Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Issues Facing the TCG

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Ness said:
I too would absolutely love to see two day States & Regionals. Look how much Nationals improved when extending it into a three day tournament. I hope it never goes back! I also hear a lot of comparing Pokemon to Magic. Every move Pokemon has taken in the footsteps of Magic has been successful: turn extensions after time, Best 2/3 play, legitimate World Championships, World Championship decks, creating different formats. None of these things existed when Pokemon first debuted and all of them existed in Magic first. Why stop there? Magic also has a three-day Worlds with different formats, it rewards whatever country performs the best at Worlds, it has a Hall of Fame for the best players. Some of these ideas could be implemented in Pokemon, too, at least in some form. Magic has some really cool stuff and it's had more years than Pokemon had to come up with these ideas. We should use this to our advantage.

Complaining about the costs of a venue hall for an extra day is a joke. Yeah, stuff costs money. C'est la vie. The price of these venues is dirt compared to what people spend in cards. Common sense should tell anyone that it keeps the game alive & fun, which ends up in a more profitable game in the end anyway. The bottom line is Two Day events aren't even a luxury at events like Regionals, they are now a necessity to have a fair & fun tournament. We had a whole thread about this and a clear majority of players wanted two-day Regionals. Hopefully enough PTOs are reading this and will actually listen to the players and take the initiative. This is where 8 pages of discussion & brainstorming, with hundreds of opinions, and thousands of people reading can turn into something productive. We see what the players want, and what the tournaments need. Now, it's up to the PTOs to actually do something.
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As a PTO I will explain one bit of this for you and everyone else....the PTOs that run Regionals (not me btw) are given a set budget from TPCi OP. In that budget, the PTO has to pay for the venue, get staff, door prizes, etc. The cost of these venues is not cheap. Contrary to your belief. Go out and price the cost of a hall that holds 200-350 ppl for 1-2 days. Receptions are the biggest cost of a wedding (as a person that is married, I know, unless you buy a ginormous diamond engagement ring) SO, saying that you hope the PTOs reading this will follow the players' desires.....it isnt up to "us", it is up to TPCi's budget. If they would give the $$, others would do this. They tried it out with Tom Shea in the NE this past year for Reg's (2 days).....his numbers went DOWN. That speaks volumes to me. Not the handful of players here. I'm sure TPCi has talked with Tom about the pros/cons of a 2 day Reg after his was finished.

Keith
 
It makes no sense to me how players are expected to be able to endure a full day of playing at State and Regional events-- ie. 10 am until midnight and later, sometimes even to 2 and 3 am-- when they are not expected to do anything near the same at National and World, the two biggest events of the season. Both of the latter are broken up into multiple days, allowing players to rest and get rejuvenated rather than burn completely out and play at an inferior level (because regardless of player skill, someone who is forced to play Pokemon for 16+ hours straight is not going to be operating optimally; the body and mind need rest). It's absurd when a top 2 match is won more by who can keep his eyes open than who has made the better plays on the hour, especially when so much is on the line.

The money/venue issue is "real" but fixable, as most issues regarding money are. It should not be a true obstacle. This is of course a challenge not directed at PTOs who have no control over the budget allotted to them by TPCi, but at TPCi itself.
 
vanderbilt_grad said:
I've got to add that, while juniors are usually done much earlier ... the long hours and late nights can be hard on them too.
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Not as much as you'd think. St. Louis Regionals a few years back, the Jrs were actually the last players to finish. And I seem to remember both Finals players with massive ear-to-ear grins at the end, still remarkably fresh given that they started playing at 10am and didn't finish until I think around midnight or 1am...
 
What I don't understand is that, what's wrong with having an entry fee for US events like States and Regionals and use that to cover the costs of the second day? I think Battle Roads and City Championships are great, local events that are awesome to have for free. When you get to States/Regionals, most people are prepared to spend alot of money with travel and sometimes a hotel stay as well - it appeals more to the competitive older player base who would welcome the second day.
 
Another option for the second day of a regional is....

Hold it at a local gaming store the following day.

I am sure they would love to have 48 players and the groups they came with in their stores on a Sunday (generally the slowest day). Allow them to host side events like draft, modified, unlimited, sealed and the such. This would eliminate the venue cost for day 2. Sure there would still need to be a staff, but I'm sure they could be compensated somehow...

Just a simple suggestion, as I am trying to help....

Jimmy
 
I don't think States or Regionals will ever be 2 days long in their current form.

Lawman mentions the budget that TPCi gives the PTOs, and I really think that if States/Regionals "evolved" into a larger experience, and not just a single TCG tournament, TPCi would reevaluate the budget for the PTOs.

Personally, I'd like to see Video Game aspects added to States/Regionals (more at Regionals).

I'm sure the budget needed to be increased for Nationals with the Video Game Championships being added to the event, but I feel confident that TPCi feels the increase in cost is well worth the extra exposure and increased depth of the event.

I only see this as the inevitable future for States and Regionals. This product isn't all about the TCG anymore. There is no more Pokemon TCG Nationals or Pokemon TCG Worlds. Now there is an all-encompassing Pokemon Nationals and Pokemon Worlds with TCG and VGC elements included. Nationals and Worlds is better for having these added elements and I feel Regionals and possibly even States could benefit from the same inclusion.
 
butlerforhire said:
It makes no sense to me how players are expected to be able to endure a full day of playing at State and Regional events-- ie. 10 am until midnight and later, sometimes even to 2 and 3 am.
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QFT. I can't speak for everyone, but I definitely make more misplays in Regionals/States cuts than I do any other event. I don't think its reaching to say that many players are fatigued.

Also, as Jimmy pointed out, why not hold the 2nd day at a different venue? We don't need nearly the same amount of space. I could also go for an entrance fee.
 
