Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Japan's New Format and some new BW rules

It's not the end of my world either way (pretty much just reverting back to how the game was when I started playing), but I really don't see how TPCI can pull this off without making a lot of people very angry.

They either rotate a lot more than they want (even though a sizable portion of players do seem to want HGSS-on) or they put rules into effect that make the dominant deck of the format into. . . the dominant deck of the format.
 
No matter what happens, this is what is in the official tournament formats documents

Pokémon Organized Play reserves the right to alter these rules, as well as the right to interpret, modify, clarify, or otherwise issue official changes to these rules, with or without prior notice.
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Looks to me Japan discovered their format was not healthy and made this new set of rules (going into effect immediatly)
So why should we keep the format as we know now any longer after B&W will be released outside Japan?
To keep XX sets in the format?
While keeping up to 13 sets into a format was something tried to achieve the last years, also this was mentioned

Now that we have achieved that goal, we will continue to rotate sets each year to ensure that our Organized Play environment remains healthy and vital moving forward.
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I honestly can't say our current environment (format) is moving forward at all.
 
If there was a mid-season cut, wouldn't that make a lot of decks unable then. I think from all of this, I think there probably will be a cut because it's not fair for the Japanese players to adjust to our format for Worlds. There goes my Vilegar :(
 
At least this is on the table. One of the most frustrating thing about some other games I've played is no matter how lousy the format, you know it isn't going to change early. The best you can hope for is that they copy Japanese restrictions and on the list that might be coming out 5 months before the set hits, mention "card X" is going to be restricted right away!
 
Prime said:
http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?t=42324

Here's a great thread.

You should notice that between 2005 and 2006, Pokemon USA, now TPCi rotated out 3 sets, Hidden Legends, Fire Red & Leaf Green, and Team Rocket Returns, to make the format Deoxys-on.

Your only reason for TPCi not rotating to Platinum-On is that it would be bad for the format.

We have two opposing sides.

I feel it would be highly illogical to rotate to RR-On because it would dissect SP decks (not just the ones that are Pwn'ing us at tournaments, but all of them -- just like how the rotation to Holon Phantoms-On in 2007 really hurt all the Delta Species decks, not just the winning ones) and because Platinum makes a very good "base set" with a lot of the Starters (for new players who want to collect the pokemon Ash has), and New Mechanics (Broken Time Space, for instance helping non-SP decks).

You feel it would be highly damaging to rotate to anything less than RR-On because SP decks would "dominate" for another year.

We both have decent reasons, but I feel that TPCi weighs the health of the format less than logical, commercially profitable, base sets.

Oh, and by your own words, TPCi normally rotates out 4 sets a year, so there are not very many options. I am 99.9% sure we won't get HGSS-On next year. That'd be rotating out 7 sets, and it would be against the whole "start out with 9 sets, end with 13" thing...which could change any second TPCi changes their goals for the game.
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Hmm, that is interesting, i suppose. The reason i suspect HG:SS-On as a legitimate alternative to PL-On is that it would be consistent with these new rules.

But seriously, dissecting SP decsk? Who cares? HP-On basically dissected delta decks etc. I doubt they'd be worried about dissecting them after three years at the top tables. Given these new rule changes which will probably come into effect next season, I think HG:SS-On would make the most sense because it's what japan's done to fit in with the new ruling system and it just feels consistent (a nerfed rare candy with broken-time space still in the format, for example? that seems weeiird)
 
I like the Grass S2 guy. 60 + Heal and free retreat? Yay!

Unless there's some facet of the rule we are not yet aware of, having Supporters discarded as soon as the effect resolves is just stupid, imo. As stated, that will cause SO many instances of cheating and misplays.
 
The Supporter rule is easily resolved outside of Japan by us keeping the text requiring it to be placed by the active, and then changing/modifying the rule that currently doesn't let them be targeted by cards looking at the discard pile.

Outside of Japan, we ignored the change from Trainers to Goods. Hopefully someone will see how the change opens the door for game play errors and will add in the Supporter Rule before the cards are printed.

