Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

WotC vs PUI's running of the Pokemon TCG

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Nick15 said:
This is the opposite of the WotC approach, which issued errata and rulings for each problem individually

I chalk that up to just different methods; one cook stirs clockwise while another stirs counterclockwise.
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It's not like that, though. Standardized rulings are way better than a separate ruling for every possible interaction of cards. It prevents confusion arising from double standards and, as the card pool increases, ruling on every interaction differently (and being able to access these rulings efficiently!) quickly becomes an impossible task.
 
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Nick15 said:
'Mom
suddenly they were posting that it was wotc's choice to eliminate 15+

Aw well. This is all in the past now, so no need to reinvent the wheel with this.
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sorry nick, but i'm never going to stand by and let the 'it wasn't wotc behind the elimination of 15+' fiction continue to be stated as fact when it's _not_.

the old thread link 'snore posted proves it; the MTs (...at best) led us to believe...and let us wizpog mods post over and over and over again...how that it was TPC's decision, that if it was up to wotc it wouldn't have happened.

mike gills' post proves that wrong...as does the immediate reinstatement of 15+ to OP when PUI took over.

'mom
 
Nintenfreak said:
Which is great if I happened to have the time, energy, and resources to do so. Then, assume I do. what good will it accomplish if I'm it's one and only member?
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Well if it doesn't get started by someone it will always and forever have 0 members.

I think you'd be surprised at how fast a league will grow if you have it in a parentally acceptable location and you spread the word that you have started it...

your clientel may be younger than you want, but you have to build from the ground up.
 
SD PokéMom said:
sorry nick, but i'm never going to stand by and let the 'it wasn't wotc behind the elimination of 15+' fiction continue to be stated as fact when it's _not_.

the old thread link 'snore posted proves it; the MTs (...at best) led us to believe...and let us wizpog mods post over and over and over again...how that it was TPC's decision, that if it was up to wotc it wouldn't have happened.

mike gills' post proves that wrong...as does the immediate reinstatement of 15+ to OP when PUI took over.

'mom
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I read that post and what I inferred was slightly different. What I saw was WotC seeing that the brand was losing sales and were trying to find ways to keep the game alive. Now for all the kudos WotC (deservedly) gets, it was (is) a company formed by a bunch of gamers. And when these people had to make real business decisions, they messed them up (they still do IMO). You can't really blame them for this - I really doubt a bunch of people go about and deliberately try to stop a game suceeding (even after WotC lost the Pokémon license to PUI).

PUI had a different attitude, a more professional take on the whole thing. That is what the game needed to make the transition from fad to a substantial game. But nothing in that post leads me to the conclusion that WotC were the only ones behind that decision, or it was done without PCL's approval. Mike's post just explains what the rationale behind the decision. Not who made the decision.

As for the immediate reinstatement... well hindsight is always 20/20. Do I believe that WotC were to fault in this matter? Yeah, I do. But does that post prove that? And will we ever know for sure what really happened? No. And I don't think we ever will.
 
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I never thought WotC was out to "kill" the game.
However, looking at it strictly from a business sense, these are the reasons WotC would want to distribute Pokemon:
  • Protect their patent. If they distribute it, Neither they nor Nintendo need to worry about bothering to sue over patent infringement.
  • Keep competitor from developing. If Nintendo is using them, they won't build the infrastructure needed to create and distribute other card games from their other properties.
  • Easy money. Nintendo/Game Freak/Creatures does the work of developing the cards. All WotC has to do is translate and sell using existing channels.
  • Entry point for new customers. Every business looks for new ways to get new customers. There are two basic ways to do this. One, take existing customers from a competitor, or two, create new customers. Pokemon gave them a way to create new customers by bringing new people into the TCG world that had never bought or even seen a TCG before.
  • Translate those customer into owned properties. Let's discuss this below.

WotC had to pay a licencing fee to Nintendo et al for the use of their property and trade marks. That fee can be substatial because it comes off the gross, not the profit. But a company cannot pass this cost along to the consumer, or at least not much of it. So while Pokemon made a ton of money, WotC sees less of it in their bottom line than they do with MTG or other games that they outright own. So it makes sense for a company to try to bridge customers from the low profit margin game over to their higher profit margin game. That bridge can take two forms.
They can try to get players involved in both games, bringing in some money at a high margin and some at a low margin. Or, they can try to shift all of that customer's dollars over from the low margin game to the high margin game.

Now, while I don't think the ban of 15+ was triggered by this desire, I do think it factored into the decision and made it "easier" to make. The trigger was some bad behavior by 15+ players that embarassed WotC in front of guests from Japan. The decision, however, was a huge misstep that didn't really work. They threw the baby out with the bath water and wound up with nothing.
 
WotC made it's first mistake when they started making E-Reader sets. The cards were all around horrible, and the supporters were basically obsolete because the other trainers (Bill, Elm, Bill's Teleporter) were all so much better. The sets were turning into Yu-Gi-Oh sets, where 1-5 cards out of 100 were playable, and the rest were horrible compared to what we already have. It was pretty evident that Pokemon was dying, and then came Nintendo and POP and they turned the game around for the better.