BANGINBOX said:
Another option for the second day of a regional is....

Hold it at a local gaming store the following day.

I am sure they would love to have 48 players and the groups they came with in their stores on a Sunday (generally the slowest day). Allow them to host side events like draft, modified, unlimited, sealed and the such. This would eliminate the venue cost for day 2. Sure there would still need to be a staff, but I'm sure they could be compensated somehow...

Just a simple suggestion, as I am trying to help....

Jimmy
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This is an interesting idea. It probably wouldn't solve all the problems (particularly if a gaming store isn't within a close drive of the main venue), but I think it's more viable then renting an entire venue for two days. Generally speaking, one day is fine for all the swiss rounds, and the next day is bound to be smaller and more compatible with the smaller venue.
 
Not all Reg's venues will have a gaming store nearby. Likewise, why should we exclude all the other folks that may want to see the topcut matches? Sure, some people take off after swiss is completed and all the door prizes handed out, but a good % of the players stick aroud to watch some/all of the topcut matches.

I like the idea of using a local card shop for day 2, if it is feasible.

Keith
 
Most PTO's that run events have other Jobs as well, so that might be a factor in streching some events out over two days. With Nationals and worlds most of the staff probably take vacation time to do these events, I know I do. Just my two-cents worth.

chuzzoe
 
As much as I love the Battle Roads, I would really like to see a "Super-Regionals" held between Regionals and Nationals (kind of like the old Gym Challenge tourneys) where 4 or 5 events are spread out across the US on the same day. It would give people who can make it to Nationals one last chance to gain points at a very large event.
 
I think one thing that Pokemon has been missing that could help in a number of areas, but particularly financially, is having side events at large tournaments. At a 200 or 300 person states or Regionals, why not offer 8-person ques of modified or drafts? There aren't as many 0-2 drops in this game as there are in others, but if you even had 1-2 staff people running a modified side event, and then 1-2 more doing a draft, charging $10 for each, and giving our product or door prize things (mats, hats, posters, packs, singles, etc.) you could make a decent amount of money, methinks. Particularly during the top cut, when 75%+ of the player base has nothing to do.

I understand this isn't perfect as that extra staff needs to be compensated, space is an issue, etc. but it's certainly an option, imo.
 
Lawman said:
As a PTO I will explain one bit of this for you and everyone else....the PTOs that run Regionals (not me btw) are given a set budget from TPCi OP. In that budget, the PTO has to pay for the venue, get staff, door prizes, etc. The cost of these venues is not cheap.
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Thank you for the info, Keith. So while it is technically "up to the PTO" to host two-day Regionals, perhaps TPCi OP isn't providing the necessary budget to do so. (I don't know the budget, nor have I ever ran a Regional, so I can't be the one to say that for sure.) But, I do I know PUI reads these threads and I hope they are listening. I don't think a small budget increase for Regionals is an unreasonable request, given how the game has evolved and the player base has increased. The extra cost of a second day for a venue will better tournaments for everyone. It makes the tournament less stressful on both the players & the staff, and will leave fond memories of fun times playing Pokemon, rather than bitter memories of playing until 4 AM to lose a 2/3 series to a person who lost Game 1 to you, then beat you twice in Sudden Death.

The bottom line: The players want two-day Regionals and the game needs it.
 
I am tossing this idea out there: Why not have members/players who have active POP ID's pay a small annual fee?
The money from that annual fee could be used to fund for venues for larger events.
I would be willing to pay a "membership fee"- say- $10.00 for the year. Or whatever.
Even if I could not attend nationals/regionals/worlds- I know the money went into a hobby.
Or the money could be on a state-to-state fund basis for places that have a larger fan base.

Also, the VGC scene is getting bigger. And it is needing to be structured. Even have a VG membership fee that is annual.

Just putting in my thoughts.
 
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Repeat... don't hold families hostage for 2 days. 1 day. Start early.
Hotel options for Friday night and Saturday Night are good and should be encouraged. People can and have always planned according to their distance to the venue for the event. All of the regionals or states that I have attended over the years that have been out state, we travel to a hotel the night before, and is ready go early in the morning. We stay a 2nd night or go straight home depending on our finish and mood. My only complaint is that we are ready to start early, everyone else should be also.
 
Benzo said:
I am tossing this idea out there: Why not have members/players who have active POP ID's pay a small annual fee?
The money from that annual fee could be used to fund for venues for larger events.
I would be willing to pay a "membership fee"- say- $10.00 for the year. Or whatever.
Even if I could not attend nationals/regionals/worlds- I know the money went into a hobby.
Or the money could be on a state-to-state fund basis for places that have a larger fan base.

Also, the VGC scene is getting bigger. And it is needing to be structured. Even have a VG membership fee that is annual.

Just putting in my thoughts.
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This sounds like a great idea, but I think it would turn away a lot of casual league players/those who go to tournaments a few times a year for fun. Most of the people in my previous league were college students, and would have just played on their own instead of participating in league or going to tournaments. Much of the appeal for them and parents of the younger players is that organized play is free - in their minds they already sink a great deal of money into the cards and traveling to events. While $10 a year is pretty reasonable to me and probably a lot of active players, I can see it turning off others.

Also this may sound silly, but it's almost like punishing players for being more active. =P
 
SuperWooper said:
Hey! Maybe they could use that money to hire some guys whose job it would be to update the rankings.
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The individual rankings update every day, they are used in calculations after every tournament. You can see your own anytime you want by logging in to pokemon.com, and in your tournament history you can even see your opponent's if you remember who you played which round.

For whatever reason, TPC is choosing to withhold the publicly searchable lists. Maybe it's to encourage participation in the City Championships without knowing where you stand yet, I don't know. But rest assured the numbers are being crunched, you just can't see them yet.
 
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