Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Werewolf XVIII: Dimensional Clash: Wolves/Outlaws Win!

Vote: Human Destroyer
Reason: Many people have already given well thought out reasons that make a lot of sense to me, wolves want to make themselves seem friendly, posting anything that will convince others that they aren't wolves.

PikaJewel, can you please elaborate on this statement? What reasons stood out for you and why?

As for scorri, I am still debating whether he/she was doing a fake speech-impairment or it was a genuine mistake. IF it was a genuine mistakes, scorri got very lucky as it looks like the moderators did not catch his mistake until his/her 3rd error post.
Why would a town-align person ever do a fake speech-impairment? I can see why an independent or wolf would try that tactic as it temporarily gives them a reprieve as some might think they are town.

HomeofMew, I would like your thoughts on what has happen so far on day 1.
 
I don't understand why you'd bother faking it period. If you're town, it probably just gets annoying to post that way, and if you're werewolf or indie, it draws attention to you. I see zero reason to bother with a fake speech imped.
 
One of them is most likely a wolf. A huge loss though because they are all good.

Let me explain.

One of them is most likely a wolf.

What happened was there was probably a mix-up regarding a wolf leaking information that shouldn't have been leaked. Maybe a misdirected PM. Therefore, it is most likely that two are townies and one is a wolf. The wolf would have been modkilled had this happened later own, I assume, which is why Pikamaster posted this:

They were all replaced because the game could be repaired by replacing them, modkill was not necessary at this stage of the game (aka, 4 hours in). Do not judge anything off of them being replaced, they could have been modkilled just as easily had we not already had 2/3 replacements. Play as if the incident had never happened.


OK, sentence 2.

A huge loss though because they are all good.

Loss of experienced players for people that some of which I personally have never seen play so therefore I know nothing about.



Moving on.


scorriGlaceon would prefer if scorri uses first person so he can read it easier. Glaceon is also sure it would be much appreciated.

I do not know what kind of pet peeve or "speech imp" it is, but it is super annoying.






I'll probably post again tonight after Cities.
 
Sorry I'm a bit late, I was busy all of yesterday afternoon, so this will be my catch-up post.
If those of you currently without an avatar wouldn't mind picking a random Pokemon or Trainer for it, I think it would help differentiate at a glance with 45 players…
QFT. Anyone who doesn't have an avatar, get one. NOW

Early game is a lot of small post with very little contents that I really don't feel like quoting.

So, let's get some conversation going.

What kind of roles do we expect to see in a game this big? Surely, there have to be quite a few in a game this big.

How many wolves do we think there are?

How are we going to get 23 people to vote for the same person? That is going to be difficult.

Do we use RVS day one to put pressure on random people to see how they react? Who knows, we might make one of the wolves slip up. Or do we wait to see if anyone acts suspicious?

Sorry if those are some nooby questions, but I am a noob.

I don't like the end of this post. He is saying stuff and asking questions, then making sure that people remember he is a noob. He is nervous already of messing up. Either due to being a wolf or really nervous townie.

I agree with Tables that this first line is 'role-fishing'. We are not here to discuss what type of roles we are going to have. Like him, I am willing to let it go as you being a 'noob', but be careful.

I feel that we probably have 10+ wolves, and possibly a second party, in a game this size.

We managed to get about eighteen people to vote for the same person last game, how difficult can it be to get 23?

Now, I have something to say: Even if you are a noob, that doesn't mean that you should act like one. You have to do your best to help the town win the game. Being a noob is no excuse not to play the game right, and if you make a fatal mistake, we won't hesitate lynching you, even if you are just a 'noob'. Newbies are more likely to make mistakes than experienced players, which means that you've got to keep an eye on your own tracks.

This post takes Tables' post and totally reshapes it. Tables said that the first line could be consider rolefishing (or rolephishing). However, he believes this is not what Vablakes intended, and makes it clear this is not an accusation. The question seems to be more noobness, and hardly has a trace of rolephishing. He isn't even trying to find a certain power role or expose a single person, he just wants to know what power roles there might be. Then JQ says she agrees with Tables, and the first line is rolefishing. She tries to may Vablakes look scummy with out taking credit for the accusation. Bonus scum points for JQ

Activity post woo!