Japan's use of errata is interesting: changing the cards to do something different instead of releasing a different card and letting the old one rotate out. I guess this is an extreme case of the Fossil errata where Fossils now could as KOed pokemon even though their text said otherwise for a very long time.

I find it odd that PlusPower, even though it was printed about 2 years ago, was gone for a very long time only to be reprinted and now given a major change. Would have made more sense to change it back in Platinum.
 
Diaz said:
Seriously. Can someone enlighten me? I don't see a clear indication either way?
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It seems like it should be allowed, since there was no clear indication to the opposite, though people have said yes to trainers and no to supporters in this thread.
 
*Prays to Arceus for a Mid Season Rotation and NEW Format!!*

IMHO it would be healthy for a mid season shift!

Here is hoping, but more than likely not.
 
Mkay, so it looks like Powers and Bodies are merged into Abilities...well, that does make sense if you consider the videogame source it's all based from. I dislike how they're revamping Great Ball to have Master Ball's effect, it makes all my perfectly usable Great Balls now into a crap card. Honestly, why did they feel the need to do this...the new Master Ball (presumably) better have an awesome effect to make up for screwing up Great Ball, though almost willing to bet it'll probably be the new Luxury Ball. Makes you wonder why they couldn't give Poke Ball Great Ball's effect instead of having it maintain that crappy flip effect to work...also, where's Ultra Ball in all of this?

I can't see the new Supporter rule (having to discard immediately) sticking; all player A has to do is claim that the Supporter they played this turn was played last turn and player B is then left complaining to the judge, who may or may not believe them. That or player B might not be paying attention (bad on their part), and thus A could get another free use. It does not make the playing field any less cluttered since Supporters are discarded at the end of the turn anyways, and it's pretty dang hard to mistake one for a Tool or something, which haven't historically been used a whole lot sans a couple of useful ones for some decks.

The Rare Candy ruling does make sense I suppose if you want to give people back the ability to use Trainers T1; it certainly cuts down on the whole "lol I donk you" effect that Rare Candy offers with the theoretical perfect hand (yes I'm looking at you Machamp), and I think it's a decent compromise to have in order to be able to play Trainers T1.

What else...looks like Legendary (or some form of it) is sticking around, that's always fun. Potion heals for 30 now, makes it a bit more useful. The new KO procedure, /shrug, makes no real difference if you're sending out a new active before your opponent takes a prize or after really. Pokemon Center I can't see being used that much frankly, healing your opponent's benched Pokemon is a pretty bad compromise for healing your own benched, may as well just tech in this new Jarorda thing in to your deck. Finally, why can't I have Max Potion now...

Honestly, I think that POP is more likely to just make our format either AR or HGSS-On and cut a minimum of 6 sets this year instead of the now "usual" 4; because cutting MD-PL and having RR-On is just kinda awkward when you consider SP Pokemon, and a midseason cut to AR or HGSS will just inevitably tick off some people if they happen to be using anything in RR or SV. So in this rare case, I'd be happier if they did a slightly more deeper cut than what they promised to normally do; it saves headaches and permanently kills off SPs instead of leaving them in an awkward half-alive position.
 
I agree that the Supporter remaining in play made it harder to cheat by playing two Supporters a turn but... seriously, it shouldn't make it that much harder. I mean, what about once-per-turn Poke-Powers? By that logic we need a tapping mechanic a la Magic so that people "can't" cheat with them.

