ?
Skywolf1
New Member
Frustrated. Frustrate \Frus"trate\, v. t. [imp. & p. p. Frustrated; p. pr. & vb. n. Frustrating.] 1. To bring to nothing; to prevent from attaining a purpose; to disappoint; to defeat; to baffle; as, to frustrate a plan, design, or attempt; to frustrate the will or purpose.
Like my life, this also perfectly describes my feelings towards Nintendo at this juncture. I have TRIED and TRIED and TRIED to support Europe and the International Community through NUMEROUS phone calls and e-mails, with the HOPE that something GOOD would come out of it.
I am very saddend (and VERY disturbed) that this hopes have yet to be realized.
I will keep trying for as long as I can, however I really don't know if I can take to much more of what has been dealt to me as of late.
I will attempt to contact PUIand International OP again, and lets HOPE that something positive becomes of these attempts soon.
Take Care,
Skywolf1
Like my life, this also perfectly describes my feelings towards Nintendo at this juncture. I have TRIED and TRIED and TRIED to support Europe and the International Community through NUMEROUS phone calls and e-mails, with the HOPE that something GOOD would come out of it.
I am very saddend (and VERY disturbed) that this hopes have yet to be realized.
I will keep trying for as long as I can, however I really don't know if I can take to much more of what has been dealt to me as of late.
I will attempt to contact PUIand International OP again, and lets HOPE that something positive becomes of these attempts soon.
Take Care,
Skywolf1
NoPoke
Active Member
Michel... don't worry the distributors I've spoken with are so fed up with Nintendo they don't want much to do with OP!
Obviously I don't know how much product they ship but if Nintendo start making it dificult they could easily decide not to bother and concentrate on some other games that are less troublesome.
Distributors won't bother with suppliers that are difficult unless the product offers suitible financial recompense.
Still no sign of the 30 league kits.....maybe we will find out something about delivery after the NEXT meeting in Essen. All this international travel must be costing PUI a fortune.
Obviously I don't know how much product they ship but if Nintendo start making it dificult they could easily decide not to bother and concentrate on some other games that are less troublesome.
Distributors won't bother with suppliers that are difficult unless the product offers suitible financial recompense.
Still no sign of the 30 league kits.....maybe we will find out something about delivery after the NEXT meeting in Essen. All this international travel must be costing PUI a fortune.
ukpokemonpro
New Member
Hang on that's an American posting a very ukpro'/NoPoke post??
ROFL Marsh my man welcome to our world where emails go unanswered and phone calls leave you feeling warm and comforted like being urinated on ...
Today I spoke to the second UK distributor about their frustrations with PUI inaction and the master plan to deliver OP Internationally by getting someone else to pay for it when there is nothing in it really for them...??
Crazy days and still we hear world wide release of Dragons planned simulataneously but unless they move quickly NOW there will be no pre-releases in the UK AGAIN..
Marcello-Milord
New Member
As Europe is also Italy, I want to update you about our situation (if that may interest anyone).
We actually have 2 distributors. 1 i sthe one listed on pokemon-tcg.com, but is charged to the merely distribution of product to the mass-market.
The other one is responsible for translations, distribution, and OP.
I wrote to both distributors asking the situation after the Barcelona meeting. I also phoned to the second one (the OP one) for a direct answer.
The first answered to my mail only today (after 2 weeks), telling me that they are oinly responsible about mass-market distribution.
The other distributor is a ghost.
They don't answer to the emails.
On the phone, the OP manager (which is also the manager of the company, if I understood correctly) is always busy... First time he was busy with another call, the second time he was in a meeting. Third time he was eating, the day after he was out. All times the secretary asked for my telephone number so when this guy was free, he would have phoned directly to me.
After 3 days, I don't have received any call from this distributor.
They announced only the distribution from end of October of the english release of the product, and from January 2004 the italian EX: Ruby/Sapphire product.
So we don't actually know what is happening in Italy about POP, and we have to work with someone who don't care about OP support...
I'm really fed up with them, and with PUI too. It's not a fair way to start all that.
At least, you UK guys are able to communicate with your distributors (I know it's not a big deal, but it's not nothing).
Players ask for Premier Tournaments. They are angry because Lucca will not have its usual tournament, and the Italian Mind Games' tournament in December is not totally confirmed (the site of the Convention says that there'll be a Pokémon tournament, but we don't know anything about that).
What to do? I don't know.
I'll keep running Leagues and Tournaments by myself, and giving help to all Professors and not-Professors who want to run Pokémon OP... If one day there'll be official support, tant mieux.
We actually have 2 distributors. 1 i sthe one listed on pokemon-tcg.com, but is charged to the merely distribution of product to the mass-market.
The other one is responsible for translations, distribution, and OP.
