Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Bluffing?

travis3290 said:
they obviously do though, as it worked for steven.

listen, any card game is half skill, and half luck. A lot of that skill comes from mindgames. heck im glad im 6'3 cause i intimidate people a good bit. Your attitude is important too, someone in the thread talked about if you seem pathetic they'll underestimate you, and thats entirely true. there is nothing wrong with messing with them, as long as your not lying.
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That play at Worlds was bluffing through actual play - an unnecessary Azelf baiting out a Spray . . . not stuff like coughing/smiling/sighing etc. One is clever strategy, the other is a silly attempt to play mindgames.

I honestly can't imagine being intimidated by a person's size when I am playing a game of Pokemon. What are they going to do? Beat me up if they don't win? :lol:
 
mikeg542 said:
I'm a magic player too and reading this thread makes me really sad. The fact that it can be against the rules to misrepresent hidden information is absolutely ridiculous. It should just be another part of the skill set that can be used to help win the game.

I understand that the game has younger players and the idea of bluffing could be detrimental to their playing (as it encourages deception and lying as a method of victory, which is not a good life lesson for an 8 year old) As well, those younger kids are more likely to think it 'cheap' or underhanded to win with a bluff and would thus take away some of the fun for them.

However, older players should be able to separate the game from reality enough to not have the idea of bluffing teach them bad life lessons.

I think that bluffing should be allowed in the masters division under the following circumstances:
1) No deception is made regarding public information. If a player asks about a card's ability or # of prizes or damage counters or cards in hand, the answer must be completely truthful. However, there should be no penalty for saying openly: "My luxray is prized, darn" as your opponent should be given the option of believing or disbelieving themselves. As the information is private, you should have no reason to have to tell the truth, but also should have nothing stopping you from a bluff.

2) Cards on the table that are not in your deck need to be a translation. There is no reason for any other card to be on the table.

3) If a player shows a card with the intent to deceive (make the opponent do it's actions without having to play it), that player should be given a warning, then a game loss. The player tricked should not be penalized but if they shuffled their hand or anything, should have to live with that.

4) Note taking within a game should be allowed, as long as it is done in a timely fashion and is done in public. such as prize location and opponents hand after an effect.


This is just my opinion but I feel it would add a next level of skill to the game
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I appreciate what you are saying, but Pokemon Organized Play will not support different rules or guidelines for different age groups. Like it or not, POP sets all of their rules to be kid-friendly, regardless of the age group involved.
 
I respect that answer. Thank you. If that is the way they have decided to keep the game, the kudos for keeping to the heart of the game.
 
it wouldn't be a penalty for SIGHING, that would be ridiculous. consider the full scope.

when you put a guy in jail for shooting someone, he isn't going to jail because he moved a small pin on a metal object- he is going to jail for the full scope.

i think pop is being fair and honest. HE might not care- that isn't to say these actions couldnt be considered dubious or bad- and that's all it takes.
 
mikeg542 said:
I'm a magic player too and reading this thread makes me really sad. The fact that it can be against the rules to misrepresent hidden information is absolutely ridiculous. It should just be another part of the skill set that can be used to help win the game.

I understand that the game has younger players and the idea of bluffing could be detrimental to their playing (as it encourages deception and lying as a method of victory, which is not a good life lesson for an 8 year old) As well, those younger kids are more likely to think it 'cheap' or underhanded to win with a bluff and would thus take away some of the fun for them.

However, older players should be able to separate the game from reality enough to not have the idea of bluffing teach them bad life lessons.

I think that bluffing should be allowed in the masters division under the following circumstances:
1) No deception is made regarding public information. If a player asks about a card's ability or # of prizes or damage counters or cards in hand, the answer must be completely truthful. However, there should be no penalty for saying openly: "My luxray is prized, darn" as your opponent should be given the option of believing or disbelieving themselves. As the information is private, you should have no reason to have to tell the truth, but also should have nothing stopping you from a bluff.

