Porii Sames
Active Member
^Where do you live?
Edit: OK that sounded weird, but I mean, like what kind of meta is that?
Edit: OK that sounded weird, but I mean, like what kind of meta is that?
BR Donk Report Thread
- Thread starter SLOW DECK
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Son_of_Apollo
New Member
I played vilegar today:
1- I T2'ed him
2- Legit game against terrible matchup. lost
3- I T2'ed her
4- I won in four turns
1- I T2'ed him
2- Legit game against terrible matchup. lost
3- I T2'ed her
4- I won in four turns
played sableye/garchomp hybrid thingy.
4 rounds
game 1 miss donk beacuse basic dark is prized
game 2 T2 donk miss turn one beacuse basic dark is prized
game 3 miss donk but sableye takes 4 prizes
game 4 get turned one by sableye didnt get a turn. ( playing exact mirror)
top 2: Game one I go first judge beacuse of bad hand he gets the donk
game 2: he misses donk on ym lone crobat I td a chomp he kills crobat next turn then chomp 2 turns latter.
i wasnt playing anything that waas really donky just sp with sableye start and something to help try and possibly get the donk.
round 4 and t2 were between the 2 best seniors in FL.
I guess pokemon asked some judges to record how many donks ect and there were 31 at the smallish BR for florida in jsut seniors and masters.
4 rounds
game 1 miss donk beacuse basic dark is prized
game 2 T2 donk miss turn one beacuse basic dark is prized
game 3 miss donk but sableye takes 4 prizes
game 4 get turned one by sableye didnt get a turn. ( playing exact mirror)
top 2: Game one I go first judge beacuse of bad hand he gets the donk
game 2: he misses donk on ym lone crobat I td a chomp he kills crobat next turn then chomp 2 turns latter.
i wasnt playing anything that waas really donky just sp with sableye start and something to help try and possibly get the donk.
round 4 and t2 were between the 2 best seniors in FL.
I guess pokemon asked some judges to record how many donks ect and there were 31 at the smallish BR for florida in jsut seniors and masters.
So, reluctantly went to BR today with Grafton. Wanted to see everyone, trade and see how things would go with the format. Pulled out my MegaJudge deck I have been using all season and added a couple more Spiritomb. Graf put together the sableye/garchomp hybrid thingy that PkB was referring to...LOL. He pretty much donked his way to a Victory Medal and 9 points probably. I somehow actually made it through swiss without being donked and went 5-1. In T4 I won two games against Machamp losing game 2 to a BTS Champ and not getting to draw a card. In T2 I lost game one in a decent game and then got Sableye donked in game 2 without drawing a card.
Overall it was not as bad as I expected but I think I just got lucky to avoid the donks as long as I did. I had more fun playing the HGSS format before the event and during lunch than I did playing for second place. Instead of playing tomorrow I am going to stay home and do yard work. Graf got his Victory Medal and maybe 9 points so might as well just be happy with that.
Overall it was not as bad as I expected but I think I just got lucky to avoid the donks as long as I did. I had more fun playing the HGSS format before the event and during lunch than I did playing for second place. Instead of playing tomorrow I am going to stay home and do yard work. Graf got his Victory Medal and maybe 9 points so might as well just be happy with that.
AyameHikaru
Active Member
I live in the Midwest US. Our meta is usually Luxchomps, Gengars, and a few Gyarados. Today it was 1 Gyarados, 1 ZPS, 1 LuxChomp, a VERY few random decks like mine, and a LOT of ReshiBoar.
Porii Sames
Active Member
^Smart move Brodysseus.
Aron Figaro
New Member
I hatedecked against Sabledonk, won 8 games out of 10, and proceeded to beat Vilegar twice, TTar, Sabledonk, and Snorlax(?) for the BR title. Flawless victory! There were quite a few sabledonks, one of them won juniors (sad when it's a bunch of little kids all new with BW, and the TO's son playing sabledonk; I AM NOT IMPRESSED SIR) and I think one of them made top in Seniors. None of them top cut in Masters.