I wrote to both distributors asking the situation after the Barcelona meeting. I also phoned to the second one (the OP one) for a direct answer.
The first answered to my mail only today (after 2 weeks), telling me that they are oinly responsible about mass-market distribution.
The other distributor is a ghost.
They don't answer to the emails.
On the phone, the OP manager (which is also the manager of the company, if I understood correctly) is always busy... First time he was busy with another call, the second time he was in a meeting. Third time he was eating, the day after he was out. All times the secretary asked for my telephone number so when this guy was free, he would have phoned directly to me.
After 3 days, I don't have received any call from this distributor.
They announced only the distribution from end of October of the english release of the product, and from January 2004 the italian EX: Ruby/Sapphire product.
So we don't actually know what is happening in Italy about POP, and we have to work with someone who don't care about OP support...
I'm really fed up with them, and with PUI too. It's not a fair way to start all that.
At least, you UK guys are able to communicate with your distributors (I know it's not a big deal, but it's not nothing).
Players ask for Premier Tournaments. They are angry because Lucca will not have its usual tournament, and the Italian Mind Games' tournament in December is not totally confirmed (the site of the Convention says that there'll be a Pokémon tournament, but we don't know anything about that).
What to do? I don't know.
I'll keep running Leagues and Tournaments by myself, and giving help to all Professors and not-Professors who want to run Pokémon OP... If one day there'll be official support, tant mieux.
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Lucca ... :nonono:
One year ago we were preparing our decks for that nice event that had been announced as a qualifier for Worlds.
Today, I'm running YGO tournaments, I don't see any Pokemon event and I'm very happy that our Profs from Holland organize a tournament in Eindhoven in collaboration with their local distributor.
I've run a YGO tournament last Saturday, and I've said to my wife and daughter : 'If someone had told me in Lucca that one year later I would play, judge and run YGO events, I would have said he was totally crazy'.
OP and local distributors ? Those of you who know YGO will appreciate. Different tournaments are organized around here this month and we play LOB and MRD, the two sets available in Europe.
Just a little problem ... the distributor has not updated the cards limitations, and the LOB ones are still in application ! No restrictions on MRD cards. I'll make a deck with 3 Sangan, 3 Witch of the Dark Forest, 2Swords of RL ... and 3 Mirror Force, it is legal :lol:
It's like if 8 Sneasel and unlimited amount of Dark energies were allowed in Pokemon.
I don't want to shoot on the local distributors, I've had (and still have) problems enough by saying the truth and trying to see the respect of International rules and legal gameplay.
But I honestly don't think that OP is their job. They sell products, it's completely different, and products that make more money than Pokemon.
A guy who sells cars and televisions is not responsible for the organization of a Formula 1 season, ....
especially if he makes more money with televisions.
Just one question ... how many people, in the different companies who'll be responsible for OP in Europe, have already read the POP Floor rules, or even know that this basic document about tournaments does exist ?
Distributors will work with Professors ? Professors are OK to give a lot of their time for the game like they did in the past. But they deserve serious people to work with, not people who don't answer to the phone calls, to email, to questions, not people who don't know, and have no interest in, what they're talking about.
And don't forget that the Professors, THEY know the subject when they talk about the game.
Yes, OP is a specific job. Otherwise, why would it be an OP team, people who're busy with OP only, in the Wizards offices ? Not at PUI for POP in the USA ?
One year ago we were preparing our decks for that nice event that had been announced as a qualifier for Worlds.
Today, I'm running YGO tournaments, I don't see any Pokemon event and I'm very happy that our Profs from Holland organize a tournament in Eindhoven in collaboration with their local distributor.
I've run a YGO tournament last Saturday, and I've said to my wife and daughter : 'If someone had told me in Lucca that one year later I would play, judge and run YGO events, I would have said he was totally crazy'.
OP and local distributors ? Those of you who know YGO will appreciate. Different tournaments are organized around here this month and we play LOB and MRD, the two sets available in Europe.
Just a little problem ... the distributor has not updated the cards limitations, and the LOB ones are still in application ! No restrictions on MRD cards. I'll make a deck with 3 Sangan, 3 Witch of the Dark Forest, 2Swords of RL ... and 3 Mirror Force, it is legal :lol:
It's like if 8 Sneasel and unlimited amount of Dark energies were allowed in Pokemon.
I don't want to shoot on the local distributors, I've had (and still have) problems enough by saying the truth and trying to see the respect of International rules and legal gameplay.
But I honestly don't think that OP is their job. They sell products, it's completely different, and products that make more money than Pokemon.
A guy who sells cars and televisions is not responsible for the organization of a Formula 1 season, ....
especially if he makes more money with televisions.
Just one question ... how many people, in the different companies who'll be responsible for OP in Europe, have already read the POP Floor rules, or even know that this basic document about tournaments does exist ?
