Rotation announced!

[Mystery Thing]

So..they managed to pick a format rotation that will completely leave the meta as is. I don't know what to say. I wonder if the company realises that people play the TCG competitively at all. I can't imagine anyone looking at the meta and saying it's healthy. It's just fat Basics smashing into each other.

Which, for all we know, is exactly how Japan wants it. When you have a tournament structure that relies on as many people as possible playing as many games as possible in as little time as possible, it makes sense that they would want big basics beating on each other's faces all day. I don't know how much authority TPCI has in deciding what the rotation sets are, but I would think that Japan must have at least SOME input on the matter.

Anyways, what's to say that evolutions won't get a massive boost in XY1? Every time that a new block has been introduced, there's always been SOMETHING massive that was brought into the game (even if it was a bit of a dud - looking at you, non-x2 W/R and Lost Zone). Yes, the format will more or less be exactly the same until whenever it is that XY1 comes out, but for all we know, whatever new mechanics we get there could totally change things.

If we assume that EBB will be the final BW block set (ala CoL was to the HGSS block (yes, technically CoL wasn't in the HGSS block. Hush you.)), XY1 will hit Japan in what, November? So we'll get it before STPs for sure, and possibly before Winter Regionals if the TCG goes the way of the VGC and has simultaneous releases.

tl;dr: If XY1 brings anything at all new to the table, we'll really only have this format for autumn BRs, fall Regionals, and CCs. That really isn't that much longer.

Sorry, I haven't been playing long enough lately to understand the new rotations, but if I am understanding this rotation, I can still use my Emerging Powers Max Potions because they've been reprinted in another set?

Or do I HAVE to use the reprinted versions?

Yes, you can use EPO ones.

 

[espeon200]

My question is, why is the B&W Trainer Kit off? It's supposed to be a way to teach players how to play the game, but it's not listed on the legal list. Isn't the latest trainer kit usually legal until the rotation after a new one is released? If the trainer kit is legal and this is an oversight, then Energy Switch, Energy Retrieval, PlusPower and Pokemon Communication would remain in the format.

 

[Bilbo Baggins]

Sorry, I haven't been playing long enough lately to understand the new rotations, but if I am understanding this rotation, I can still use my Emerging Powers Max Potions because they've been reprinted in another set?

Or do I HAVE to use the reprinted versions?

You can use the old versions of a reprinted card if the text/name are identical. If the name changes, or actions of the card are different, then the older cards can't be used. (see Catcher / Gust of Wind + Computer Search)

Max Potions are identical, only the design is different, allowing older versions to be played.

 

[Notal]

So what is there to do about energy retrieval?

Another question: Didn't the NVI Terrakion get a secret rare reprint? I'm currently making a deck with an NVI Terrakion and I'm wondering if that is still legal.

 

[rivershock]

Yes, older versions of cards reprinted in a legal set are usable. (Barring huge changes to them like what happened to Computer Search and Pokemon Center.)

Heh, I like how there are very few noteworthy promos going. A lot have been reprinted, and a lot of the rest are evolving Basics that are much worse than usable ones. I'll miss the blister promo Starters (ESPECIALLY Snivy), and (if we don't get Battle Boost) ability Samurott, and would miss Call for Family Litwick if I had ever managed to get one, but that's about it. I suppose the Snarl Zoroark, Paralyzing Gaze Scraggy and Big Bite Axew aren't completely unusably bad. (Zoroark and Axew are close, though.)

 

[Notal]

Yes, older versions of cards reprinted in a legal set are usable. (Barring huge changes to them like what happened to Computer Search and Pokemon Center.)

So yes, Terrakion NVI is legal?

 

[Bilbo Baggins]

So yes, Terrakion NVI is legal?

Yes, cause it's in Boundaries Crossed and is the same card.

 

[PMysterious]

Honestly, I'm not surprised at all. It was somewhat obvious that Next Destinies would not be rotated for the simple reason that it started the new EX era.

 

[PokePop]

Have all the people saying that the format is "stagnant" been playing at the same events that I've been going to?
I don't know, but I'm pretty sure that every time a new set has come out in the past few years, the entire meta changes and new decks emerge.

Yeah, that Plasma deck has been dominating for over a year now! ​

Sure, some older cards manage to hold their own. Darkrai has been in a lot of decks ever since it came out. But the decks that it's been in seem to have changed around it quite a bit, no?

I didn't see a single deck at Nats this year that looked like a deck from last year's Nats (not counting the lower tables, of course).

 

[Glaceon]

They're all the same promo number.

Maybe that means a new BR promo.

We can hope.

...........

---------- Post added 07/16/2013 at 08:00 PM ----------

Also, maybe Palace bw-on?

 

[TheRolesWePlay]

My question is, why is the B&W Trainer Kit off? It's supposed to be a way to teach players how to play the game, but it's not listed on the legal list. Isn't the latest trainer kit usually legal until the rotation after a new one is released? If the trainer kit is legal and this is an oversight, then Energy Switch, Energy Retrieval, PlusPower and Pokemon Communication would remain in the format.

We're probably gonna be getting a new trainer kit next format, since there is a new generation and all. Plus you can still teach using the old trainer kits, so their intended purpose isn't necessarily lost.

 

[HRPrime]

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
Well there stays the Mewtwo... And...catcher...
I was so hoping for a format without catcher.

 

[Destiny Warrior]

The concept of a new format of play...I can only really see one thing coming out of it. An "official" "Unlimited" format(be it Palace or otherwise).

