SuperWooper
New Member
Articjedi said:
Woah, seriously? Where did you hear this?
The deck(s) that won Worlds discussion....
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Woah, seriously? Where did you hear this?
mysterioustrainer
Active Member
Pokemon USA Inc. or The Pokemon Company at this time has no set location for Worlds. I mean come on they are probably sleeping right now. They deserve it too. However I can say Seattle is the most least likely option because Pokemon USA staff expresses their interest in seeing different places.
Now lets get back on topic here.
Decks that I saw in the Top 16 11-14 age division included multiple Magma decks and Gardevoir decks, however there was no true archtype strategy nor any fixed staple cards as many did things their own way. Creativity seems to be the ultimate weapon.
Now lets get back on topic here.
Decks that I saw in the Top 16 11-14 age division included multiple Magma decks and Gardevoir decks, however there was no true archtype strategy nor any fixed staple cards as many did things their own way. Creativity seems to be the ultimate weapon.
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DaytonGymLeader
New Member
Actually, you can't. You can't determine what your opponent uses for a randomizer. You can use their randomizer if you like. You can also ask a judge to check the legality of any randomizer if you do believe that it's not being random.Articjedi said:
I'm not going to turn this into a he said she said, but I've heard too much stuff privately about randomizers at Worlds to not at least entertain the thought. That's a post for another topic that's on the verge of being locked.
DGL is correct about that. One of my friends used to have a rigged coin, and at a gym challenge, I called a judge over to force my opponent to not use it, and they told me I had no power in what my opponent uses but I could use it aswell. Too bad I didn't know how to flip it correctly.
DaytonGymLeader
New Member
BTW, is anyone going to post this list or what?
plaidlesspez
New Member
Well replying to the topic, I really liked the Magma decks. They were awesome cause they were fast, consistent, stage 1 and basics beatdown. That's the type of deck I play. I'm not surprised they won because speed and consistency pwns all. I am surprised that none of us Americans tried Magma decks out. I used to use Aqua which was great but I never tried Magma. Well I can't wait until next year to see what the Japanese play again. I'd really like to be able to talk to them some way to see what's going over there but it is fun to see what they play at Worlds.
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plaidlesspez
New Member
Well the reason people usually don't test certain decks is that they are happy with their deck and if they tested a deck before maybe they had a bad list so they threw it out. This is what happened with Magma, we liked our decks and it wasn't good when we tested. Also, I don't really know if it's as good as it did. The biggest thing rogue decks having for them are that in tournies people seeing them the first time don't know what to do. They knew what to do vs us but we didn't know what to do vs them. Also it was very consistent and fast so they had a chance every game but some of our decks can get horrible starts that are insurmountable. Yep so rouges own.
First off
The Japanese player I faced in the 1st round and in the top 32, Yuichi. , 2nd @ Japanese nationals, was a very good and honorable opponent. He knew the game and his deck well. He tolerated my sloppy play. Thanks Yuchi. We played in four games and he won 3.
Second
He and his fellow Japanese players played as a team. They successfully metagamed us with most every player playing strong fast magma desks in a fighting/fire/psy/normal weak 2 stage format was based on experience and quite smart. Congrats to all of the Japanese at the worlds. Hats off to you.
The Japanese player I faced in the 1st round and in the top 32, Yuichi. , 2nd @ Japanese nationals, was a very good and honorable opponent. He knew the game and his deck well. He tolerated my sloppy play. Thanks Yuchi. We played in four games and he won 3.
Second
He and his fellow Japanese players played as a team. They successfully metagamed us with most every player playing strong fast magma desks in a fighting/fire/psy/normal weak 2 stage format was based on experience and quite smart. Congrats to all of the Japanese at the worlds. Hats off to you.
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Physics Squirrel
Active Member
I actually did see a post that stated the locations of Worlds for the next 5-8 years. I believe that it was taken from the PUI website, but I am not absolutely sure. It had London slated for next year.
As for the Magma deck, I do believe that it is consistant. But I don't know about it being better than other decks you can't say they didn't have luck on their side. Afterall, Fulop didn't take first place because he started with Rayquaza ex in the second game, I believe. =/
And I also know MANY awesome players who had a great chance against Magma decks but were cursed by luck. Myself included.
Nothing against the Japanese players. They were certainly experts and played well.
As for the Magma deck, I do believe that it is consistant. But I don't know about it being better than other decks you can't say they didn't have luck on their side. Afterall, Fulop didn't take first place because he started with Rayquaza ex in the second game, I believe. =/
And I also know MANY awesome players who had a great chance against Magma decks but were cursed by luck. Myself included.
Nothing against the Japanese players. They were certainly experts and played well.
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Hot Mustid
New Member
the ONLY japanese kid thati played that DIDNT get heads EVERY time was playing blaze, and he got uber pwned by me. but every other japanese person i saw, flipped heas like every time. no lie. And the friggin magma decks relied on the fac that they really never shuffled their decks so they could stack if they wanted to. But I found that shaman worked VERY well against them, as helped me win every game that I had against them since they go from like a 20 card hand to 4, and lose every possible thing that they could do. If more people had realized magam decks were going to be at worlds, then they would not have won every age group. Americans were playing decks that reflected our metagame, and the japanese came in with a deck that many of us had neglected and won because no one knew how to play against it. Thats basically what happened. 