Distributors will work with Professors ? Professors are OK to give a lot of their time for the game like they did in the past. But they deserve serious people to work with, not people who don't answer to the phone calls, to email, to questions, not people who don't know, and have no interest in, what they're talking about.
And don't forget that the Professors, THEY know the subject when they talk about the game.
Yes, OP is a specific job. Otherwise, why would it be an OP team, people who're busy with OP only, in the Wizards offices ? Not at PUI for POP in the USA ?
As a side note: the Italian distributor is Nexus Edizioni, who manages LotR OP and distribution in Italy, is the exclusive reseller of Decipher product here and seems to be involved with some part of UpperDeck Italia (read: Yu-Gi-Oh) as well.
...at least they translate the cards RIGHT, unlike WotC's outsourced translator. Ugh...
- l0ne
PS: I had foreseen it: YGO isn't taking off here. The TV series were cut by censorship like a paper collage and aired at lunchtime (killing the first season in its entirety) and the card game was NOT publicized (not even on the magazines that regularly showed Pokémon TCG ads). While many who use to play Pokémon now also play YGO, it still hasn't took over.
...at least they translate the cards RIGHT, unlike WotC's outsourced translator. Ugh...
- l0ne
PS: I had foreseen it: YGO isn't taking off here. The TV series were cut by censorship like a paper collage and aired at lunchtime (killing the first season in its entirety) and the card game was NOT publicized (not even on the magazines that regularly showed Pokémon TCG ads). While many who use to play Pokémon now also play YGO, it still hasn't took over.
Tego
New Member
Michel said:
So what you're basically saying here is that you're letting Pokémon die and do nothing about it. Instead of supporting your local players and the remaining Pokémon fans, you jump from the sinking ship and join the YGO ship. You don't need the distributor's help for organizing. You can do like our UK friends always have done, and they have large tournaments with 60 players!
Pokémon dies in Belgium? You're letting it die.
Tego, don't you think I've done enough for Pokemon ?
Your accusations are highly appreciated !
YES, I let Pokemon die ! And YES I do confirm that I quit POP like I've explained to PUI in a mail I've sent them today. And finally YES I do now play YGO and run YGO tournaments.
Supporting my local players ??? But that's what I'm doing ! They're now playing YGO
As a member of Nintendo Norway, you probably don't understand that I consider that ALL the people concerned have to be involved in OP.
My UK friends are alone for such a long time, and their job is fantastic. Sorry, but even if I have admiration for them, I don't see things like that.
I would do the job alone, invest efforts, time and money while the people who have to take care of that, and who make a lot of money with Pokemon, look (and laugh) at me without doing anything ?
Sorry Tego, not for me.
I say, since I've started POP, that it is something that has to be done in collaboration. TO, GL, judges, Professors, Wizards, ... all the people who were involved in the game and in OP have to work together.
And I may add that OP has to be leaded by competent people, people who know what the game is, what a tournament is, people who are 'OP professionals'.
Give me the tools and conditions to do a good job in OP, and I'll spend as much time and will be as involved in it as I was in the past.
I consider that these tools and conditions don't and will not exist in my country, and instead of paticipating in someting I don't believe, I've decided to quit. As simple as that.
Remember Tego, I've played all over Europe and in the USA, organized a lot of tournaments in Belgium, been judge in different European countries at local and main events, judge at Worlds. I've helped different leagues, run a league in Brussels, opened a web site, tried to have as many contacts as possible with Wizards Europe for the community, helped in the Expedition release, shared a lot of information, made a lot of proposals about the game and the players, ...
If the ship is sinking, I'm not responsible. If the Pokemon players in Belgium are now playing YGO, I'm not responsible. If YGO has leagues, tournaments, main events and support while Pokemon has nothing I'm not responsible. If nobody cares about Belgian Professors while the French YGO distributors give us the opportunity to play, run and judge tournaments, I'm not responsible.
I love Pokemon, and I'll always love the game, but only playing with my daughter at home is not really interesting.
You may accuse me to let Pokemon die, accuse me to jump from the sinking ship. If you think that, I regret it but I respect your opinion.
Just a question ... why would we have to run OP alone ? Why are your bosses so silent for such a long time ? Who has deliberately taken the risk to kill the game last year when they've forbidden the release of Expedition in Europe (and who has fighten to save the game ? ) ?
Well, that's more than one question !
And finally, I don't believe in OP in the hands of local distributors, in a system that has already failed in the past. I truly hope I'm wrong and that Pokemon will have a bright future in Europe. POP plans for the USA are fantastic, and I'm sure that the plans for Europe will be great. But plans without the people to applicate them are just plans, and if it's interesting intellectually, it could be quite frustrating for the community.
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