When I think about it, this is probably the best chance they're going to ever get to do this. This is the beginning of the Abilities block, so there won't be any confusion among newer players regarding how different classes interact with each other. It is also the beginning of a new unified set of rules.

Oh yeah, and winning on the first turn is pretty hard in BW-on(I'm awaiting a bunch of angry responses to this statement). Yes, the big EXes can easily crush smaller Basics, but that's more of a situational donk(sort of how SF Gyarados decks could get donked if they started lone Magikarp). Sure, you can keep talking about "OMG Kyurem PLF + Prism + Colress Machine + LaserBank = 60+30 omfg donk YEAHHHHH", but that requires a good deal of luck to get the cards in your initial hand, or a Supporter that gives you the remaining cards. It isn't going to happen every game(RayEels would be roadkill if it were).

The "actual" Unlimited is 10x-15x better at these first turn wins. PoryDonk and SableDonk are 2 particularly vicious ones. Heck, with the borked trainer engine from the first generation of cards, I once even managed to build an Aggron DRX donk(it actually did succeed one time). The old trainers have been what really ruin an extended format. A BW-on "Unlimited" format is a great way to avoid the problem. All draw is confined to Supporters here(generally anyway), so the question of "draw through your deck turn 1" doesn't really arise.

 

[yoshi1001]

Have all the people saying that the format is "stagnant" been playing at the same events that I've been going to?
I don't know, but I'm pretty sure that every time a new set has come out in the past few years, the entire meta changes and new decks emerge.

That depends on your definition of new. If what you're tired of is the seemingly constant stream of legendary-focused sets, then there hasn't been a new format for a very long time, and this rotation does basically nothing to fix that (not that there was much they could do without flash-cutting to XY once it comes out, which I would have to concede would be a bad business move). It's a matter of perspective, and both perspectives can be right for the individuals involved.

Personally, what I'd like to see in a second format is a format that uses the same legal sets but with tighter restrictions (no basics over 90hp, no Beach, Catcher, Laser, N or Juniper would be a good start) for use in non-premiere events. This is the real solution as far as I'm concerned-combat burnout with a truly different secondary format and everybody (well, most people, anyway) wins.

 

[Regis_Neo]

Er...uh...well, unexpected comes to mind

That about sums up my thoughts...on the other hand, gotta make a note to keep my BW cards and not sell em off as usual...

I'm kind of curious as to how two legal formats can co-exist; will one just be used mainly for league play and minor tournaments, with Premier using the current Modified? I know other CCGs like MTG make it work somehow, but they also have an extremely vast amount of cards as well compared to even Pokemon, as well as different official tournaments supporting the different formats I believe.

 

[FunnyBear]

So what is there to do about energy retrieval?
.

Superior Energy Retrieval, which came out recently.

 

[Bigbowlr1037]

Er...uh...well, unexpected comes to mind

That about sums up my thoughts...on the other hand, gotta make a note to keep my BW cards and not sell em off as usual...

I'm kind of curious as to how two legal formats can co-exist; will one just be used mainly for league play and minor tournaments, with Premier using the current Modified? I know other CCGs like MTG make it work somehow, but they also have an extremely vast amount of cards as well compared to even Pokemon, as well as different official tournaments supporting the different formats I believe.

Coming from the World of Warcraft TCG(where they also had 2 formats) I can tell you how it was done for them. They'd have certain tournamentsin one format and other in another. Example, Battle roads and regionals and worlds would be modified format while cities States and nationals would be the Palace format. The formats were always announced well enough in advance to allow players to have sufficient test time. It made the game a lot more fun IMO because just as a format got stall the next event would come along in a different format and you have to change things up.

 

[Otaku]

Nother year of Catcher............

Maybe now they'll be willing to reprint it a little more freely?

---------- Post added 07/17/2013 at 10:09 AM ----------

so with the announcement of a future bw-on format, they are basically announcing that they plan to never fix the first turn trainer rule

I don't know if there is something to fix with that rule... it seems more like a matter of card design in general.

A lot of the "problems" in the format (which some would simply consider "features" XD) mostly boil down to card design; I think there were some generally poor design decisions in creating Basic Pokémon with effective, damaging attacks that can be utilized first turn, or at least relatively easily first turn coupled with most Evolving Pokémon serving no purpose save being used to Evolve (or skipped in favor of Rare Candy). The latter can always be solved with the next set, such as giving more Evolving Basic and Stage 1 Pokémon useful attacks and Abilities.

 

[Envoyofduels]

Maybe now they'll be willing to reprint it a little more freely?

---------- Post added 07/17/2013 at 10:09 AM ----------



I don't know if there is something to fix with that rule... it seems more like a matter of card design in general.

A lot of the "problems" in the format (which some would simply consider "features" XD) mostly boil down to card design; I think there were some generally poor design decisions in creating Basic Pokémon with effective, damaging attacks that can be utilized first turn, or at least relatively easily first turn coupled with most Evolving Pokémon serving no purpose save being used to Evolve (or skipped in favor of Rare Candy). The latter can always be solved with the next set, such as giving more Evolving Basic and Stage 1 Pokémon useful attacks and Abilities.

Now I am ok with them reprinting catcher in plasma Blast, because I see next rotation being Xy on.

 

[LARRY891]

What's funny about this is that almost every iconic card from the first 3 BW sets were reprinted in later sets. I think the only things we're losing are cards that have already worn out their welcomes on the competitive scene anyway (e.g. Pokemon Communication). So the format will pretty much remain the exact same as it currently is.