Swordfish1989
New Member
Hopefully these results mean no rotation before nats/worlds
Saw about 7 Sabledonks today and one went 4-0, one went 3-3, one went 5-1, and the other went 5-1. Cant remember the rest.
This should be an example really to P!P that the format is just not going to work.
---------- Post added 05/21/2011 at 10:33 PM ----------
I'm guessing you havent experienced any of this season. The same decks winning every tourney, and Sabledonk roaming at nats (If no rotation).
I really want to play at least one turn don't you?
Not to mention many really skilled players will quit this game if their isnt a rotation, so I feel your comment was not thought out at all.
This should be an example really to P!P that the format is just not going to work.
---------- Post added 05/21/2011 at 10:33 PM ----------
I'm guessing you havent experienced any of this season. The same decks winning every tourney, and Sabledonk roaming at nats (If no rotation).
I really want to play at least one turn don't you?
Not to mention many really skilled players will quit this game if their isnt a rotation, so I feel your comment was not thought out at all.
Reading these threads doesn't make me want to go to my first BR tomorrow. Especially since I know what most of the players are bringing for the Masters division at my event. Of the 12 I know that are showing 9 are bringing Sabledonk while I shelved Sablelock and I am now running a reshiram/zekrom wave deck instead. Because I hate turn one games and want the best possible way to prevent the donk.
I judged the BR today, and I heard that the one in Dayton was won by a Sabledonk list, but can't first hand confirm that.
I think a great example of how bad this format has become comes down to this. Round 3, within ten minutes, all but 3 matches were finished in Masters. A huge number of games finished well under the 10 minute mark the entire day. Often half. Now, considering BEFORE these rules, a ton of games were going near the 30 minute mark, and a lot going to turns, this is a HUGE change that is hard to ignore. Interpret the meaning behind that all you want, but I don't see these quick games being healthy, hard fought wins. They appeared to all be lopsided rollings, and often not due to skill at all. Seeing how a good, hard fought even game SHOULD take the full 30 minutes in this format ( a full game didn't get any " quicker " ) the fact that about half of the games are over within 10 means that a LOT of those are NOT healthy games.
We had an absurd amount of Gyarados decks, and Gyarados won Juniors, Seniors, and Masters. I believe it also took 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 6th in Masters. 3rd was a Magnezone Regirock deck that fed off of Gyarados nearly every round as well.
The issue isn't just the deck "Sabledonk" because that never was the problem. Everyone decided to make it the poster child term for the problem these rules implement, when in reality, while it is the best example of a deck able to make the most absurd turn one kills, it isn't really a tournament winning deck. Sableye, and the HUGE boon to going first, coupled with the nerf to rare candy, makes it so that more god starts happen from SP decks, Gyarados in particular ( BTS is abusive beyond belief. The Rare Candy nerf, and t1 trainers were NOT meant to be enforced in a format where Broken Time Space was still legal. Same with Sableye. ) and stage 2 decks are even FURTHER handicapped.
Whoever opened with Sableye either won on the first turn, or generally had such an absurd start that they were bound to win quickly thereafter. I think the next BRs I'll be going to, I'll make some observations. I want to jot down the win % of players who open with Sableye vs those who do not. I guarantee the #s will be staggering.
Whats even more frightening is that the decks being used at the BR I played at didn't even fully capitalize on the degeneracy of what can be done in this format. A lot of people merely ported over their Regionals decks, added 4 Sableye, and played. The results were STILL imbalanced, and this isn't even with deck lists fully abusing what is possible.
I think I heard the guy who took 2nd at our BR say that his finals game 1 was the only "real" game he played all day out of 7 rounds.
