LionheartEX
Active Member
what exactly IS this wavedash....like...whats the move lol? I just want to identify it so I can give myu opinion here.
melee discussions
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DireVulcan; best G&W in the world. 
Wavedashing is jumping and immediately airdodging in a trajectory towards the floor, therefore creating a sliding effect which can improve anyone's game. Considering a bug by some, though if you look into its aspects it really isn't one at all.
Wavedashing is jumping and immediately airdodging in a trajectory towards the floor, therefore creating a sliding effect which can improve anyone's game. Considering a bug by some, though if you look into its aspects it really isn't one at all.
LionheartEX
Active Member
thats not a bug... its quickly jumping and hitting R lol
anyone who thinks wavedashing is a bug should probably learn to play. I dont even play competeitely, and I use it all the time (didnt know what to call it lol). if it were a bug, Nintendo would have said something. so Marril, and Kyfogre, if you can provide solid proof that this is a bug, from Nintendo, then do so, if not, stop arguing about it.
anyone who thinks wavedashing is a bug should probably learn to play. I dont even play competeitely, and I use it all the time (didnt know what to call it lol). if it were a bug, Nintendo would have said something. so Marril, and Kyfogre, if you can provide solid proof that this is a bug, from Nintendo, then do so, if not, stop arguing about it.
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vietgamer1021
New Member
DONT BRING THE ARGUMENT AGAIN WELL WASTE 9000 MORE PAGES CUZ OF THIS CRAP ARGUEMENT
wavedash in my opinion is not a bug, to some it is, and frankly i dont care we have our reasoning behind it
and besides at the smashfest i mentioned earlier, my friend and i got someone in teams with double falcon punch
we were teaming double falcon for fun, and the first thing i do on kongo jungle (i was p4, he was p3) is jump falcon punch, i hit my opponent (hes falco) and he flies off and recovers
however, as he is recovering, my teammate jumps up and falcon punches him in the middle of his illusion recovery and he dies
i paused the game and we were laughing for like 2 minutes
and then later, my oppnent and his teammate were asking us if we were going to go serious (since we were fooling around) and we siad we would (as double falcon). my friend takes him out in like 6 seconds and he was like "***". My friend replied "dude, u wanted us to go serious man, so thats wat im doin" its so awesome, but later...
we were doing double falcon on FD, and my opponent was in a combo by my friend, i was gonig to die off to the right of FD, and i was under the stage and up+b but i knew i couldnt make the ledge
but my friend dairs the falco off the right of FD, i somehow catch him with my up+b and he gets wall spiked while i get saved cuz of that
dude, that was the coolest smashfest ever
wavedash in my opinion is not a bug, to some it is, and frankly i dont care we have our reasoning behind it
and besides at the smashfest i mentioned earlier, my friend and i got someone in teams with double falcon punch
we were teaming double falcon for fun, and the first thing i do on kongo jungle (i was p4, he was p3) is jump falcon punch, i hit my opponent (hes falco) and he flies off and recovers
however, as he is recovering, my teammate jumps up and falcon punches him in the middle of his illusion recovery and he dies
i paused the game and we were laughing for like 2 minutes
and then later, my oppnent and his teammate were asking us if we were going to go serious (since we were fooling around) and we siad we would (as double falcon). my friend takes him out in like 6 seconds and he was like "***". My friend replied "dude, u wanted us to go serious man, so thats wat im doin" its so awesome, but later...
we were doing double falcon on FD, and my opponent was in a combo by my friend, i was gonig to die off to the right of FD, and i was under the stage and up+b but i knew i couldnt make the ledge
but my friend dairs the falco off the right of FD, i somehow catch him with my up+b and he gets wall spiked while i get saved cuz of that
dude, that was the coolest smashfest ever
In either event, you still aren't able to understand what it is I'm saying (and I haven't tried to obfuscate my posts), so who is really the dumbass?
Having played Marth doesn't necessarily mean the answer is yes. Actually, knowing you, I'd guess the answer is a solid no, because no pro has ever told you to.
It's a rather obvious and blatant question-dodge all the same. Show some subtlety.
You make it sound like it's a different game or something. Down-smash does the same thing to a tournament player as it does to a casual player as it does to the AI. I've stated its uses, which don't change by setting. Usefulness is not usage.
Argumentum ad whateverum. I can't be bothered to remember what "argument from authority" is in Latin, but you're basically saying, "I'm automatically right because of my placings." Your tournament placings have nothing to do with what I'm in this thread to say, so shut up.
It's hard to win after you've given up.
You don't acknowledge wavedashing as a bug, either, but you'd be wrong on both counts. I'm a coder, wavedashing is a bug. Neither is a subjecti—do you even know the difference between "subjective" and "objective"? Something can't be "arguably" a bug, therefore it's not a subjective thing.