People who want to cheat with Supporters already try to cheat with Supporters. I am one of those types who honestly slips and discards his Supporter early. It isn't because I want to cheat, it's because it (was and soon again) will be a Trainer and as an old, old player I am used to most Trainers hitting the board, then leaving the board. I don't suffer so much from Stadiums, but then again maybe I do an just never noticed. XD

Seriously though: cheating player right now plays Supporter, tries to distract you with another effect and subtly discards it (preferably under another card so that it isn't on top). Cheating player now discards it... claims to have to search their discard and tries to shuffle that Supporter farther down, or else has to burn a few cards to bury it for a plausible cheating technique. If they just go to play two in a row, you look at their discard and go "but you have a Supporter right on top!" Can't be anymore awkward than the number of times I've seen a player forget to discard their Supporter. ;)
 
To those who want a mid-season rotation this year: Please really think about that and how it would affect people. I'll use myself as an example. I have the components for the following competitive decks: DialgaChomp, Sabelock, Machamp/Umbreon, and Regigigas Lock, and with a little trading Gyarados, Gengplume, and T-tar. If we got a mid-season, every single one of those decks would go away, other than T-Tar, leaving me with mostly unplayable cards and only one playable deck. I'd lose most of my current rare tradeables and staples (as they are mostly from sets that would be rotated). Sure, I'd have all the trainers/supporters I'd need for an HGSS-on format, but I wouldn't have any Pokemon and would have to shell out a fair bit of money to keep playing, which I actually probably couldn't do. This doesn't sound like a good idea to me.

On the other side, if we just get a rotation next year, I can trade in anticipation of that, and have a playable pool of cards for next season. Of course, those who play at a high level for Nats/Worlds can't do that, but most people aren't in that exclusive group.
 
Otaku said:
I agree that the Supporter remaining in play made it harder to cheat by playing two Supporters a turn but... seriously, it shouldn't make it that much harder. I mean, what about once-per-turn Poke-Powers? By that logic we need a tapping mechanic a la Magic so that people "can't" cheat with them.

People who want to cheat with Supporters already try to cheat with Supporters. I am one of those types who honestly slips and discards his Supporter early. It isn't because I want to cheat, it's because it (was and soon again) will be a Trainer and as an old, old player I am used to most Trainers hitting the board, then leaving the board. I don't suffer so much from Stadiums, but then again maybe I do an just never noticed. XD

Seriously though: cheating player right now plays Supporter, tries to distract you with another effect and subtly discards it (preferably under another card so that it isn't on top). Cheating player now discards it... claims to have to search their discard and tries to shuffle that Supporter farther down, or else has to burn a few cards to bury it for a plausible cheating technique. If they just go to play two in a row, you look at their discard and go "but you have a Supporter right on top!" Can't be anymore awkward than the number of times I've seen a player forget to discard their Supporter. ;)
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How about Juniors who can't keep track of if they have played a Supporter or not. I'm not a fan of the changes at all.

The game (if anyone has noticed) since 2007 season has gotten progresively worse every year. The game which had some balance, now has none and it is really bad. I mean granted Transceiver was responsible for most of the balance, but they game wasn't filled with donks or with one deck that was way more powerful than any other. (GG in 2008 & LuxChomp in 2010, SP in 2011)

I'm not saying that the "sky is falling" as someone earlier stated, but more of a warning. No changes can be bad for a game, but the thing is we have some change. They rotate sets to influence change which to me is enough, but if they want to add a new card type (Legends/Stars/Ex/Shinings) (Primes to me aren't really anything at all other then they get a nice shiny border and are easy to get) that's fine, but to change the rules when they aren't needed isn't a good idea.

Here is my thought on some old rule changes.

Confusion - They changed it from 20 damage and you had to discard your energy to TRY to retreat to you can retreat and 3 damage counters. Nothing huge and the discarding your energy and having to flip was annoying when you got tails.

Stadium - Can replace a stadium with the same name. Explaination they gave made sense to me. You don't say, let's leave Stark Mountain to go to Stark Mountain.

Retreat - Retreating only once per turn makes the game faster and use more strategy. I don't have an issue with that change either when they did it.

No Trainers first turn - I'm not sure if being able to not play trainers is a good one or not, but with SP in the format it is something that is good. However saying that at of all the new rule changes this one bothers me the least.

Supporters - I think that new rule is stupid. The rule was to help you remember, removing it only hurts as now it is harder for people to remember if they played a supporter. I know people who are good players but sometimes mess up on the supporter bit. I'd also like to point out that figuring out if someone played one or two during a turn might be hard to figure out for judges.

