Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Ban Blaziken Ex: Save The Format

Status
Not open for further replies.
I didn't say I am not playing water decks anymore. I am just saying I am getting discouraged from doing so. :)

*runs off to check out Blastoise ex*
 
Blastoise ex won't come out until the next next set, right? That will take 6 to 8 months... I'm looking forward to trying ninetales, especially in water decks. Imagine you can take full advantage of high pressure system and ninetales covers all water decks' current weaknesses.

About blaziken ex... let it dominate for a few months until the next set is released.
 
6-8 months? What are you crazy? It will probably take 3-4 months for the next set to come out at the rate Nintendo is going. :)
 
Let's just ban it already!When the next set comes The broken Set or The Sealed Set comes out I think that's what there called comes out we let it come back.It bides us more time to think of more anti BlazeEX decks so when it does come back if it gets banned wee'l be ready.So lets bann it!
 
Water Pokemon Master said:
6-8 months? What are you crazy? It will probably take 3-4 months for the next set to come out at the rate Nintendo is going. :)

IIRC, there's another set that comes before the set that has blastoise ex.

Does anyone know how the Japanese players play blaziken ex? We really need a board to communicate and share ideas with the Japanese players.
 
I'm glad to see someone else feels the way I do about allowing a new set in the middle of a championship season. I wasn't crazy to feel that they shouldn't allow it into play until after Nationals!
Anyway, Water Pokemon Master and I were talking about water decks and he is interested in using Whiscash, along with a couple others.
Whiscash is a stage 1 with 90HP and a Pokebody Submerge that states: As long as Whiscash is on your Bench, prevent all damage done to Whiscash by opponent's attacks.
Pretty good, but it gets better. With Magintude you do 60 damage, which would be 120 to Blaziken EX, plus 10 damage to each benched pokemon, both your and your opponents. If you pair this Pokemon with a Zangoose and another big hitter I think it would help fend off a RAMBO deck. Use warp point, warp energy, switch, WHATEVER you can and build up Whishcash on the bench then switch him up to do a big hit on Blaze. If you have a Bufferpiece attatched he is less likely to get knocked out on the next turn, right?
I don't know but there has GOT to be a way around Blaze EX. Keep looking!
---Nicole
WeileMom
 
WeileMom said:
I'm glad to see someone else feels the way I do about allowing a new set in the middle of a championship season. I wasn't crazy to feel that they shouldn't allow it into play until after Nationals!
Anyway, Water Pokemon Master and I were talking about water decks and he is interested in using Whiscash, along with a couple others.
Whiscash is a stage 1 with 90HP and a Pokebody Submerge that states: As long as Whiscash is on your Bench, prevent all damage done to Whiscash by opponent's attacks.
Pretty good, but it gets better. With Magintude you do 60 damage, which would be 120 to Blaziken EX, plus 10 damage to each benched pokemon, both your and your opponents. If you pair this Pokemon with a Zangoose and another big hitter I think it would help fend off a RAMBO deck. Use warp point, warp energy, switch, WHATEVER you can and build up Whishcash on the bench then switch him up to do a big hit on Blaze. If you have a Bufferpiece attatched he is less likely to get knocked out on the next turn, right?
I don't know but there has GOT to be a way around Blaze EX. Keep looking!
---Nicole
WeileMom

Okay if that WOULD beat Blaziken Ex.... what else will it beat? Gardevoir will totally crush it and so will every other popular deck out there.
 
That's why I said
If you pair this Pokemon with a Zangoose and another big hitter I think it would help fend off a RAMBO deck.

It would help but it has to be paired with another good pokemon. I would suggest a Team Aqua line and using Team Aqua's Technical machine 01- you can then confuse, burn, paralyze or poison the Blaze or whatever else is out there. So, paralyze him, then he can't attack next turn. After his turn switch to Whiscash, who is powered up, deal 120 damage, switch back to something that can handle damage.
It can be done. I know you'll say- I'll just cure Blaze and attack anyway or switch him. Sure, but you may not have that card or a way to find it. There is still a lot left to chance in this game. Can someone post the decklist for a RAMBO deck? It would help to see all of the cards.
---Nicole
WeileMom
 
Last edited:
Wishcash is REALLY bad. Unless it started OHKOing Blaziken EX.

I think TA TM should not be allowed at States. Perhaps Nationals once the set is readily available.

Now to the real point of this post...Blastoise EX. Yes, a very nice nice card. Does it beat this deck? Debatably actually. We do not know yet. Again, Ampharos sets a huge problem down for Blastoise, and this deck only needs to shift its focus to a large Ampharos line in order to combat it ( And up the lightning energy count by a bit too ;) ) and suddenly Blastoise EX is no longer going to maim you. You know what else is harsh ? Run a 1-1 or 2-2 Aerodactyl EX line. Suddenly they cannot play Crystal Shard and your Rayquaza just maims them. Also, run Desert Shaman in place of a POR or two and u drop that to shuffle in shards or tech dittos stuck in their hand. It also works to beat Blastoise EX/Walrein decks that may come about too. They bounce all that energy but OOPS! Shuffle into deck! DANG! SO yeah, yes, Blastoise EX will be nice but I think Shaman with Ampharos somewhat ruins it, plus its consistancy is still unsure....where as we know Blaziken is strong.
 
