Has judge compensation changed, also? Please PM me the info if you'd rather not post...
'mom
'mom
US Prerelease prize structure change
- Thread starter farbsman
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meganium45 said:
Maybe. Maybe not. Some of us like travelling because it allows us to do 2 things: Support OP and play for a change. Now some places might take a hit because there is no box to be won, so the travellers will stay and play in their own "backyard". But others still might travel long distances as the POP tourney packs are a nice incentive, plus more packs obtained at a prerelease means having to acquire less later on to complete sets, and it is nice seeing people in those "far away" places.
SD PokéMom said:
Oh, me too please (not that it matters - just curious if same or if POP tourny packs have worked their way into the mix......)
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DaytonGymLeader
New Member
The better half told me:
Judge comp is on a sliding scale:
8-20 players - 1 display of boosters
21-40 players - 2 displays of boosters
41-60 players - 3 displays of boosters
61+ players - 4 displays of boosters
But that's just what is reimbursable - in other words, the PTO has to pay for the judge comp, then get a credit on the back end based on attendance. Judge comp is always a matter between the PTO and Judge. The thought behind this is that for smaller events, you need less staff.
I think it's seriously going to keep players in their own back yards. This is going to hurt players in low density areas or areas where there is no PTO or a PTO who isn't willing to travel to their area to run an event. But then again, this is stuff I've already talked about
Judge comp is on a sliding scale:
8-20 players - 1 display of boosters
21-40 players - 2 displays of boosters
41-60 players - 3 displays of boosters
61+ players - 4 displays of boosters
But that's just what is reimbursable - in other words, the PTO has to pay for the judge comp, then get a credit on the back end based on attendance. Judge comp is always a matter between the PTO and Judge. The thought behind this is that for smaller events, you need less staff.
I think it's seriously going to keep players in their own back yards. This is going to hurt players in low density areas or areas where there is no PTO or a PTO who isn't willing to travel to their area to run an event. But then again, this is stuff I've already talked about
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meganium45
Active Member
And that lowered judge comp means, folks, for my events...
Judges will only get half a box, no longer a full box.
We will still keep the same number of judges on.
M45
Judges will only get half a box, no longer a full box.
We will still keep the same number of judges on.
M45
Metal Master
New Member
I would gladly like to take a trophy. Now something to show for my headaches.
Professor_Chris
Active Member
Wow....I may actually have to buy packs from now on. ._.; I'm also curious as to if the change in prize structure will affect those who like to do a draft afterwards for bonus product.... Also, it seems for the older players, there is a whole lot more incentive now to want to judge rather than play (that is, if your sole purpose is to aquire more cards). I guess the trophy-like item is a nice addition...but I'm still gonna miss winning whole boxes at Pre-releases. I'm quite excited about the Series 1 packs, it'll make collecting a wee bit easier. ^^
Rainbowgym
Active Member
Hmmmmmmmmmm, wonder were they found the idea of giving out support related to attendance, sounds familiar to me only the amount is more that we can ever dream of.
But we have to dream, because we didn't had a prerelease this time.
But we have to dream, because we didn't had a prerelease this time.
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Professor_Chris
Active Member
Thats right, you trouble makers over seas killed our boxes.Rainbowgym said:
*gets together an angry mob* Having judged at a couple of prereleases I think that, ('Sensei don't read this next line), I'd do so for the fun regardless of the compensation. Sure getting some extra product is great especially for a father and son team as I am in, plus we share our extra cards with a new player we recruited from YGO. But judging a prerelease is a lot of fun too. While I'd almost always rather play than judge, sealed deck is the exception for me.
Maybe this will lead to more drafts. If POP uses the overall ratings for invites this year this could work well to inspire more drafts.
Maybe this will lead to more drafts. If POP uses the overall ratings for invites this year this could work well to inspire more drafts.
GymLeaderPhil
New Member
Well, I was wondering how POP was going to address the addition of so many more PTOs without a decent playerbase to work with. Not to offend anyone who is a PTO with little or no playerbase, but it should not have occured when we have other areas already hurting in numbers in the same state.
The funny thing is we've had back to back Prereleases in Florida for Fire Red and Leaf Green. We really felt crunched by the scheduling of the Prereleases and Worlds. There are a couple of players who usually attend our premiere events who took advantage of the system and attended a less populated prerelease. This stops those card sharks from walking away with a box for essentially just showing up. A couple came back to our last event just for the competition and I'm sure we'll see a few more back again come the next one.
While this is going to push some competitive players out of the picture from attending multiple events, it's going to hurt attendance.
What Pokemon Organized Play should have done is based the prize structure on attendance, just like the judge compensation is worked out. PTOs who have sanctioned preleases in the past have an average number of players to purchase product for and I'm sure this could have been done with that product. We wouldn't have the akward situation where one 10-Under player shows up and grabs a box. This not only attracts players to go to the big venues, but rewards them too. The new system is essentially punishing the rest of the established player bases for the potential growth in a smaller market.
