Thoughts on what you think will win Worlds
- Thread starter darksoulSP
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- LuxChomp will not only win because more people are playing it. To me this screams "I don't like playing LuxChomp/Can't play LuxChomp so I'm going to degrade it." It's not as if all of it's Cities, States, and Regionals wins were done by scrubby players, y'know? I concede that it's the most played deck but that's not nearly the only reason it wins.
- I'd argue that DialgaChomp takes more skill to play than Sablelock, but I can see where you're coming from.
- Plox isn't as good as it used to be, but w/ Judge, Looker's, and DCE it's gotten a lot better. And no, it didn't put up a good show this year but that's because it was much worse before Judge came out.
- I wouldn't say Gyarados was never good, but I agree that it won't do well.
I basically agree on the rest.
iDonkedYou
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Please tell me how that makes any sense.
Because if it isn't as good as it used to be but [said cards] make it better then it would be better.
tehmoe
New Member
thats a lie and you know it. the first 3 turns are luck reliant. you better roll heads on initiative and you better hope i dont get anything good on a judge. it doesnt take as much skill to play this deck most other decks. i've seen it run, i've played against it many times.
dialga chomp/palkia lock/ gg take much more thinking and decision making than sablelock.
Box of Fail
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Plox is definitely BDIF now imo.
iDonkedYou
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The best thing i've read on this thread so far.
Elite_4_Allen
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what junior plays sablelock? oh yea, that kid called NO ONE.
Politoed666
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I'm not saying LuxChomp is bad, I'm saying Sablelock and DialgaChomp are better. Keep in mind that more players played LuxChomp at Nationals, but I believe Sablelock put up an overall better showing as far as top cuts went. To be honest, I don't like playing LuxChomp, but that's simply because I don't like playing the most meta/commonly netdecked deck out there.
It takes some skill to play, and it is a solid deck, but it was a lot better when people ran more Claydol. Now that LuxChomp is so popular, people are wary of leaving support Pokémon sitting in their decks because it's so easy for LC to bring them up and knock them out. But you also have to look at the fact that if a lot of people play it, more of them have a shot at getting lucky and winning through luck and a combination of good cards.
It takes strategy, but a newbie can do well with it with a dose of good matchups and luck.
In the era of DRE, and especially before Claydol, PLOX was without a doubt the most dominant deck in the format. What he's saying is that there was a period in which it simply wasn't especially good, and it's still not as good as it used to be, but some cards have made it better than it would be without them.
It doesn't matter if I flip heads early if I can't snipe around and make sure you can't get setup in the later turns. Only a very inexperienced player would Initiative with Sableye three turns in a row if they weren't getting setup on their own. The key to playing Sablelock well is knowing what to do so that you can balance disrupting your opponent's setup with making sure you can take the KOs necessary to win by prizes.
If the people you're playing against win solely by flipping heads on Initiative, your deck needs some consistency work. It's generally not enough to take a couple cards out of your opponent's hand, unless they're terribly unlucky or their deck isn't built well. It takes skill to know when to Spray, as well. Overall, it's important to note that Sablelock has a multitude of ways to win, and it's important to take advantage of all those ways whenever possible, rather than just hoping for lucky flips.
I guess I should've worded that better but it also probably takes less time than you spent typing that up to figure out what I meant.
I just meant that no, it isn't as good as it used to be, but it's not terrible either. It's gotten better (no, not better than when it won worlds, but better than it was a year ago) due to Judge, DCE, etc.
tehmoe
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i never said they use initiative 3 turns in a row. and it doesnt matter how consistent your deck is, when your down to 1-4 cards in hand due to judge/initiative by t1/2 more likely than not, the next card is dead draw, not the amazing uxie/cyrus/what ever gets your deck going card.
i play palkia lock. my deck is really consistent as far as my list goes, however if you t1 judge, then t2 initiative my hand to nothing its gonna be hard for me to set up, not to speak of the disruptive spy power which prevents set up even further. however inorder for that to happen, you better hope you either A:hope i dont get anything good off that judge or B: flip some heads on initiative preferably both A and B. However i know that if you whiff on initiative and i have 1-2 decent search cards. im locking you up and your never coming back. You have to deciding luck factors hurting your chances to win the match, the coin flips and my shuffling skills.