Woah

I just played my first game against blaze ex. I played water, swampert. I thought I could hang. I got slaughtered. My 7 year old, who was playing the deck, stated "the card is rigged!" I tried a few more tests with different water contenders and he whailed on me. The card is the new version of neo sneasal. Now I love to play the counter. This may prove to be a really unbalanced format. And the thing is, without this card, the format is really diverse and a lot of decks can win. I am afraid with this card, it will be blaze and one or two other good counters. Wobby will most likely be in all the counters. Muk wobby might fair well. It really limits the playable cards in the format. That would be too bad for all. Ban it for the sake of diversity. There's my two cents.
 
WeileMom said:
I would suggest a Team Aqua line and using Team Aqua's Technical machine 01
That's a great idea for those who've won PreRelease tournaments, but the set doesn't actually get released until March 15, which only gives about 2 weeks for most people to actually get their hands on some of the cards before the earliest States.

:unknown-b
 
As an extra thought, not to crimp discussion:

Team Aqua's Manectric was re-checked for accuracy. It plays as it is written.

Telling someone to ban a card isn't as effective as *convincing* someone to ban a card. And convincing takes more than stating "It's broken", over and over. (There have been a lot of good comments - please don't assume I mean anyone in particular.)

To promote discussion, and for others to learn more about the rigorous testing that may have been applied, I'd suggest talking about the deck formulas you tested against. Did the new deck lose any of the matches, or was it always 100% wins? If it lost, how did it lose? Did it test against many of the new cards in the set?

That's the kind of stuff that makes these discussions interesting. Oh yes.
 
mtjimmer

Look at the facts. On this site in the tourney section you will see what decks won the city championships. The deck with the most wins is blazekin. It has the advantage of being able to attach directly from the discard to benched pokes w/o a flip. Plus with delcatty, one of the major draw engines in this format, you can discard energy and draw cards. Add juggler and TV reporter and there are 2 more ways to get nrg in the discard. You get a huge nrg advantage on the bench where you can wait and attack when your ready. At least the old typlosion power required a flip, and even then it still did well in a water dominant format. Then you add a 150 hp ex poke with a retreat cost of only 2 and it has 2 attacks with the second doing 100 to anyone for a measely 2 nrg discard. Plus there are cards to pass the nrg from the bench to the active and a gym that reduces my retreat which helps this deck. There is no other deck that has this much in it's favor. Again, not even close. Without the ex it was the best deck. Now, even with the type advantage I lose. This ex is a free gust of wind with 100 damage. Sic. Sure other cards let you double attach nrg but it is either at a cost (gardy and the new lanturn cost you damage to attach) or to the active (swampert/venasaur) which is a disadvantage because the active can be attacked! It not hard to see at all without testing and it only gets worse when you test. You mentioned new cards. My suicune ex/wobby/ swampert ex/swampert got flamed. My team aqua pokes got killed by the superior speed of blaze. Sure the aqua nrg and nifty supporters helped but they would have helped more if they were trainers, not supporters. I have not tried Muk EX. It may stay in the game. Still so far my blaze ex deck is undefeated. Perfect. All comers. It is not fun. Have I tested every combo? No, but the current archetypes and some of the more obvious ones with type advantage just get killed. Now I'm seeing red. What it means is to have a chance to win you will need to play the deck with the huge card advantage or you lose. So everyone plays blaze. How dull. Welcome to the blaze on format!
 
Last edited:
Mt Jimmer Has a ver good point. Bans are very rare, so any new bans will become the benchmark for future banning decisions. Therefore, the objective has to be to collect as much data as possibe before making the decision, which is the responsible thing to do. If you don't want Blaze EX ruling over all, start testing and keep detailed notes. Jimmer isn't dead set against banning, he just wants to know more. So far all we have is fervor. What we need is focus. Exactly how bad is this card? Does it suck the fun out of it? Those are the questions we need answered definitivey an precisely. Nothing I've seen so far quite fills the bucket.
 
I'll use a computer science term here (and I think you'll get it this time). Is that best-case, average-case, or worst-case scenario for REX (why?)? I've noticed that people advocating bans often use the best-case scenario and reduce the significance of prior game factors or ignore theme completely.

Also, as some of you have done, don't be afraid to suggest an alternate solution, then justify it.
 
I agree that something needs to be done about Blaze ex, probably and preferably a ban. I will be playing this deck as long as Blaze ex is not banned before states. (which is NOT going to happen) Please note that I LOVE rogue decks and the ONLY reason I would do such a thing is because the more tournaments this thing wins, the more likely it will get banned. All of you who agree with T-tar on the idea of banning Blaze ex, play it at states. When it wins 95% of tournaments, then it can be banned.
 
