HornetsBasketballFan
Active Member
Lawman said:
Actually..Going by Projected Numbers, Oklahoma is going to have more people at states than Texas...Ofcoruse, this is jsut Projected Numbers.
Whicker's Bickers - Round 2 (2007 Edition)
- Thread starter Team Cook
- Start date
Actually..Going by Projected Numbers, Oklahoma is going to have more people at states than Texas...Ofcoruse, this is jsut Projected Numbers.
~Blazi-King~
Active Member
Your not that far off. About 1.5 Hours closer (due to traffic (total 45-60 miles closer)).
Will they have more numbers bc of the influx of more than 5 TX players???? Dont you think more than 5 TX players will travel north vs the lame-o 5 that went south for TX states??
Just asking....Keith
Keith - I wouldn't try arguing about only those froma particular State. I would bet that just about every State has had some travelling players & OKLA's will be no different as was Texas'.
I predict there will probably be at least 4 x's as many Texans coming to Oklahoma than the 5, actually 6 that went to Texas.
What has only been lightly touched upon is that the travelling players, whether they are Texans, Oklahomans or any other State, by and large for the most part are playing parents & playing children OR teenagers old enough to drive themselves a distance without their parents worrying. In other words, for example Okla's State this Saturday, if you were to subtract any parent/child players coming, then the number will be much less. I'd bet it's that way at most States as well as any Regionals.
I predict there will probably be at least 4 x's as many Texans coming to Oklahoma than the 5, actually 6 that went to Texas.
What has only been lightly touched upon is that the travelling players, whether they are Texans, Oklahomans or any other State, by and large for the most part are playing parents & playing children OR teenagers old enough to drive themselves a distance without their parents worrying. In other words, for example Okla's State this Saturday, if you were to subtract any parent/child players coming, then the number will be much less. I'd bet it's that way at most States as well as any Regionals.
^ I agree that every state has traveling players. Heck, I travel to 2 states this weekend myself, to Judge one and play the other. I took my son to play and 2 other players with me. One is a Master, the other is a Senior (who won SC states). There are ways to get to tourneys. The thing that rubs me the wrong way is that Whicker says, basically for a FACT, that many OKies "would" travel to the regional, if it was closer to them (ie 3 hrs or so) vs the 7 hrs to Houston. Well, TX states is a pretty big tourney with points for rankings to be had, was in a location much closer to Oklahoma that Houston is and ONLY 5 or 6 Okies made the trip down.
As I pointed out, we had more than that travel up to N Carolina on sunday from Florida, after they competed in FL States all day saturday! Florida is 3 states away and several several hours in a car 1 way! Yet, the Okies can't travel 3 hours to play in and support TX States??? Yet, they argue and BICKER when Regionals is placed in Houston, where the numbers are astronomical (pun intended!). I just dont see it.
Keith
As I pointed out, we had more than that travel up to N Carolina on sunday from Florida, after they competed in FL States all day saturday! Florida is 3 states away and several several hours in a car 1 way! Yet, the Okies can't travel 3 hours to play in and support TX States??? Yet, they argue and BICKER when Regionals is placed in Houston, where the numbers are astronomical (pun intended!). I just dont see it.
Keith
MinnesotaFTW
New Member
I "would."
I intended upon going to Texas States, but I had a soccer tournament, and the availability of Texas States to Oklahomans is not the issue here. The issue is the availability of the Southern Plains Regionals to all the people who live in the Southern Plains.
No, some of us could not go, and this has already been addressed.
Naturally. I also fixed your post.
Obviously.
I am not trying to be mean or offensive to you Lawman, but I can not go to the Regionals because the venue choice is too far from where I live. I do not have the mobility that you possess so I can not travel as you do. I am merely expressing my discount of the situation. Let us just drop it like Mike said. I can not go to Regionals, but I still support Mike Cook.
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I'm pretty sure everyone agrees that Texas should host Regionals. That's an obvious. Secondly, the logic says Dallas is a better choice, that's obvious ALSO. FEW have disagreed. Read the majority of the posts by Oklahomans and Texans alike. Dallas IS MORE CENTRALLY LOCATED AND THEREFORE BETTER.
Your "proof" proves nothing if you are going to say that mine doesn't either. However, REGARDLESS of the number of Oklahomans that WILL attend, it is unfair to not even give us a shot. I mean, the WORST that could happen is the same number of people will attend both.
First of all I believe some things need to be cleared up:
1. I respect Mike Cook as a person and hard-working PTO. Once again I never flamed him.
2. The MAIN point of this debate was to convince people that Dallas was the better location. Mike Cook just kinda slid into the argumentation along the way.
Mike,
Fine. I will agree that I seriously had no idea how long you had to find a venue. However, I will back up my point by saying I got that through the fact that after Regionals last year, you could have been finding a venue. I know now that wasn't the case. Secondly, I'd like to point out what you mean by "ANOTHER uneducated comment" when you've only pointed out a single one. I'd like to know the other things that I know nothing about.
I do not believe, also, that anyone accused Birch of anything. Actually, I think only one person so far has laid any of the blame on Birch, and that was Birch himself.