Card Changes -

I'm not a fan of changing cards that are fine to begin with or things on cards that are fine. Abilites take the place (IMO) of Poke-Powers/Poke-Bodies is silly. I mean Powers/Bodies are fine, no reason to change it.

Rare Candy - Why? I really don't have to say more. :nonono:

Potion, Great Ball, PlusPower - Same as above, more so to PlusPower/Great Ball than Potion.

The way we do KOs and take prizes to me isn't a be deal, it is a procedural thing. I know I never focused on what my opponent brought up. Save for when I use Azelf (or have seen my prizes some other way), I always take them in the same order. So this change isn't too big.

I not sold that changing this to go back to what they are is a good thing, but I guess will we see. However, I'm not a fan of most of them.

Drew
 
Im usually the first one to whine but I dont get whats happening here?!

There rules are for hgss on and I think they make sence. Some stuff might sound odd but I think they put some thouht into this. The game got faster and faster and the powercreep was ridiculus so what did they do? Pull the emergency break, slow the game down a lot, restart. Will this be strange at first? Probably. Will the game be pretty basic in the beginning if we get this rotation? Probably. But I dont even mind this, some basic "charge your evolution line and smack your opponent" decks might actually be kinda fun and then the game can get more complex again, its a restart,, it might be odd at first but it had to happen at som point.

The Candy nerve makes sence in hgss on, the trainer one kinda makes sence as well. Of cource there rules will ruin our current format but these arent designed for our format and Id be REALLY surprised if we'd get these with sp and sableye still around.

And about the rotation discussion, I really think md-pt NEEDS to go. RR-on or HGSS on would both work, I know its kinda awkward that in rr-on some sp stuff would still be around (pointlessly) but does it matter? In HGSS-on those cards would be rotated, in RR-on theyre allowed but hardly any good, so if this confused you this much, just ignore them. There is not too much in rr-ar anyway but when sp is finally gone I'd like to see some cards from these sets (salamence x, tangrowth, arceus, garchomp sv etc) that never really took of get another chance. There is not too much to worry about in these 3 sets and if we can keep those cards around , why not? The broken stuff would be gone, all that would be left are some cards that might finally get some attention and some solid cards like garchomp sv, flygon, nidoqueen blaziken fb and more stuff. (this ones usable without any sps) And this is why I think RR-on would be a good idea, because it can balance the metagame and would still leave us with a bigger cardpool and some additional balanced options.


tldr; Dont panic, we dont know what will happen here, look at the changes in the right context, rr-on would be good
 
I think that most of these rules are pretty good, barring the Rare Candy thing. But for one thing, I hope and pray we don't get some weird Mid-season rotation. About half of my Cards and my DialgaChomp would be useless then. But, A) this hasn't been done before B) It would make most/some people angry, when their deck and cards turned useless, and they would have wasted money to buy PL Boosters Etc. THAT'S WHY THERE WON'T BE A MID-SEASON ROTATION IMO. It would make this game bad, unless BW Contained some draw Engine.
 
anyway, my opinon: great ball being changed greatly is just BAD! from getting a basic GUARANTEED! to reveal top 7 cards and choose one pokemon is just NOT RIGHT! Potion now restoring 30 hp is good: half a Moomoo milk.
rare candy being changed is just stupid in my opinion, although it stops people's ability to abuse it , it's just not RARE candy anymore.
the first turn t/s/s thing is just BAD! plain bad! SP can now set up turn one! This will lead to more donks, not stage two donks like champ and kingdra but ambipom g, beedril g, etc. Plus power being changed stopped shuppet in its tracks. In my opinion most of these rules are i guess good for japan but not for the rest of the world.

Everyone! Get your Sableyes out!

edit: New rules on other site have already been linked to in earlier posts. No need for repeated links of the same thing. - pop
 
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Everyone, let's all get together to make an email to POP begging them not to use these rules.:lol:
Ps: bring some money to bribe them.
 
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