Speculation at least has a basis in reality. Your blind "LAWLZ MARIL CANT WAEVDASH!" just shows your ignorance. I'm certainly no master at it, but I can at least perform the damn bug.
Because the PokéGym has, besides SWFers, some rational, intelligent people. If you're any indication of what SWF is like, I wouldn't step near that hellhole if I were paid to.
"Years" ago means "earlier this thread" now?
You've extolled all the "virtues" of the wavedash, and you've said what a "good" thing it does for the game, thus by logical conclusion you wouldn't like the game without it. QED.
Oh please. Before you go hunting to misinform newbies, you should find a source that says it's not a bug. As I've explained, it follows the pathology of a bug, albeit one without grossly glitchy effects (such as MissingNo.), causing the ignorant and the stupid to insist it's not a bug simply because it doesn't look like what they imagine a bug to be.
Not all bugs are wildly "unpredictable" like MissingNo. is. A lot of them are more subtle than that. Your inability to understand such a simple concept shows how utterly incapable of judging whether or now I know how to code you are.
I'll say it in nice, friendly capital letters, for those idiots who simply cannot fathom such a simple concept: SOMETHING IS EITHER A BUG, OR IT IS NOT A BUG. THERE IS NO ROOM FOR OPINION.
vietgamer1021
New Member
well i go on SWF, and they do back up arguments if WD is a bug, if they dont (which im sure they have a topic), then u could actually amke a topic regarding that. however my opinion still stands. i beleive that it is a result of the game physics. the traction of the character, the angle of the air dodge, how fast you do it, it results in the length of the WD. i think that WD was/is a result of the game physics, but the developers never meant it to be abused. but then again, wat game doesnt have anything that isnt abused? but then again, people find out bugs in every game, and it will get abused or used in some way or another. but i really think that WD isnt a bug, since it ACTUALLY DOES FOLLOW THE GAME PHYSICS but it was not to be abused until people discovered it. sorta like "hm fox's down+b can kill people easily if i hit them off the stage, lets try it in a real match", theres always soemthing that is abused in everygame, regardless of a bug or not. btw i go on SWF, so dont stereotype everyone there form ur point of view on Hax (im not that much of an *****, am i XD).
LionheartEX
Active Member
if WD was a bug, then you wouldnt get any sort of animation, not only that, if it were a bug, it would be evident when you come down from some angles and half your character slides through the ground...of course, they dont, they slide along the ground as if theyre dodging something, and WD distance does vary dependant on the angle of the WD and the speed of it. if it were a bug, it would also have some sort of glitchyness to it, which it doesnt, there is an actual animation to go with it. your only calling it a bug because you get beat by it lol
Y'know Zero, if you actually acknowledged our opinion as valid instead of saying "YOU ARE NONCOMPETITIVE THEREFORE OPINION = NO" in large, elaborate posts, you could probably end this exaggerated, 40-something page argument. Because, you know, that the only reason this argument persists is because the elitist structure of the community (that means YOU) seems to persist and even encourage on looking down on people who don't wavedash, because it is a bug and exploiting a bug in most circles (the people who don't wavedash outnumber the people who do to a ridiculous extreme, I'd be willing to bet that less than one-onehundredth of a percent of the people who play smash wavedash) would be considered cheap.
When you wavedash, you jump and you airdodge into the ground on an angle. This causes you to slide in whatever direction you hit the ground, depending on the neutrality of the angle. It's the combination of sliding and the lack of a delay usually associated with airdodging that make this a bug. I can't see how you can abuse a bug and call it a legitimate method of gaining an upper hand on the competition. Crashing the game with the Ice Climbers would definately give me an upper hand on the competition if I were losing; I'd just keep crashing the game until I started winning.
When you wavedash, you jump and you airdodge into the ground on an angle. This causes you to slide in whatever direction you hit the ground, depending on the neutrality of the angle. It's the combination of sliding and the lack of a delay usually associated with airdodging that make this a bug. I can't see how you can abuse a bug and call it a legitimate method of gaining an upper hand on the competition. Crashing the game with the Ice Climbers would definately give me an upper hand on the competition if I were losing; I'd just keep crashing the game until I started winning.
Right. So are any other glitches you can name. They might not be a result of correct operation of the game's physics, but they're still the result of it.
That's a double negative, which is poor grammatical form.
For the umpteenth time, because I'm getting very sick of repeating myself:
THE FACT THAT WAVEDASH FOLLOWS ITS OWN SET OF RULES DOES NOTHING TO COUNTER THE FACT THAT IT IS STILL A BUG. OFTEN, BUGS WILL PERFORM QUITE RELIABLY AND SOMETIMES EVEN LOOK LIKE INTENDED FEATURES, BUT ARE NOT. WAVEDASHING IS AN EXAMPLE OF SUCH A BUG.