I think a great example of how bad this format has become comes down to this. Round 3, within ten minutes, all but 3 matches were finished in Masters. A huge number of games finished well under the 10 minute mark the entire day. Often half. Now, considering BEFORE these rules, a ton of games were going near the 30 minute mark, and a lot going to turns, this is a HUGE change that is hard to ignore. Interpret the meaning behind that all you want, but I don't see these quick games being healthy, hard fought wins. They appeared to all be lopsided rollings, and often not due to skill at all. Seeing how a good, hard fought even game SHOULD take the full 30 minutes in this format ( a full game didn't get any " quicker " ) the fact that about half of the games are over within 10 means that a LOT of those are NOT healthy games.
We had an absurd amount of Gyarados decks, and Gyarados won Juniors, Seniors, and Masters. I believe it also took 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 6th in Masters. 3rd was a Magnezone Regirock deck that fed off of Gyarados nearly every round as well.
The issue isn't just the deck "Sabledonk" because that never was the problem. Everyone decided to make it the poster child term for the problem these rules implement, when in reality, while it is the best example of a deck able to make the most absurd turn one kills, it isn't really a tournament winning deck. Sableye, and the HUGE boon to going first, coupled with the nerf to rare candy, makes it so that more god starts happen from SP decks, Gyarados in particular ( BTS is abusive beyond belief. The Rare Candy nerf, and t1 trainers were NOT meant to be enforced in a format where Broken Time Space was still legal. Same with Sableye. ) and stage 2 decks are even FURTHER handicapped.
Whoever opened with Sableye either won on the first turn, or generally had such an absurd start that they were bound to win quickly thereafter. I think the next BRs I'll be going to, I'll make some observations. I want to jot down the win % of players who open with Sableye vs those who do not. I guarantee the #s will be staggering.
Whats even more frightening is that the decks being used at the BR I played at didn't even fully capitalize on the degeneracy of what can be done in this format. A lot of people merely ported over their Regionals decks, added 4 Sableye, and played. The results were STILL imbalanced, and this isn't even with deck lists fully abusing what is possible.
I think I heard the guy who took 2nd at our BR say that his finals game 1 was the only "real" game he played all day out of 7 rounds.
chrisrocks
Member
i lost to 3 sabledonks due to flips (I was running sabledonk as well)
I feel that the format is not fair and players don't have alot of options to play for battle roads.....
I feel that the format is not fair and players don't have alot of options to play for battle roads.....
If I get a turn and get donked the old donk style, ie turn 2, that is my fault, my deck isn't consistent enough, as in I must not run enough call NRG/"insert old donk prevention card here" I got to draw, I had an oportunity I didn't plan for the turn I was alloted.
Sabledonk is worse than Uxie donk or even getting donked under the old rules because I didn't get to draw, not once, it doesn't matter if I have 3 decent sized basics, collector, or even call NRG in my hand, i lose while I watch some kid with a net deck play solitaire for 15 mins.
MORE THAN HALF of the masters matches were over in 10 mins or less at my BR. While the others generally had legit matches or ones where Sabledonk didn't pull it off the rest of us were just sitting around looking at our PTO going, "OK Farb, when's the rotation" one donk from sableye and you should want it too.
I question anyone here who thinks the rotation shouldn't happen, I'd even be happy if nats and worlds was under Europe rules, MD-COL no BW rules. But MD-BW is a gosh darn joke, for real, you can run and tell that homeboy.
Sabledonk is worse than Uxie donk or even getting donked under the old rules because I didn't get to draw, not once, it doesn't matter if I have 3 decent sized basics, collector, or even call NRG in my hand, i lose while I watch some kid with a net deck play solitaire for 15 mins.
MORE THAN HALF of the masters matches were over in 10 mins or less at my BR. While the others generally had legit matches or ones where Sabledonk didn't pull it off the rest of us were just sitting around looking at our PTO going, "OK Farb, when's the rotation" one donk from sableye and you should want it too.