Why are you grumpy? It's not against the rules to bring in a deck that nobody planned for. If you want my two cents, I feel that many of us americans were very arrogant and threw decks in and out of their "what would be at worlds" list. So when worlds came around, those people had only teched their decks for a certain selection and when faced up against a deck that nobody even gave a chance, they got whooped.
Stop whinning about how the japanese cheated. You can't change a thing. The truth is that the japanese came and the japanese sweeped worlds. I feel next year, if people are less arrogant, and actually consider all decks, and don't look to catch the japanese as cheaters but try their best at the game, and maybe then, the us might show up and take worlds like the japanese took worlds of '04.
Stop whinning....
Stop whinning about how the japanese cheated. You can't change a thing. The truth is that the japanese came and the japanese sweeped worlds. I feel next year, if people are less arrogant, and actually consider all decks, and don't look to catch the japanese as cheaters but try their best at the game, and maybe then, the us might show up and take worlds like the japanese took worlds of '04.
Stop whinning....
wolf52525
Member
very good point. we just assumed that we would win and when the japanese showed up with card every one in the U.S. had written off as no good, and started to win with them, they had to be cheating. I say the japanese knew what they where doing and desirved to win. I know next year I will be more prepared for ANYTHING. I say congrats the the japanese for there knowledge of the game.
DarkSideComma S.P.A.R.K.S
New Member
I was planning on copying the magma deck, atleast the tech of it. But i decided not to, and go with a different magma pokemon. At first when i heard of a Magma Deck taking first it was pretty... crazy. But then looking at the stage 1 Magma and Aqua pokemon in the set, i saw that some of them are totally broken.
Aqua's Sharpedo
WWC lets you do 60. only drawback is it cant attack next turn, so use its free retreat and pull out annother one!
Magma's Houndoom
RCC - Magma Spurt, i just love this card. discard top 5 cards from your deck. the attack does 30 times the number of F or R energy discarded.
The stage 1 *and basic, non evolving* pokemon in the team aqua/magma set, are just so over powered. Special effects, high damage, low costs, very very low retreat. Its just great. And we should all take a closer look at these and other un-likely cards in the future.
Aqua's Sharpedo
WWC lets you do 60. only drawback is it cant attack next turn, so use its free retreat and pull out annother one!
Magma's Houndoom
RCC - Magma Spurt, i just love this card. discard top 5 cards from your deck. the attack does 30 times the number of F or R energy discarded.
The stage 1 *and basic, non evolving* pokemon in the team aqua/magma set, are just so over powered. Special effects, high damage, low costs, very very low retreat. Its just great. And we should all take a closer look at these and other un-likely cards in the future.
YoungJohn06
New Member
I will comment on a few things, the japanese players them selves I didn't have much problems with, I heard some about deck weaving, whether that's true I do not know, I hope not but if it is, they know they only did well because of it so whatever.
The coin dealer I saw a lot of, one player made me believe they knew their coins were more geared towards one side than another when he refused to let his opponent use the coin he was using, which had been flipping heads pretty much 100% of the time, then gave his opponent another coin which didn't flip a single heads... so the coin thing I had a small issue with, the players them selves the majority were nice, some were a little rude when we were just walking around but we have that here too...
The thing that shocked me most, was the judges than the players... I do not know WHO the judges were doing this, but they were being VERY partial to the Japanese players, why no one has mentioned this is beyond me and I'll probably get flamed for it, but there were a few games I saw/heard about where an American discarded a supporter or forgot to discard a supporter and got game loss/turn loss because of it... that's fine we were warned, while it's a little extreme we WERE warned it might be like that. However would the judges who DID do this, give an explanation WHY this was NOT enforced on the japanese, because I saw and heard about them doing the same thing and never ONCE were they penalized with a turn/game loss. I'm sorry but that is what really made me mad about worlds this year, after we got the "spirit of the game" lecture, why did we get ruled on so harsh but not the japanese? Say this isnt' true, but unless I have some proof in stone that it's not, I will just toss your remark aside, and even more so if it's from someone who wasn't even AT worlds to witness it. I might be more okay with it, if there is some explanation as to why one game and this did happen, an american discarded his supporter early, got turn loss.... then the next turn the japanese did the same thing and the judge simply picked it up and put it back in play and said that it was fine it was just a mistake. I will admit I did not see it first hand, but I had multiple people say they saw it happen, if it was one I wouldn't think about it so much, but when I heard about this a few times I was a bit more interested in finding out why it was like that and started to believe it more and more.
Now for the actual deck.