Finally, I do understand your point. 250 players is nothing to scoff at. However, there has yet to be any reason given to assume that Dallas wouldn't give 250 players + a chance for Oklahomans.
Minnesota: Please dont EVER change a quote of mine again. :nonono: That is NOT "fixing" my post...it is ALTERING it! Therefore.,...please remove the "quote" around it...it is NOT what I said.
Look, if you cannot travel more than a few hours, you will miss out on many opportunities to play this game. We couldnt even attend our own state championship bc it was more than 7 hrs away from us. TN states was in Memphis, the far west end of the state. I live east of Knoxville, on the far east side of the state. Luckily for us, their is a great PTO in the Carolinas that puts on events in SC and NC. Neither event was more than 4 hrs away (about the limit I will drive, except for Nats this year) Unless Mike Cook or some other PTO actually moves the venue for the regional OUTSIDE of the states in the region, you really cannot gripe IMO. It is where it is and you just deal with it. No different than if you lived in Maine and complained about the long cold winters up there. You live where you live and accept the limits of that area. The PTO of a particular regional shouldnt move it to a venue that is closer to you, to serve maybe 30 people, and turn their back on 100 + in the other area. It is still a business, you know?
Keith
EDIT: Jordan: Just bc being centrally located doesn't mean it is the best "fit". If that was the case, TN states should be in Nashville every year...guess what...it isnt! The PTO with the larger league in Memphis controls those "chips" and elects to reward his player base with states there. I dont go off crazy over it bc I understand. Under your logic...Nats should be where....the middle of Nebraska??? the world renown bastion of Pokemon existence! (Or wherever the central point in the continental US is) Central location doesnt always equate to best. In this case, Houston is "best". Either get a PTO who can outbid the Houston crowd for Reg's or start finding rides to Houston.
Look, if you cannot travel more than a few hours, you will miss out on many opportunities to play this game. We couldnt even attend our own state championship bc it was more than 7 hrs away from us. TN states was in Memphis, the far west end of the state. I live east of Knoxville, on the far east side of the state. Luckily for us, their is a great PTO in the Carolinas that puts on events in SC and NC. Neither event was more than 4 hrs away (about the limit I will drive, except for Nats this year) Unless Mike Cook or some other PTO actually moves the venue for the regional OUTSIDE of the states in the region, you really cannot gripe IMO. It is where it is and you just deal with it. No different than if you lived in Maine and complained about the long cold winters up there. You live where you live and accept the limits of that area. The PTO of a particular regional shouldnt move it to a venue that is closer to you, to serve maybe 30 people, and turn their back on 100 + in the other area. It is still a business, you know?
Keith
EDIT: Jordan: Just bc being centrally located doesn't mean it is the best "fit". If that was the case, TN states should be in Nashville every year...guess what...it isnt! The PTO with the larger league in Memphis controls those "chips" and elects to reward his player base with states there. I dont go off crazy over it bc I understand. Under your logic...Nats should be where....the middle of Nebraska??? the world renown bastion of Pokemon existence! (Or wherever the central point in the continental US is) Central location doesnt always equate to best. In this case, Houston is "best". Either get a PTO who can outbid the Houston crowd for Reg's or start finding rides to Houston.
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BLiZzArD
New Member
ryanvergel
New Member
We had to leave North Carolina at 9pm and got home at 6am... where I had to go to work at 9am. That's dedication, baby.
Florida knows how to TRAVEL and support the game!
There are those that believe a regionals should be more centrally located. There are those that believe that a regionals should be where you can draw bigger numbers. Obviously PUI and PTOs support the latter. That is why regionals is in Houston and not Dallas.
What else is there to argue? There is no "logic" in saying that centrality is greater than attendance. That is pure opinion. You can't simply interchange your opinion for logic any time you feel. By your logic, as Lawman shows, Nationals would be in nowheresville.
This is a business, and POP's job is to get more players to play- and hosting regionals in more populated regions will do that. If there is "logic" in any of this... it's that the way it is being run now is truly ideal.
1. POP exists to boost the game's popularity
2. PTOs exist to assist POP's goals
3. Houston will attract more numbers (like Vince said, for a Regional to have the biggest turnout possible, it has to have a good player base at the city)
4. More numbers means more popularity
--
Therefore a PTO should host a regionals where there are more numbers, as in Houston because he or she exists to help POP boosts the game's popularity.
Florida knows how to TRAVEL and support the game!
There are those that believe a regionals should be more centrally located. There are those that believe that a regionals should be where you can draw bigger numbers. Obviously PUI and PTOs support the latter. That is why regionals is in Houston and not Dallas.
What else is there to argue? There is no "logic" in saying that centrality is greater than attendance. That is pure opinion. You can't simply interchange your opinion for logic any time you feel. By your logic, as Lawman shows, Nationals would be in nowheresville.
This is a business, and POP's job is to get more players to play- and hosting regionals in more populated regions will do that. If there is "logic" in any of this... it's that the way it is being run now is truly ideal.