I question anyone here who thinks the rotation shouldn't happen, I'd even be happy if nats and worlds was under Europe rules, MD-COL no BW rules. But MD-BW is a gosh darn joke, for real, you can run and tell that homeboy.
Chairman Kaga
Active Member
The finals in my BR today lasted a total of four turns. The only reason it wasn't two turns was because the Sabledonk player went second both games. It was the shortest top cut match I've ever judged in four years of working this game -- barely over 10 minutes.
There were several other games on the day where the second player never got a turn, and some of those weren't even Sabledonk -- just Sableye tech starts with some good draws.
I don't like to use the word "broken", as I know there are good counters to Sableye -- but yeah, this is pretty much as close to broken as it gets.
There were several other games on the day where the second player never got a turn, and some of those weren't even Sabledonk -- just Sableye tech starts with some good draws.
I don't like to use the word "broken", as I know there are good counters to Sableye -- but yeah, this is pretty much as close to broken as it gets.
baby mario
Front Page Article Editor<br><a href="http://pokeg
People are already missing the point in the 'What Won BRs' thread.
It doesn't matter if Sabledonk wins every single BR or none at all. What matters is that it is discouraging attendance, making a mockery of the game by having every match end in a couple of turns (whether it wins or loses), and replacing skill with random dumb luck.
It doesn't matter if Sabledonk wins every single BR or none at all. What matters is that it is discouraging attendance, making a mockery of the game by having every match end in a couple of turns (whether it wins or loses), and replacing skill with random dumb luck.
Aron Figaro
New Member
Baby Mario has it right. That and making six year olds in their first tournament game cry. That's no fun either.
Anyways, attendancewise: first one this wekeend nobody showed up, second one we had 10 masters, I think 6 seniors and 4 juniors. Something small like that; We don't normally have THAT much bigger turnout, but I recognized quite a few missing faces.
Another BR today, but I won't be attending; I seem to have developed a case of something better to do. Too bad, I was hoping to win a second one.
Anyways, attendancewise: first one this wekeend nobody showed up, second one we had 10 masters, I think 6 seniors and 4 juniors. Something small like that; We don't normally have THAT much bigger turnout, but I recognized quite a few missing faces.
Another BR today, but I won't be attending; I seem to have developed a case of something better to do. Too bad, I was hoping to win a second one.
Best 2/3, got donked twice by sableye/gyarados. The player using deck went 5/0 after swiss, has only been playing for fun for a few months, player dosn't even have a deck, I gave said player the deck.
I still won the BR, but this goes to show that, this was a very bad idea for P!P, I didn't even get to get a single turn. When usually i know i could win regardless any other day.
That being said i had my share or knocking a person out turn one too, so i shouldn't complain.
I still won the BR, but this goes to show that, this was a very bad idea for P!P, I didn't even get to get a single turn. When usually i know i could win regardless any other day.
That being said i had my share or knocking a person out turn one too, so i shouldn't complain.
i mainly went to the BR to trade and test hgss with bob, but i played the 1st 2 rounds. i borrowed the emboar/fortress deck cuz it looked fun, and i have no chance of a points invite this season anyways.
round 1 dude started spiritomb and got t1 charizard and reshiram in play lol what can ya do
round 2 got t1'd by sabledonk, which i expected to happen
i dropped after that, but i know of at least 5 or more players in MA who were playing the sableye donk deck and getting the t1 all day.. pretty sure all the reports in this thread and winning deck reports/donk reports from to's will be enough to ensure a rotation before nationals.
round 1 dude started spiritomb and got t1 charizard and reshiram in play lol what can ya do
round 2 got t1'd by sabledonk, which i expected to happen
i dropped after that, but i know of at least 5 or more players in MA who were playing the sableye donk deck and getting the t1 all day.. pretty sure all the reports in this thread and winning deck reports/donk reports from to's will be enough to ensure a rotation before nationals.