Oh wait, you guys want me to contribute huh. *sigh* Fine.

Okay first of all school excuses blah blah blah etc. etc.

Okay! Now that that's out of the way, let's begin a real post!

Vote: Vablakes

My case? He was role fishing. If you are a power role and say what roles you think might be a game, you might end up slipping your own role, which is not what we want.

Speaking of power roles, I want to say something REALLY important. Do not, and I repeat, do not claim unless it is clear that you will be lynched if you do not. (I.E. Don't claim just because someone is voting for you. Only claim if the lynchhammer is definitely coming down on you)

Now, I'd like to put out some important advice for all town players, regardless of role:

When you read a post, put yourself in that person's shoes. Say to yourself, "If I was that player, would I say that if I was Town? Werewolf? Lone?" This is an efficient way to find scum.

Don't bother with policy lynches. It isn't worth reducing the amount of town players for any reason. If they happen to be scummy, that is of course a different story entirely.

Don't play scummy. Sounds obvious, I know, but it happens. Some people do this to avoid nightkills, but it might end up biting you in the butt later when you are forced to claim or get lynched. This is particularly true for Vanilla Townies, since you have no claim to save you, but PRs should avoid doing this like the plague.

Don't lie. The situations where lying is a good idea are few and far between. It makes people suspicious of you unless you can prove it was for a calculated risk.

Don't go down quietly. If you are getting lynched, defend yourself until the end. Self-hammering in particular is a no-no. Letting yourself get lynched without argument is playing against your win condition.

Find towntells as well as scumtells. A lot of people focus on just finding the scum and getting rid of them, but sometimes, finding a pro-town player can be just as helpful. This also allows you to add process of elimination to your ways of finding scum.

Don't bother with meta-reads or post-by-post analyses. I know that seems like a weird thing to say, but all this is doing is going into something knowing your conclusion already, and stretching a bunch of quotes to fit said conclusion. Post-by-post analyses in particular are a waste of time.

Try to avoid putting too much into one post. If someone is skimming the thread, it's unlikely they are going to read everything you say in a gigantic post. Say what you think is important, and nothing more than that.

Remember that you aren't trying to convince another player that they're scum. You're trying to convince everyone else that said player is scum. Arguing directly at them is pointless. Explain to everyone why you think they are scum.

Don't defend yourself too much. Too much of anything is a bad thing. Overly defending yourself distracts you from actively finding out scum. That isn't to say don't defend yourself, by all means do. Just keep in mind that if you are town, you know you are town and you should be looking for the scum, not worrying about keeping up a defense.

Don't think you know the whole scumteam. Chances are, you don't, especially if you have no information on said scum. Don't make up connections until someone has flipped scum, at which point you can try to find connections to other players.

Don't vote for people you don't think are scum. This should be obvious. Don't follow a wagon on someone who you truly think is town. Remember that no one except the scum themselves are certain who the scum is. Stand by what you believe, and don't let others tell you otherwise. At the same time, don't close yourself off to other opinions.

I feel like I forgot something, but maybe it'll come to me later.
His role fishing case on Vayblakes is terrible, as there was never really rolefishing. Bandwagons on other people's accusations of rolefishing without bothering to check if they are true. The rest of the post is practically copy/paste from the compendium. Scum read, but could just be noobness. Overeager to appear helpful to noobs, when he has never played before (Someone correct me if I'm wrong about that).
What I meant by "What kind of roles do we expect to see" is what are there usually in a large game? I'm not looking for someone to say "Hey! I'm (insert role here)!".

Noted: asking what roles we expect to see=bad.

Sorry for being a noob guys, last time I'll do that.

Anyhow, I'm not going to use RVS yet. I'm gonna wait for now.
An unscummy reaction, considering accusations on him have no base

More analysis on post replacement in a few hours.
Right now: FOS: JewelQuest and Human Destroyer
 
I skimmed over the game, and while there isn't any one thing in particular I wanted to single out, there are a few general observations I made.