2) Cards on the table that are not in your deck need to be a translation. There is no reason for any other card to be on the table.

3) If a player shows a card with the intent to deceive (make the opponent do it's actions without having to play it), that player should be given a warning, then a game loss. The player tricked should not be penalized but if they shuffled their hand or anything, should have to live with that.

4) Note taking within a game should be allowed, as long as it is done in a timely fashion and is done in public. such as prize location and opponents hand after an effect.


This is just my opinion but I feel it would add a next level of skill to the game
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1.) Bluffing is allowed to a certain degree. I don't always agree with the penalties involved in bluffing. but some of them are indeed out right dubious actions.

2.) This I agree with. There is pretty much no reason for any cards other than those being played with or those used for translations to be on the table.

3.) Agreed completely.

4.) I'm not entirely sure, but I believe that taking notes is allowed in the game. I could have sworn I read it in the tournament rules at one point.
 
SD PokéMom said:
...and that's the difference between you and the player i DQ'd at worlds, who had told me and at least one other judge in our group during different rounds that it WAS a translation...=/

'mom
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Correction Mom. You did not DQ a single soul. The person EARNED their DQ through THEIR actions. They DQ themselves.

We deliver the outcome and keep the event fair at the highest integrity.
 
With all due respect, I think you're forcing the interpretation a little too hard on this one....

Sure through cheating one may "earn" a DQ, but it is up to judge to actually DQ the person and thus accept responisibility should they have made a mistake. Judges are putting their neck on the line whenever they take serious disciplinary action, so I would say a judge is doing something by DQing someone.
 
Box of Fail said:
With all due respect, I think you're forcing the interpretation a little too hard on this one....

Sure through cheating one may "earn" a DQ, but it is up to judge to actually DQ the person and thus accept responisibility should they have made a mistake. Judges are putting their neck on the line whenever they take serious disciplinary action, so I would say a judge is doing something by DQing someone.
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I have to agree on this one.
 
baby mario said:
That play at Worlds was bluffing through actual play - an unnecessary Azelf baiting out a Spray . . . not stuff like coughing/smiling/sighing etc. One is clever strategy, the other is a silly attempt to play mindgames.

I honestly can't imagine being intimidated by a person's size when I am playing a game of Pokemon. What are they going to do? Beat me up if they don't win? :lol:
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well i wouldn't hurt a fly hahaha, but it gets in some people heads.

I still see nothing wrong with mind games, to an extent.

if i were to play and be like "hey man dont even use powers this turn i got three sprays" and i had none, thats lying, and dubious. If he announces something and i put a smirk on my face, im just messing with him, and for any judge to consider that dubious, well thats just plain stupid.
 
If you had 3 sprays in hand, he should still use his powers, otherwise, you would just keep them till next round.

//peace
 
I haven't read most of this thread, but bluffing should absolutely definitely be allowed.

let's just say you don't play a mewtwo counter and your opponent benched a mewtwo. You now want to subtly trick your opponent into thinking that you do have a way to deal with it if it levels up (so they won't try to level it up), by perhaps smiling when the mewtwo hits the table, or something like that. Is this really so wrong? As someone once said on this forum, it seems that everything even the slightest bit competetive is frowned upon by people.
 
to Box of Fails Original post in all honesty it is extremely hard to give an exact answer out of context because the actual intent of player 1 is contained in their mind now if it were public knowledge then I would say yes it is against the rules because player 1 was purposefully trying to deceive the other player in a way that would affect the game. This is something that we the judges have to deal with when we judge an event we have to try to discern a players true intentions which can be very hard at times and no we may not always make the right decisions but by having people trying to perform these types of actions it just makes us more aware of the possibility that this can be the case and those that do it not only make it more likely that they will get caught but that others might be caught in the crossfire so keep this in mind if you intentionally try to deceive someone during a game you are slowly destroying the game for everyone by doing it even if you get away with it a few times or not this is why POP has rules against such actions to encourage a healthy play environment and keep the game fun
 
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