So I played Sabledonk yesterday. Went 5-0 in swiiss and lost in T2 to the other Sabledonk. Overall if you count our T3 matches combined we went 16-6. 4 of our losses were to each other (last round of swiss and then the 3 matches of T2). Other 2 losses were "Game 2" of T4 when we both scooped as the opponent went first. So if you eliminate our "mirrors" we went 12-2 (with the above mentioned scoops).
From my matches, I think I only started Sableye in like 4 of 11 matches, but sometimes still went first. My non-sabledonk opponents when they went first never Collectered T1. List of opponents: Feraligatr/Blastoise/Oshawott, Gyarados, LostGar, SP, SableDonk, T4: Gyarados, T2, Sabledonk.
For perspectives, I played the deck to:
A) See if this really would happen (which it did)
B) I did ZERO MD-BW playtesting beyond building Sabledonk, playing one test game against my junior son (who then said "that's cool" let me try it, and then soundly beat his siblings for the next hour or so), once the arguing/fighting/crying stopped, we "banned" Sabledonk and returned to HGSS-On playtesting
C) Because we've had a stressful week, I didn't want to stress at BR. I was either going to win quick or lose quick. I told the PTO, I think I played a grand total of 20 minutes of Pokemon during the 6 hour 5-round swiss and TopCut.
Was the deck "fun/interesting" to play? Sure to a degree. Because I actually got to play my cards. Probably half my matches at least my opponent never got to draw a card. But the experience overall wasn't that fun because we didn't really "play". It wasn't a game. It was win a coin flip (or auto-go-first) and then auto-pilot through the deck and either do enough damage or not.
I will say that I did get a "dead hand" in the 3rd match of T2 so even with a sableye start and going first, the deck failed and I was sabledonked right back. So the deck isn't perfect and I think is losing some too. But like I think I've read, if a deck can just throw in 4 sableye, Unown Dark, Special Dark and Donk. that's not really fun.
Anyway, we probably won't be attending another BR due to schedule, travel and Sabledonk. I do hope POP can take all the info we can provide and give us the rotation for Nats. The kids and I have so much enjoyed HGSS-on as we can play real games. Not rush to donk.
Hope you enjoyed the post!
K
From my matches, I think I only started Sableye in like 4 of 11 matches, but sometimes still went first. My non-sabledonk opponents when they went first never Collectered T1. List of opponents: Feraligatr/Blastoise/Oshawott, Gyarados, LostGar, SP, SableDonk, T4: Gyarados, T2, Sabledonk.
For perspectives, I played the deck to:
A) See if this really would happen (which it did)
B) I did ZERO MD-BW playtesting beyond building Sabledonk, playing one test game against my junior son (who then said "that's cool" let me try it, and then soundly beat his siblings for the next hour or so), once the arguing/fighting/crying stopped, we "banned" Sabledonk and returned to HGSS-On playtesting
C) Because we've had a stressful week, I didn't want to stress at BR. I was either going to win quick or lose quick. I told the PTO, I think I played a grand total of 20 minutes of Pokemon during the 6 hour 5-round swiss and TopCut.
Was the deck "fun/interesting" to play? Sure to a degree. Because I actually got to play my cards. Probably half my matches at least my opponent never got to draw a card. But the experience overall wasn't that fun because we didn't really "play". It wasn't a game. It was win a coin flip (or auto-go-first) and then auto-pilot through the deck and either do enough damage or not.
I will say that I did get a "dead hand" in the 3rd match of T2 so even with a sableye start and going first, the deck failed and I was sabledonked right back. So the deck isn't perfect and I think is losing some too. But like I think I've read, if a deck can just throw in 4 sableye, Unown Dark, Special Dark and Donk. that's not really fun.
Anyway, we probably won't be attending another BR due to schedule, travel and Sabledonk. I do hope POP can take all the info we can provide and give us the rotation for Nats. The kids and I have so much enjoyed HGSS-on as we can play real games. Not rush to donk.
Hope you enjoyed the post!
K
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