The conflicts caused (including this one) by being too open on welcoming new PTOs in is only the fault of POP. They might as well open this up to the public tournament organizers, because players will not travel anymore unless they like trophies/medals/plaques/awards. Woooh boy, I won an award for being much more luckier in the cards I pulled from the packs. That's all it is. If it was a true draft, I would see some point in awards, but with this sealed format, it's all luck based.
-Phil
The funny thing is we've had back to back Prereleases in Florida for Fire Red and Leaf Green. We really felt crunched by the scheduling of the Prereleases and Worlds. There are a couple of players who usually attend our premiere events who took advantage of the system and attended a less populated prerelease. This stops those card sharks from walking away with a box for essentially just showing up. A couple came back to our last event just for the competition and I'm sure we'll see a few more back again come the next one.
While this is going to push some competitive players out of the picture from attending multiple events, it's going to hurt attendance.
What Pokemon Organized Play should have done is based the prize structure on attendance, just like the judge compensation is worked out. PTOs who have sanctioned preleases in the past have an average number of players to purchase product for and I'm sure this could have been done with that product. We wouldn't have the akward situation where one 10-Under player shows up and grabs a box. This not only attracts players to go to the big venues, but rewards them too. The new system is essentially punishing the rest of the established player bases for the potential growth in a smaller market.
The conflicts caused (including this one) by being too open on welcoming new PTOs in is only the fault of POP. They might as well open this up to the public tournament organizers, because players will not travel anymore unless they like trophies/medals/plaques/awards. Woooh boy, I won an award for being much more luckier in the cards I pulled from the packs. That's all it is. If it was a true draft, I would see some point in awards, but with this sealed format, it's all luck based.
-Phil
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Pokeplayer
New Member
I agree with thet previous posts.. PUI analyzed the Pre Release events as a whole for the last year both pros and cons and came up with this structure.....
I for one will continue to have booster drafts as side events as long as players want to play....
I for one will continue to have booster drafts as side events as long as players want to play....
Dark Legendary Master
Active Member
YAY! Doe that mean theme deck challenge too?! I myself prefer theme deck challenge over the booster draft. Booster draft is ick! too much luck involved.
GymLeaderPhil
New Member
Sorry, I was wrong in my last reply, those players who come back to X event for competitive play will be very sad. This kills any and all competitive play. We might as well call it casual play.
I really don't know who PUI decided to survey, but it must be someone from the most barren off-beat place in the World. I had heard some comments, Heidi Craig dealt with a few of these, at the Worlds Prerelease flights. People didn't like that prize structure and those same players will hate this one even more.
This is a competitive game. When you start giving equal prizes to all attendees, we've lost our gimmick. Nobody has a reason to give it their all when there is no difference between what Mary and Ted get in the end. Then people stop showing up.
Anyone who says the 10-Under group will boost in attendance is hoping for something that will not happen. These kids are not shrewd to the fact that "OMG I get ten boosters below the manufacturer's suggested retail price". The key element behind the attendance of many 10-Under players is their parent's involvement with the game itself. Most adults will look at the prize structure, or for better terms lack of one, and decide to hold their gas, food, and money to attend a tournament where you can actually walk out with a box or two... I know I don't want a trophy. It goes on my shelve and sits there, collecting dust.
-Phil
I really don't know who PUI decided to survey, but it must be someone from the most barren off-beat place in the World. I had heard some comments, Heidi Craig dealt with a few of these, at the Worlds Prerelease flights. People didn't like that prize structure and those same players will hate this one even more.
This is a competitive game. When you start giving equal prizes to all attendees, we've lost our gimmick. Nobody has a reason to give it their all when there is no difference between what Mary and Ted get in the end. Then people stop showing up.
Anyone who says the 10-Under group will boost in attendance is hoping for something that will not happen. These kids are not shrewd to the fact that "OMG I get ten boosters below the manufacturer's suggested retail price". The key element behind the attendance of many 10-Under players is their parent's involvement with the game itself. Most adults will look at the prize structure, or for better terms lack of one, and decide to hold their gas, food, and money to attend a tournament where you can actually walk out with a box or two... I know I don't want a trophy. It goes on my shelve and sits there, collecting dust.
-Phil
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Lex Luthor
New Member
Yes it is a competitive game, but I don't think so much at a prerelease. In my opinion, prereleases are for getting the new product early, casual play and just having fun. How competitive can it be when what you get is just luck anyway. Save the higher competition for the Citys, states, nationals, stadiums, CG's and Worlds. There are plenty of tournaments for the highly competitive player. I think the new prize structure is fine.
Dark Legendary Master
Active Member
Competitive? Sorry to burst your bubble but all the players I know play for fun not to beat the crap out of people for the heck of it, just to win a dumb box or two. Games exist to have fun, that's it. Who cares if you place last even at a simple tournament? I wouldn't, I just play to have fun. Heck I may be going for worlds this year but, I'm having fun at the same time, because I get to play a great game with my friends. That's an award in itself for me. That is the true spirit of this game.
DaytonGymLeader
New Member
Lex and DLM, hate to bust your bubble, but POP's intent is to make the Pre-Releases MORE competitive. They want to bring the competition level on par with a Championship Series event. They used to be the non-competitive fun events that we are all used to. Not any more. Hate to say it, but I told you so.