I think if WotC would have just stayed away from that E-Reader stuff, and never thought of making supporters, the game would have been a lot better off.

BUT POP has done a great job, and I respect em for it.
 
I agree with what you say Pokepop. To me, that is the strategy that WotC tried - to get people from Pokémon into M:TG. On the face of it, this sounds like a good tactic. But someone thinking clearly for a few moments would see that it is very unlikely such a strategy to work. The games are completely different - in flavour, in style, in demographic (besides age) and in complexity.

Now I love the gameplay aspects of M:TG, but absolutely cannot stand the demonish, fantasy flavour of it. Which is why I collect Pokémon instead. I doubt many moved from Pokémon to M:TG (and I guess even less stuck with the game)
 
Professor Elm said:
WotC made it's first mistake when they started making E-Reader sets. The cards were all around horrible, and the supporters were basically obsolete because the other trainers (Bill, Elm, Bill's Teleporter) were all so much better. The sets were turning into Yu-Gi-Oh sets, where 1-5 cards out of 100 were playable, and the rest were horrible compared to what we already have. It was pretty evident that Pokemon was dying, and then came Nintendo and POP and they turned the game around for the better.

I think if WotC would have just stayed away from that E-Reader stuff, and never thought of making supporters, the game would have been a lot better off.

BUT POP has done a great job, and I respect em for it.
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I don't know how many times it has to be said until people finally get it.

WOTC had nothing to do with the cards being created.

PUI has nothing to do with the cards being created.

The only people that have any say in the cards being created are the people in TPC in Japan.

NEVER blame WOTC for the cards that they released.
 
Be nice, it can get confusing (especially if you don't know/care about who does what for Pokémon)! I reckon WotC's first mistake was at Jungle, when they decided to up the rarity of the holo's even further by expanding the set. Now 48 cards is a pretty poor expansion. But wouldn't it've been better if WotC had come up with a better solution?

That decision had the effect of really pandering to the fad status of the cards (lets capitalise on all the children by loads of packs in vain for a holo), until the fad era ended. In my area, lots of kids got into fights for holo cards, and I remember a lot of bad publicity about this decision when someone pointed this out to the local press.

So yeah, a lot of short term gain as profits absolutely skyrocketed. And the weird release schedule actually helped things - I remember when Fossil came out late (in my area), anticipation was at fever pitch.

But what happened in my area when the fad era ended? Noone gave a toss about Pokémon, and those who still cared were left with really bad odds of finding decent cards. When you have to travel half way across London to find a booster, you know somethings wrong.

The PUI distribution makes a lot more sense. Throw in some actually decent AH cards, and you see why more and more serious collectors are coming back to buy stuff. (Though this is bad for me on eBay!). I know many (most?) people disagree with me on this one. But especially when you're a kid, not everyone has the time and money to go about collecting cards.
 
I all honesty I do not blame WotC for not fully supporting the game. They were getting a weaker product and the fad had all but passed...probably not in their best business interest to put much back into the game.

Nintendo I am sure wanted their product in their hands because they had big plans for the card game with what I call the 1st bounce...Pokemon Ruby Sapphire for GBA.

We are now in the 3rd bounce...Diamond and Pearl...we all know how hot the video game is right now. Pokemon is its own company...they are doing a GREAT job at focusing on THEIR product. Who would have thought 10 years later there would be a Pikachu balloon in the Macy's Thanksivinig parade. Pokemon has a vested interest in keeping the game alive. WotC was merely renting the name and going along for the ride as long as it lasted.
 
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The Supes said:
Arguments suck. Please delete or whatever
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No! You can't have it deleted.
A 92 reply topic and you want us to wipe it out?
A lot of people put a lot of effort into this discussion and if you no longer have interest in it, you can drop out of the discussion.
But only the first post belongs to you. All the other posts and discussion can go on.
 
Heh, that's not up to me. If it was up to me I'd go to more, but I've got no way of doing that hm? Even if I did have a car, my mother doesn't want me going off anywhere farther than an hour and a halfs trip on my own ._.''

Not my fault.

PokePop said:
No! You can't have it deleted.
A 92 reply topic and you want us to wipe it out?
A lot of people put a lot of effort into this discussion and if you no longer have interest in it, you can drop out of the discussion.
But only the first post belongs to you. All the other posts and discussion can go on.
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Seems like too much arguing to me...that;s why I made the move. Not because I was 'bored' but I don't like being the one to start an argument.
 
Who cares whose fault it is, point is who are you to judge which restaurant is better when you've only ate a single or two dishes from each?
 
I am a person to judge, whose opinion is equal to your own, no matter my amount of observation. (People like me are also really hurt by the point system we got under Nintendo, where it really doesnt end up mattering how good you are, but how many events you can attend.)

I can judge or presume any way I want, especially from what I see at the few events I get to go to.
 
Your opinion is far inferior when all you've went to is city championships, yet you put PUI as a whole on critic
 
Been to City States and Regionals, Cities sand States twice.

Anyway, made my point. Go ahead and criticize all you want. I'm not going to fuel any more arguments.
 
I'm not going to talk any more on this thread because PUI don't give a damn and arguing with randoms about events they seldom go to while playing with near-theme decks is stupid
 
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