Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Donking, and why it is suddenly a big concern for the community

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Donks: Whatever, annoying but it happens.
Donk Decks: No respect at all. :/

This is a CHILDREN'S CARD GAME. If you are that competitive I recommend a different card game.
 
Maybe they didn't "deserve" a win, but I don't think it's unreasonable to think they deserved a game. Getting "cheated" out out of a game can feel just as bad, if not worse, than getting "cheated" out of a win.
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I think this is a good way to put it. Donking is a part of the game, but donk decks don't have to be.

This is a CHILDREN'S CARD GAME. If you are that competitive I recommend a different card game.
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Of course people are going to be competetive. That's how you get the full experience of pokemon: by practicing, testing new ideas, and trying to reap the benefits of your love of the game. My question is why aren't you so competetive? Above all, pokemon is for fun. But it is the most fun when you really emerse yourself in the game. You just can't do that with uxie donk or beedrill or whatever.

And btw, can we even call it a children's game anymore? Look at nationals: The masters to juniors ratio has to be like 5 to 1 or something. There are probably more players over thirty than there are juniors. Food for thought...
 
Being competitive is one thing but making a deck to win T1 is over the top competitive and forgetting this is a fun game.

I've played against 60 year old Pokemon players but as long as there are a number of 8 and 9 year olds... c'mon, it's Pokemon for God's sake.
 
Being competitive is one thing but making a deck to win T1 is over the top competitive and forgetting this is a fun game.
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I think we're sort of on the same page and sort of arguing against eachother, Qwachansey lol. Btw, doesn't pokemon mean pocket monsters? Sounds way too scary for kids. Must be for adults... jk
 
NoPoke said:
strong players perform at a high level most of the time, not all of the time.
Weak players perform at a low level most of the time, not all of the time.
Given natural variation there is plenty of opportunity for stronger players to lose to weaker players.
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Ah, the "on any given Sunday" argument. Circumstances, variations, risk-takings, etc. To me, that all equates to mostly-uncontrollable forces. Forces that you CAN control, and how well you control thoses forces define your skill. Forces that you CANNOT control define aspects of luck.

The line between luck and skill might seem fuzzy to some, but for me, it's mostly black-n-white. :thumb:
 
Ah, the "on any given Sunday" argument. Circumstances, variations, risk-takings, etc. To me, that all equates to mostly-uncontrollable forces. Forces that you CAN control, and how well you control thoses forces define your skill. Forces that you CANNOT control define aspects of luck.

The line between luck and skill might seem fuzzy to some, but for me, it's mostly black-n-white.
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True. Plus, adding on to that, what some players consider luck may be considered skill to other players. Often times good or great players will make moves that may appear to be riding on luck (ie poltergeist, hurl into darkness, etc), but they are really carefully analyzed decisions.
 
Qwachansey said:
This is a CHILDREN'S CARD GAME. If you are that competitive I recommend a different card game.
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This is a silly argument. The entire point of any game is competition -- well, almost any game, but surely it is the principal point of a game where two players beat up each other's creatures.
 
Qwachansey said:
This is a CHILDREN'S CARD GAME. If you are that competitive I recommend a different card game.
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LOL also, statements like is always inflaming and makes me think someone is equating POKEMON to a game of CHUTES AND LADDERS. I always cringe at these quotes. It is a game, thus it deserves the degree of respect and relative gravity of any game that folks have a passion about. (I think I am in agreement with you on donks, just don't pull the CHILDERN'S CARD GAME line)

But I hope that we agree with all games it is :
Goal #1 is to have fun.
Goal #2 is try to win.

If you only focus on Goal #2, we are obviously missing the point of games. But everyone is basically saying that if the format continues to evolve to one that has TOO MANY DONKs, can make Goal #1 hard for the DONK'D.
 
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If you only focus on Goal #2, we are obviously missing the point of games. But everyone is basically saying that if the format continues to evolve to one that has TOO MANY DONKs, can make Goal #1 hard for the DONK'D.
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Not only does it make it hard for the donk'd, but it also makes it hard for the...um...donkee ?
 
SLOW DECK said:
LOL also, statements like is always inflaming and makes me think someone is equating POKEMON to a game of CHUTES AND LADDERS. I always cringe at these quotes. It is a game, thus it deserves the degree of respect and relative gravity of any game that folks have a passion about. (I think I am in agreement with you on donks, just don't pull the CHILDERN'S CARD GAME line)

But I hope that we agree with all games it is :
Goal #1 is to have fun.
Goal #2 is try to win.

If you only focus on Goal #2, we are obviously missing the point of games. But everyone is basically saying that if the format continues to evolve to one that has TOO MANY DONKs, can make Goal #1 hard for the DONK'D.
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What if Goal #1 is accomplished best by accomplishing Goal #2, I know I personally tend to Goal #1 a lot more when I Goal #2.
 
because there can only be one winner. So in your approach 90+% of the players at a tournament are not having fun, most wont ever have "fun" either as there are a lot of players who never win. Tournaments are designed to crown a winner but make no mistake that TOs want all the players to enjoy themselves and not just those on the top table.

take a close look at Biggie's signature.
 