1. HumanDestroyer seems a over eager on the scum hunting. I don't believe we can base TOO much off of this yet, since townies commonly do this at the start of the game. However, it's something to consider for later.

2. Crimsonsky, Vablakes, and StrongRhino are all playing relatively poorly. Yes, there's good odds that they're just new and townie, as is often the case. But, we all know that new players can be wolves (remember PM from a few games ago?), and it can be dangerous to simply dismiss them because of poor early play and just assume that they're townies. Even if they're not wolves, there is also the possibility of masons or indy players. The bottom line is, I don't want to assume they're townie because they're new, and playing badly. I also don't think that there is a strong enough case against any one of them yet to lynch them. I would rather wait and see if something more interesting develops, than lynch a new player on poor play.

3. Speech impediments are almost always faked by townies or indy players. Scum sometimes fake them, but usually they wish to avoid drawing attention to them selves. I would not base too much off of this yet.
 
Pikamaster, Lucario EX - can we get tally?

Btw still reading. Will make my own statement when I can
 
Vegitalian-1

Eclipse-1

PMysterious-1

Luster Purge-1

Kayle-1

Prohawk-2

Pokemonplayer101-1

Human Destroyer-5

Scorri-2

Jpulice-1

StrongRhino-2

Homeofmew-1

Crimsonsky-1


Vote counts will be daily to twice a day.

Pokemonplayer101, please unvote before you vote again.
 
What on earth? FoSing me? I was just pointing out that you made a dumb play. You don't reveal things like that, it makes wolves more likely to target you and the town more likely to lynch you. And, you really shouldn't reveal a retaliatory role to the wolves, that is helping them. You are really going to FoS me for that? For now:

Vote: Crimsonsky

FoSing me for pointing something that you did out is crazy. Revealing a retaliator role is crazy. You must be a wolf.

......

Really?

Okay, so I can understand why you might not be happy about his post. I can understand that you might think that he is completely incorrect in what he is saying. But what I can not understand is this. Why are you flat out saying that he is a wolf? Seriously, this post just won the award of the most illogical statement of the game (at least for now). I just can't believe that you are not considering any other options. Players were willing to believe that some of your poor play was because you are new to the game (or at the very least new to Pokegym werewolf). So why aren't you willing to do the same for Crimsonsky?

I also think that votes are being thrown about to readily. Seriously, players are jumping on people for the smallest reasons imaginable. While I don't think that it is flat out hurting the town, I do believe that it needs to be restrained a little.
 
I wrote my post on two separate pages and then forgot to combine them when I was finished. Here is the other half (or to be more accurate, the first half).

What kind of circumstances though? Sorry there must be some sort of role that I'am unaware of for a townie.

As I said, the circumstances are uncommon, so there isn't that big of a list. But anyway, a seer might not want to be that active in the game, or maybe a priest. Maybe not necessarily lurking so much that they are attracting unwanted attention, but enough so that what they are doing could easily be considered lurking. I realize that everyone might not agree with this tactic, but I personally believe that it is a valid play style for that type of role to use.

Vote: Human Destroyer
Reason: Many people have already given well thought out reasons that make a lot of sense to me, wolves want to make themselves seem friendly, posting anything that will convince others that they aren't wolves.

Why not just say it? Seriously, why not just say that you are voting for him because he is the popular vote at the moment, because right now, that's all I am seeing in this post.

So while I do not believe that what Crimsonsky did was a good idea, I also do not think that it is as poor play as some players think. A few players have been saying that what he said indicates that he is either one thing, or the other. But that's it. They are saying that he could only be (or at the very least is most likely to be) one of two things. But is that really true? Couldn't he be a bluffing as a vanilla townie in an attempt to act as a meat shield? Is it not possible that he is a wolf trying to appear as if he has one of the role that has been suggested by the town?

My point is that I do not think that players should have such a narrow view on things that happen during the game. Each player should be ready to consider each and every possible solution.
 
Oh hey this thing started up again.

Well I'm about to go back to work soon and then I'll probably sleep for a bit after I get back.

I'll read the past few pages and post once I awaken from my slumber.
 