1. POP exists to boost the game's popularity
2. PTOs exist to assist POP's goals
3. Houston will attract more numbers (like Vince said, for a Regional to have the biggest turnout possible, it has to have a good player base at the city)
4. More numbers means more popularity
--
Therefore a PTO should host a regionals where there are more numbers, as in Houston because he or she exists to help POP boosts the game's popularity.
I will grant that any premiere event held in Houston will have greater #'s than one in the Dallas area.
Last year there were what, around 250 players in Houston. What does everyone expect this year? More or less.
I expect less because it isn't at NASA. Say it's "only" 150. What does that say?
Last year there were what, around 250 players in Houston. What does everyone expect this year? More or less.
I expect less because it isn't at NASA. Say it's "only" 150. What does that say?
UltimateCarnage
New Member
who cares it's unfair to Oklahomans and you should be backing us but for some reason you aren't why I don't know
meganium45
Active Member
Once again, I have 3 words that tell you the reason...
LOCAL PLAYER BASE.
Look at the attendance from..um...States this Weekend in Texas.
How many players were local from Dallas?
If that number is less than say, 75, you should look to do your Regional elsewhere, for these things cost WAY TOO much money, time and expense, to count on travelling players.
Let's put it this way, Regionals 2004 in Dallas, Great Event, was a MISTAKE.
I was misled about the local player numbers, and in retrospect SHOULD have put the event in either St. Louis or Memphis, both of which had local player bases of over 70 players, and could have counted on a great deal of travellers.
That event did not even carry 100 players, and would be seen as a small Regional in this day and age.
It's not convenience man, it is the local player base that dictates where an intelligent PTO will place his chips to propose the Regional.
Let's take an example that has been brought up in this thread, Nashville, TN.
In 2004, when I was the PTO of Memphis, I got together with the PTO of Chatanooga and we decided that we would try and hold the State in the middle of the state. There was no doubt Memphis was getting huge numbers, but I thought, hey, let's try and be fair to the state. It was a DISASTER player wise (not the event, which was run very well by Scythking). We had less players than Memphis got for its PreReleases or Cities, only 5 players from Nashville were there, and we lost a lot of players from Memphis who would have shown up if it was locally held.
Memphis has always been the "Pokemon Center" of Tennessee (although Sevierville is up and coming, and Nashville is resurging), just as St. Louis has always been the "Pokemon Center" of Missouri.
So, in short, a PTO thinks about a LOT of things before scheduling these!
Vince
LOCAL PLAYER BASE.
Look at the attendance from..um...States this Weekend in Texas.
How many players were local from Dallas?
If that number is less than say, 75, you should look to do your Regional elsewhere, for these things cost WAY TOO much money, time and expense, to count on travelling players.
Let's put it this way, Regionals 2004 in Dallas, Great Event, was a MISTAKE.
I was misled about the local player numbers, and in retrospect SHOULD have put the event in either St. Louis or Memphis, both of which had local player bases of over 70 players, and could have counted on a great deal of travellers.
That event did not even carry 100 players, and would be seen as a small Regional in this day and age.
It's not convenience man, it is the local player base that dictates where an intelligent PTO will place his chips to propose the Regional.
Let's take an example that has been brought up in this thread, Nashville, TN.
In 2004, when I was the PTO of Memphis, I got together with the PTO of Chatanooga and we decided that we would try and hold the State in the middle of the state. There was no doubt Memphis was getting huge numbers, but I thought, hey, let's try and be fair to the state. It was a DISASTER player wise (not the event, which was run very well by Scythking). We had less players than Memphis got for its PreReleases or Cities, only 5 players from Nashville were there, and we lost a lot of players from Memphis who would have shown up if it was locally held.
Memphis has always been the "Pokemon Center" of Tennessee (although Sevierville is up and coming, and Nashville is resurging), just as St. Louis has always been the "Pokemon Center" of Missouri.
So, in short, a PTO thinks about a LOT of things before scheduling these!
Vince
^ Vince is correct. I was at the TN States 2004 in Nashville, along with about 10 others from the east side of the state. We probably wouldnt have made the trek to Memphis for States that year, but could go to Nashville. We had a blast, but the numbers were lower than if in Memphis. I never regret Vince and now Clay setting TN states in Memphis...it accomodates the most people! Now, if Nashville ever gets a decent league back up, I KNOW that Clay would reconsider Nashville....IF the numbers were there to support it.
Moral of the story...you deal with where the numbers are. It is the PTO that is running/justifying the event!
Keith
Moral of the story...you deal with where the numbers are. It is the PTO that is running/justifying the event!
Keith
idgi? please explain? there is still a chance i might go to TX Regionals, still working out stuff.
Oh, Brownsville would be great!
Vince makes a very good point, as much as I'd love to have a regional in New Orleans, I know that Memphis and Houston make better sites because of local players. I could think of a dozen or so reasons to have one in N.O., but I know what's best for the game.
But Brownsville would be great!
Vince makes a very good point, as much as I'd love to have a regional in New Orleans, I know that Memphis and Houston make better sites because of local players. I could think of a dozen or so reasons to have one in N.O., but I know what's best for the game.
But Brownsville would be great!