passed that point when you begin to snipe, only reason this starts happening is because you managed to have locked me up with no good cards in hand and top deck. yeah it takes skill to spray, but thats the same thing for any sp deck, it always takes skill to spray not just in sabelock. The fact that this deck won us nationals in masters is honestly beyond me.
every deck has different ways of winning. all sabelock does is take advantage of both players luck. if luck isnt so important of a factor, play the whole game without judging or initiatives and see how differently the game plays. See what happens when sabeleye gets steam rolled by a swarm deck like donphan or kingdra.
if you deny the fact that luck is a big part of the sablelock strategy, you have honestly not flipped enough tails, or your opponent getting a good hand off judge.
Politoed666
New Member
Luck is part of the game. What cards either player may draw at any point is luck, so of course it plays into it. I wouldn't really call Judge much of a lucksack, because regardless it takes the opponent's hand down to four cards. Initatiativing to get down one more is always nice, but it's often not critical.
Initiative has a 75% chance of flipping at least one heads. That's pretty good, to the point where I wouldn't even call it so much a lucksack. Then, the Sablelock player has to use their knowledge of their opponent's deck, playing style, and the game state to choose which card(s) to discard. Sometimes the choice is obvious. Sometimes not.
I'm not arguing with you that the deck, when played correctly, takes advantage of both players' luck. That's a good way to say it... "takes advantage." Any deck can win when their opponent starts with four Healers, two Expert Belts, and an Unown R in their hand. But Sablelock tries to manipulate the game to the point where their opponent has no options. That takes skill, not just luck.
Mama_Luigi
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I agree Plox is scary, but bdif?
Naki Feralkin
New Member
Can the haters who be hating on Sablelock play the deck or stop being salty for a couple minutes before they go making rapid assumptions that the deck is reliant on luck? I couldn't tell you how many games at States, Spring BR's, and Nationals I won without the help of luck, at all. Yes, I've had my fair share of donks, but that was likely only 25% or LESS of my total wins. The deck is ridiculously versatile, and has its fair share of decision making to play well. Do you just throw an initiative out there? Sure, if you have no experience with the deck. Do you judge a bad hand off your opponent or do you play it off the fly like everyone else and their grandma? The deck takes an ENORMOUS amount of devils advocate and or reading facial expression. And if you're clumsy with the deck, then your low HP pokemon will begin falling. FAST.
If it was luck oriented, don't you think statistics would work against the deck in the favor of every person who cut with it at nats, states, regis, and BR's? The numbers don't lie.
THAT being said, against the deck of my choice, I don't think it's gonna win worlds because people are expecting it. They underestimated it at nationals. It would be a massive mistake to underestimate it at worlds. I'm willing to bet a form of rogue will take this, as the foreign crowd typically surprise much of us with decks out of clear nowhere (Blissey Lock two years ago, Gyarados last year)
If it was luck oriented, don't you think statistics would work against the deck in the favor of every person who cut with it at nats, states, regis, and BR's? The numbers don't lie.
THAT being said, against the deck of my choice, I don't think it's gonna win worlds because people are expecting it. They underestimated it at nationals. It would be a massive mistake to underestimate it at worlds. I'm willing to bet a form of rogue will take this, as the foreign crowd typically surprise much of us with decks out of clear nowhere (Blissey Lock two years ago, Gyarados last year)
SLOW DECK
New Member
We aren't going this year.
I have a Dunsparce Donk/Shuppet Donk list that has tested extremely well. I have shared the list to a few, but I will post it in total in Deck Section (See Dunce Donk). It has superior match ups against Jumpluff's, Sableye, GarChomp, GG, and Such. Decks with Energy Acceleration like Magenzone is the only bad bad match up.
Again, If I was going, I would play with confidence.
I have a Dunsparce Donk/Shuppet Donk list that has tested extremely well. I have shared the list to a few, but I will post it in total in Deck Section (See Dunce Donk). It has superior match ups against Jumpluff's, Sableye, GarChomp, GG, and Such. Decks with Energy Acceleration like Magenzone is the only bad bad match up.
Again, If I was going, I would play with confidence.
DragonClyne725
New Member
I can confidently say that...SP will win worlds.
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