NoPoke said:
because there can only be one winner. So in your approach 90+% of the players at a tournament are not having fun, most wont ever have "fun" either as there are a lot of players who never win. Tournaments are designed to crown a winner but make no mistake that TOs want all the players to enjoy themselves and not just those on the top table.

take a close look at Biggie's signature.
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By winning I'm not referring to actually winning a tournaments.I'm referring to winning like individual games, or being successful overall. For example I am the type of player that to have fun need, to fulfill the expectation I set for myself, so like say going no worse than x-1 at local event. Not saying its the only factor, but it is a big one. But like at nationals, every year I have either had sub-par results or didn't even play to preserve rating but it's always a BLAST, same with worlds.

Now a Pokeparent or someone who plays for different reasons probably doesn't these standards.
 
goals are generally good things to have but they can bite back and interfere with contentment which is also a good thing to have. Whereas if you can enjoy playing no matter the outcome then you always come out on top. Some days are better than others but they are all good days.

Even adjusting for just winning games, half the field at any tournament finish below par on the day.

I still refer you to Biggie's sig :D
 
NoPoke said:
goals are generally good things to have but they can bite back and interfere with contentment which is also a good thing to have. Whereas if you can enjoy playing no matter the outcome then you always come out on top. Some days are better than others but they are all good days.

Even adjusting for just winning games, half the field at any tournament finish below par on the day.

I still refer you to Biggie's sig :D
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I totally get what you're saying. But as an Individual I personally am fulfilled when I succeed and unfulfilled when I "fail" it's not something I can really change, it's my personality. You might not be like this which is totally fine.

Ultimately, its about behavior. If I do poorly, I won't be happy, I won't be having fun. As much as misery love company I'm not going to allow myself to behave in such a manner that I'm ruining other peoples days. If you beat me, even if it's a donk, or by a bad ruling, or good luck, I will never not offer my hand for a handshake. Likewise, when I win. I'm not going to gloat and behave like a bad sport making other people be upset.

The problem many people have with donks, is that my want to win, which is what I enjoy, gets in your way of your having fun, assuming fun for you means playing a good thought out game. So your interest in enjoying yourself conflict directly with that same interest in me. This happens a lot in society as whole. That's why we have rules in Pokemon, and laws in the real world. Which means that a person is only entitled to have "fun"(playing the actual game) if you are if you are willing to accept that both you any other opponent have the right to do what ever they like as long as it's with in the rules.

For a player like for example, I like winning, but as much as like winning I cannot stack my deck in order to do so, even if I would consider that a good way to achieving what I want. For, a player like you(I'm assuming here that you enjoy it when the game is being played with hard thought by both players not donk.) Then you have to be ok with me playing decks that you don't find fun.

EDIT: My ultimate point is that people should not be pissed at other players for trying to achieve their goals as long as they are following the rules.Being upset at the rules and wanting them changed, now that's a whole other thing completely legitimate thing.
 
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Among all players, the Win-Loss percentage is 50%.

So, Pokemon players are only happy half the time, aggregate-wise. :tongue:
 
That is if you don't even count the guys who are only happy if they go 9-0 and call folks scrubs if they go 8-1 at regionals or something.
 
Loner said:
What if Goal #1 is accomplished best by accomplishing Goal #2, I know I personally tend to Goal #1 a lot more when I Goal #2.
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That's not having fun playing the game. It's having fun winning.

Playing a game is almost a form of conversation with someone in itself. Donking is saying, "hi, I don't care (even the slightest), okay, good-bye" after being introduced.

But the real issue here is the TCG printing OP cards that work well together. Every type of deck should only be allowed 1 OP card. Ultimately, it's the game designer's fault--crazy people can only fix themselves. =)

---------- Post added 01/22/2011 at 08:55 AM ----------
Loner said:
I totally get what you're saying. But as an Individual I personally am fulfilled when I succeed and unfulfilled when I "fail" it's not something I can really change, it's my personality. You might not be like this which is totally fine.

Ultimately, its about behavior. If I do poorly, I won't be happy, I won't be having fun. As much as misery love company I'm not going to allow myself to behave in such a manner that I'm ruining other peoples days. If you beat me, even if it's a donk, or by a bad ruling, or good luck, I will never not offer my hand for a handshake. Likewise, when I win. I'm not going to gloat and behave like a bad sport making other people be upset.

The problem many people have with donks, is that my want to win, which is what I enjoy, gets in your way of your having fun, assuming fun for you means playing a good thought out game. So your interest in enjoying yourself conflict directly with that same interest in me. This happens a lot in society as whole. That's why we have rules in Pokemon, and laws in the real world. Which means that a person is only entitled to have "fun"(playing the actual game) if you are if you are willing to accept that both you any other opponent have the right to do what ever they like as long as it's with in the rules.

For a player like for example, I like winning, but as much as like winning I cannot stack my deck in order to do so, even if I would consider that a good way to achieving what I want. For, a player like you(I'm assuming here that you enjoy it when the game is being played with hard thought by both players not donk.) Then you have to be ok with me playing decks that you don't find fun.

EDIT: My ultimate point is that people should not be pissed at other players for trying to achieve their goals as long as they are following the rules.Being upset at the rules and wanting them changed, now that's a whole other thing completely legitimate thing.
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You can change anything about your personallity that you don't see as a possitive. That's what makes the human spirit so powerful.
 
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