GymLeaderPhil
New Member
Being competitive is far from the opposite of having fun. Having fun and playing in a competitive fashion is a common sight. It's not a bad thing. Anyone who thinks so it's probably mothering their players too much. It's needed for growth and I can't explain it in any clearer way.
We need a competitive spirit to drive players to actually attend an event and play their best. ANY event, casual or not. Would people attend League without product support? I think we need to only reflect on the situation on some of our international TOs/League Leaders who are constantly being asked for X promo from local players. Without the product, people could essentially stay home and play Apprentice. Don't say it won't happen. This prize structure is killing competitive players. The enviroment will become stale.
Perhaps your Prerelease attendance is generated only from the local league members of the same store. That's great, we have that as well, but there are also a large amount of players who travel long distances for a Prerelease. It might no longer be financially feasible for those players to go.
-Phil
We need a competitive spirit to drive players to actually attend an event and play their best. ANY event, casual or not. Would people attend League without product support? I think we need to only reflect on the situation on some of our international TOs/League Leaders who are constantly being asked for X promo from local players. Without the product, people could essentially stay home and play Apprentice. Don't say it won't happen. This prize structure is killing competitive players. The enviroment will become stale.
Perhaps your Prerelease attendance is generated only from the local league members of the same store. That's great, we have that as well, but there are also a large amount of players who travel long distances for a Prerelease. It might no longer be financially feasible for those players to go.
-Phil
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HypnosProjectHQ
New Member
I've never felt any reason for me to quit the game before. This is the first time I've felt that. If someone who goes 1-5 gets the same prizes as the person who goes 6-0, then there is something wrong. That just makes the people that go 1-5 think they don't have to get better at all cause they get the same stuff as the 5-1 and 6-0 people.
With lowered prize structure, I will not attend as many tourneys. I'm not spending $50+ on trying to get somewhere near a box of cards. In the last year, I've spent ALL the money I get on tournaments. Now I feel I've wasted that money. Why? Because I can't get the cards I need to build decks any more. I don't earn enough cash to buy cards, so I depend on winnings. Between this and me not beng able to attend league anymore, I am totally bummed.
I may as well quit the game now. My decks, which have always been above par, would now be extremely below par. Also, now that I am in high school, I have so, so many other things I need to spend money on and things to save for. Spending money on packs of cards right now is not an option. Sorry if I sound like I am talking like a total moron, but I've played since Base Set. I now feel that the game is being ripped out from under me....
Sorry that I'm so sorry for myself...
~Hyp~
With lowered prize structure, I will not attend as many tourneys. I'm not spending $50+ on trying to get somewhere near a box of cards. In the last year, I've spent ALL the money I get on tournaments. Now I feel I've wasted that money. Why? Because I can't get the cards I need to build decks any more. I don't earn enough cash to buy cards, so I depend on winnings. Between this and me not beng able to attend league anymore, I am totally bummed.
I may as well quit the game now. My decks, which have always been above par, would now be extremely below par. Also, now that I am in high school, I have so, so many other things I need to spend money on and things to save for. Spending money on packs of cards right now is not an option. Sorry if I sound like I am talking like a total moron, but I've played since Base Set. I now feel that the game is being ripped out from under me....
Sorry that I'm so sorry for myself...
~Hyp~
Professor_Chris
Active Member
Keep in mind, this is just for pre-releases. Prior to PUI, we didn't even have these. I do agree that it's not right for last place to earn what first place did. I was hoping our upcoming pre-release events at Game Zone would help drag Yu-Gi-Oh players back to the game because of the superior prize support...well guess what? Now 1st through last gets the same prizes. Same as Yu-Gi-Oh! plus 4 boosters and an extra tournement pack. Its still a better deal, but not the awe inspiring effect the whole boxes and half boxes had on the Yu-Gi-Oh! players.HypnosProjectHQ said:I've never felt any reason for me to quit the game before. This is the first time I've felt that. If someone who goes 1-5 gets the same prizes as the person who goes 6-0, then there is something wrong. That just makes the people that go 1-5 think they don't have to get better at all cause they get the same stuff as the 5-1 and 6-0 people.
With lowered prize structure, I will not attend as many tourneys. I'm not spending $50+ on trying to get somewhere near a box of cards. In the last year, I've spent ALL the money I get on tournaments. Now I feel I've wasted that money. Why? Because I can't get the cards I need to build decks any more. I don't earn enough cash to buy cards, so I depend on winnings. Between this and me not beng able to attend league anymore, I am totally bummed.
I may as well quit the game now. My decks, which have always been above par, would now be extremely below par. Also, now that I am in high school, I have so, so many other things I need to spend money on and things to save for. Spending money on packs of cards right now is not an option. Sorry if I sound like I am talking like a total moron, but I've played since Base Set. I now feel that the game is being ripped out from under me....
Sorry that I'm so sorry for myself...
~Hyp~
HypnosProjectHQ
New Member
And after doing some math, that 7.33 boxes of prize support TOs got will only be recieved if you have 66 or more players. That is totally messed up too!
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