It WAS a good deck and smart choice, no doubt they played well and are good players very equal to our level, however is it REALLY that much better than us? IMO no it's not, what I think happened more so was the majority of the players in the top were not expecting it to be that good, nor did they have the slightest clue as to what to expect from it or how to beat it. Colin, Pooka, and Fulop were among the few that knew what to do to beat it and I think they are truly some of the better players we have in this game, the players who know how to adapt to a knew deck and can figure out how to beat it while playing it are very good and deserved the world title just as much as anyone. I wish I would have had the oppertunity to actually get higher up there, but due to my luck being swallowed (inside joke) that didn't happen lol. Anyway, the japanese proved they are just as good as us and set people straight on how good they are, I do think though that one of the reasons the deck did so well, was like I said it was new and few knew how to beat it or what the heck it even did lol. So they get massive props for that.
The coin dealer I saw a lot of, one player made me believe they knew their coins were more geared towards one side than another when he refused to let his opponent use the coin he was using, which had been flipping heads pretty much 100% of the time, then gave his opponent another coin which didn't flip a single heads... so the coin thing I had a small issue with, the players them selves the majority were nice, some were a little rude when we were just walking around but we have that here too...
The thing that shocked me most, was the judges than the players... I do not know WHO the judges were doing this, but they were being VERY partial to the Japanese players, why no one has mentioned this is beyond me and I'll probably get flamed for it, but there were a few games I saw/heard about where an American discarded a supporter or forgot to discard a supporter and got game loss/turn loss because of it... that's fine we were warned, while it's a little extreme we WERE warned it might be like that. However would the judges who DID do this, give an explanation WHY this was NOT enforced on the japanese, because I saw and heard about them doing the same thing and never ONCE were they penalized with a turn/game loss. I'm sorry but that is what really made me mad about worlds this year, after we got the "spirit of the game" lecture, why did we get ruled on so harsh but not the japanese? Say this isnt' true, but unless I have some proof in stone that it's not, I will just toss your remark aside, and even more so if it's from someone who wasn't even AT worlds to witness it. I might be more okay with it, if there is some explanation as to why one game and this did happen, an american discarded his supporter early, got turn loss.... then the next turn the japanese did the same thing and the judge simply picked it up and put it back in play and said that it was fine it was just a mistake. I will admit I did not see it first hand, but I had multiple people say they saw it happen, if it was one I wouldn't think about it so much, but when I heard about this a few times I was a bit more interested in finding out why it was like that and started to believe it more and more.
Now for the actual deck.
It WAS a good deck and smart choice, no doubt they played well and are good players very equal to our level, however is it REALLY that much better than us? IMO no it's not, what I think happened more so was the majority of the players in the top were not expecting it to be that good, nor did they have the slightest clue as to what to expect from it or how to beat it. Colin, Pooka, and Fulop were among the few that knew what to do to beat it and I think they are truly some of the better players we have in this game, the players who know how to adapt to a knew deck and can figure out how to beat it while playing it are very good and deserved the world title just as much as anyone. I wish I would have had the oppertunity to actually get higher up there, but due to my luck being swallowed
(inside joke) that didn't happen lol. Anyway, the japanese proved they are just as good as us and set people straight on how good they are, I do think though that one of the reasons the deck did so well, was like I said it was new and few knew how to beat it or what the heck it even did lol. So they get massive props for that.
)v(ajin_ipg21
New Member
Fascinating... seems as if it was local metagame (Gym Metagame) versus an International Metagame.
NOT that there was insufficient playtesting... but the deck types were limited.
For next year, PLAYTESTERS MUST keep in contact with the Japanese/International tournament scene. Just another strategy to add to the list for next year's worlds qualifiers. (then again, would that just cause the infamous Net-Deck to be COPYCATed?)
We should try to win with grace... and lose with dignity... not even in the olympics is this evident =(
Them? Us? All in the eye of the beholder... to bad myopia is contagious...
Fascinating... are you sure ALL japanese players were playing that deck? cultural? Being sets ahead is an advantage... especially if ANY of those players are top-notch deckbuilders...
PS Anyone who had been to any of the PREVIOUS Japanese Pokemon events... was this event more competitive? In years past the Event reports would gush over how it was so much fun, exciting, and a pleasure to be in the company of japanese opponents... sure seems a lot more negative this time around...
NOT that there was insufficient playtesting... but the deck types were limited.
For next year, PLAYTESTERS MUST keep in contact with the Japanese/International tournament scene. Just another strategy to add to the list for next year's worlds qualifiers. (then again, would that just cause the infamous Net-Deck to be COPYCATed?)
We should try to win with grace... and lose with dignity... not even in the olympics is this evident =(
Them? Us? All in the eye of the beholder... to bad myopia is contagious...
Fascinating... are you sure ALL japanese players were playing that deck? cultural? Being sets ahead is an advantage... especially if ANY of those players are top-notch deckbuilders...
PS Anyone who had been to any of the PREVIOUS Japanese Pokemon events... was this event more competitive? In years past the Event reports would gush over how it was so much fun, exciting, and a pleasure to be in the company of japanese opponents... sure seems a lot more negative this time around...
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