That said, I'll do the next few in a standardized format, statement of validity followed by counter-question:
Wrong. Are you trying to tell me that bugs can't have animation?
Wrong. Are you trying to tell me that it's only a bug when something wildly and plainly obviously wrong occurs?
Wrong. Same question as above.
Wrong. Are you aware you're not making any sense at all?
Honestly, despite what Zero Hax says, I actually am a coder. I may not have seen the code for any given game, but I've worked with games enough to know what constitutes a bug and what doesn't. Wavedashing is a bug. Just bloody admit it and get on with your day.
Do I have to say flat-up that such a thing would get me to shut up?
Right. It's cutting off an animation in a way that the game isn't normally supposed to.
LionheartEX
Active Member
lol agreed... completely disregarded my opinion
Marril, back it up with Nintendos word, then we'll believe you
you know if we dropped this argument in the first place this board would not be dead. Right?
Sandslash7
<a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showpost.php?p=
What are you talking about?????
Of course there is room for opinion!
Example:
I can be of the opinion that WD is not a bug. (Why would I not be able to think that Marril?) Even if it is, I can still hold that opinion. Until an Original Programmer (with proof that he is one) says that it IS a bug, I can hold my opinion.
End Example
So let's reveiw: There is always room for opinion. There may be only 2 opinion's to be had, but there is still room for opinion.
Neither Hax nor Marril have convinced me concretely either way so far, but I am still holding onto my original opinion (Oh, no! I have an opinion!*gasp*) in this matter.
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Marril said:
Judging by this criteria l-cancelling is a bug too, in fact nearly every move in this game is cancelled out by hitting the floor (aerial moves) other than stuff like GW's uair and Mario's dair because they were programmed to continue.
If l-cancelling isn't a bug in your opinion then that above posts really makes no sense at all, this is another statement I've made which you've failed to refute (and of course, I let it slide) because you know you've made repetitive statements which don't make sense yet rather than admitting you've contradicted yourself, you continue to ramble on as if nothing happened. Your arguing style isn't too fluid...
I'll prolly refute the rest of your posts later (kyfogre's posts are honestly jokes) if I have the time, arguments like these are sooo redundant. Wavedashing can't be considered subjective/objective imo because other than what *coders say, we have no way to prove this (and I'm basing my arguments off hackers on SWF, mind you).
*I'm honestly not acknowledging you as a coder after your theory on wavedashing; 'you're not actually jumping during a wavedash' pretty much sums up your knowledge of smash.
Additionally, it doesn't actually matter if SWFers are 'unintelligent' or not (apparently, anyone who disagrees with you [or should I say, the entire SWF board] should apply), they know what they're talking about when it comes to smash and however well they type, or however much they agree/disagree with you doesn't matter. You would get better arguments on SWF than you would from me, period.
LionheartEX
Active Member
THANK YOU TAG!
No one can stop another person from having an opinion really, and, in our opinion, WD is not a bug. As I said, get nintendo's word on it, then we'll probably believe you... if you want to win this argument, then you'll have to. I mean, just because youre a coder, it doesnt mean that you arent wrong about games sometimes.
No one can stop another person from having an opinion really, and, in our opinion, WD is not a bug. As I said, get nintendo's word on it, then we'll probably believe you... if you want to win this argument, then you'll have to
. I mean, just because youre a coder, it doesnt mean that you arent wrong about games sometimes.You're saying you're killing the board with your arguments...? So why continue?
Your opinion doesn't actually change anything, however. You're free to hold a wrong opinion, I'm just saying that not actively being told it's wrong doesn't make it right. You could be a member of the Flat Earth Society, but you wouldn't be any less of an idiot because of it. Same principle applies to thinking that wavedash isn't a bug.
Point me to where I didn't say the words, "in a way that the game isn't normally supposed to."
They make perfect sense. You're simply the one who's too dense to realize that L-cancelling is an intended feature, and wavedashing is a bug in the system. There's no contradiction. The only problems are inside your own narrow-minded head. Your youth doesn't excuse you.
I wouldn't call your posting "refuting" in any sense of the word. "Willfully ignorant flailing" is a more appropriate term.
Please tell me what the secret third option is. If something isn't subjective, and it isn't objective, then what is it?
Then post their actual arguments. I'm sure if they're really hackers, they're more knowledgeable than you about these things. ****, maybe one could even come up with an intelligent argument on the subject. Doubtful, but since you haven't, I'd quite like you to post their words verbatim.
I was under the impression you were representative of what SWF was like in terms of mentality. Given how I've been told I'd be "flamed out" of that board in seconds, do you honestly think I have any will or desire to post there?
if you want to win this argument, then you'll have to
This doesn't excuse you from having to prove your side. So, if it matters so much to the rampant bug-abusers that their bug isn't publically called one, they can dig up a source to back up their claims.
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