On the topic of crimsonsky, I don't really understand why you WOULDN'T reveal a retaliator role. If he plays pro-town, doctor/bodyguard/nurse/whoever visits him and dies. If he plays scummily, cop/seer/role cop and roleblocker visit him, and they die. Obviously this isn't every role in existence but the point persists. I'd rather he claim to be a retaliator than have PRs visit him and die.
 
I'm not just saying this because it's incredibly useful, but also because I read through all of pokemonplayer101's posts and honestly, he says very little relevant things.
Care to explain why all your posts are pretty much baked air, pokemonplayer101?

Can you please quote and tell me what sits funny with you? This is an honest question, no sarcasm lol.

Pikamaster said:
Pokemonplayer101 please unvote before you vote
Excuse me, as I am on mobile (that would be why the above quote may not be correct), but where did I forget to do that?

I'll try and post something more substantial later on, when I get to a computer.
Posted with mobile style....
 
At first I though paranoia, but now I'm thinking it's fake. Humpff.. Are you a wolf?
Umm…I don’t quite understand? You have paranoia, or you say that I have paranoia? What’s fake? And no.
Vote: Human DestroyerReason: Many people have already given well thought out reasons that make a lot of sense to me, wolves want to make themselves seem friendly, posting anything that will convince others that they aren't wolves.
Just FYI, that is a common beginner’s mistake. You do not want to be following what other people say, just because it sounds good. You must also agree with and follow said logic.


Also, can everyone please get an avatar? Dave, shinorri, tables, etc.

Also, as for unvoting, you MUST include the name of the person you are trying to unvote, or else it will not count. You cannot just UNVOTE <----This will not be sufficient, and, thus, does not count.
 
Ok, I think I understand more of why he did that now. I was just trying to put some pressure on him, get a responce, hoping he would slip up. I don't know what reason I gave for him to FoS me. Crimsonsky, please explain your logic for FoSing me. For now:

Unvote: Crimsonsky

What you did could be considered a good play, depending on what role you have. It could be an awful one, too. Either way, don't reveal more about your role.
 
scorri said:
the best explanation that she can give is that a) the warnings given to her would be private and b) the occurrences in which she was forgetful and broke her posting restriction all happened before a mod could see it and warn her.
Pikamaster said:
1. All warnings (excluding double post, editing, stuff like that) are private.

2. Since there seems to be some confusion about this, Modkills will be based off of warning number, not infraction number. I am not confirming or denying what Scorri says, but this aspect of the rules should be clear for everyone.
Well, it looks as if we are not getting any public warning for scorri's imped. But, seeing as how scorri posted saying the warnings she'd received would be private before Pikamaster confirmed this, I think it may have just been a slip up.

Basic point: scorri most likely would not have known that all warnings would be done privately unless she had been told so by the mod, therefore having received a warning herself for her speech imped.

Unvote: Scorri

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
HumanDestroyer said:
HD You are. A post-by-post analysis, as I explained earlier in this post, is just when you quote a bunch of posts someone said and show how they fit your conclusion. You should absolutely be looking back on posts to establish reads, it would make no sense NOT to do that.
Alright, thank you for clarifying. What I had read and understood from your post did not make much sense.
 
Wow, finally caught up. I really don't have much to add. I do think Human Destroyer's post did not seem all that scummy to me, and think we might have a wolf in his bandwagon. I will look over things again when I have more free time.
 
Glaceon: scorri would love to be able to just post normally if she could but she needs to continue to post in the 3rd person like this or else she will no longer be playing as she will have been modkilled. Scorri is now going to go reread the thread.
 
I am going to tentatively vouch for the validity of Scorri's impediment as I have reason to believe it would be a valid role restriction in the theme of the game.

I'd like to hear more from jpulice, JewelQuest, and PokemonPlayer101 today. Jpulice, your posts have been very scarce of information, but I know you can be a monster when you want to. Why are you holding back? Why the gruff demeanor? JewelQuest, I'd like to hear your entire argument surrounding Human_Destroyer and also what you think of Vablakes and ProHawk. PP101, your posts have been a bit fluffy but you're trying to be active; I want to see you sit down and think through everything you've seen so you can share some more coherent thoughts with everybody. Thanks~
 
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