MTJimmer- I have tested the deck against the following decks... as well as random rogue decks which I do not consider to be top tier and not viable against most decks. Here are the toughest decks it paired with.

Ampharos ( Turbo, and not turbo ) Ampharos/Ampharos EX with Wobbuffets. Turbo version uses Delcatty and runs TV Reporter and Juggler as its draw engine, using Aquapolis Mareep and DR Flaaffy to retrieve the energy to get a wickedly quick Ampharos EX set up, often turn 2. This match up was a joke actually. It used to go a bit below 40% VS Blaziken but it won one game out of 11, with that game where Blaziken never got set up. It had a lone Torchic and drew into a skitty. It had only drawn one TV Reporter but it did not yield anything useful. Again, its only loss was on a bad hand where it would have lost to any deck. Illegitamate loss in terms of testing.

Gardevoir EX( With or Without Wailord )- 12-0 vs Gardevoir normally, 11-2 vs Gardevoir Wailord. Normal Gardevoir is just too early as your Rayquaza locks them down any they cannot ever really get rebuilt. Once one Gardy is KOed I would Blaz EX the Gardevoir ( Not EX ) and than even if they Rare Candy to a gardy EX ( all must be done in one turn or else no Gardevoir will ever live past a Ralts ) they have 1 energy on it max. Its such an easy deck to just get the early KO on their offense and never let them formulate a comeback. Adding Wailord made it more difficult, as I lost a few games with slower starts. If he managed multiple Wailords and Wobbuffets in play early on, and I struggled to get set up, I would come back but sometimes lose in the long run even though Blaziken STILL made it a really close game. Please note that this is against what is considered the 2nd best deck in the format AND one that has double type advantage against it AND Wailord added SIMPLY to counter it.

Blaziken Varients- AGainst Blaziken Varients, using either Ninetales, Exeggcutor, Rayquaza, or Ray and Amphy, the deck MUTILIATES them. Ninetales has issues ever getting set up. It takes 6 energy to OHKO a Blaziken EX, and that cannot be achieved in one turn, so Blaziken EX just snuffs it on the bench whenever its getting built. In this match up, the Blaziken kills benched Rayquazas or Ninetales that pose threats first,t han go about picking off Blazikens ( Firestarter ) or Delcatty if they are not set up yet. Killing Ampharos against BAR is huge too. I played this match up TOO much to remember an exact record but more than 90% of the time I won them handily without any opposition. In mirror match, against another Blaziken EX deck, its ENTIRELY on who gets Blaziken EX up first. I am not joking AT ALL. Not 90% chance of winning. You WIN if you get set up with a Blaziken EX. Its sick. Its really overpowering when ONE CARD takes what was mirror match and 50-50 and makes it near 100%. Thats a major arguement in banning if ONE CARD makes a deck mutilate the former best deck in the format.

Salamence- 4-1. I didnt test TOO much vs this, and lost a game when I got a bad start, but Crystal Shard answered his Salamence well enough, and if you manage to establish any form of set up you can end up winning by dropping a Rayquaza and powering it in a turn. Blaziken EX's huge HP help a TON in this too, and if you can deal with the initial Salamence makes it impossible for them to really recover again.

Aggron Wailord- Laughable at best, Wailord used to pose a major threat in this match up but Blaziken EX gives you the perfect attacker to prevent them from snagging any prizes. It also lets you snuff Furret EARLY and cut off their whole draw power. After that, you can KO Wailmers, or even Aggron before it gets built. The bench kill utterly mutiliates this match up. I was 5-0 here, and stopped testing vs it because the results were so conclusive.

Kingdra EX- 7-1. Again, the lost game was a slow start that never saw the deck really get running. Ampharos and Rayquaza cover Kingdra, and Blaziken EX simply locks the game down once you get rid of any existing Kingdras. This proves how dominant the card is, as its another example of how the card makes the win AUTOMATIC if it is in play and your opponent is stuck in a stage of rebuilding. If they do not have the 150 HP Kingdra EX in play, you just kill anything before it gets powered. Bad match up for Kingdra.

Kabutops EX- 4-0. People suggested using Kabutops. I doubted its usefulness so I tested it anyways. Kabutops is too flippy and Ampharos EX if used smart wins the game on its own. Blaziken EX does not really come into play all too much here except to establish the lock down that wins any game no matter the match up.

I faced many other decks but did not lose any of the other games. I would also like to point out that in hundreds of games I dont think it lost more than 10 overall, and every one of them were games when it did not get set up. If the deck gets set up and does not have a bad unplayable hand, it has yet to have a challenge really. ( Mirror match not counted in this statement for obvious reasons ) I hope this is helpful in some way, ask more questions if you have them. If you want me to explain a certain match up or point more, just ask, I would be glad to explain it more.
 
Psycodad- Muk EX is not good against it. I forgot to mention that in my match up report. I played MUK EX about 20 times. 19-1. Once Blaziken EX is up it wins. Think about it. You aim your entire game about getting energy on him. Say you get 5 energy on him. You deal 100 to the active Muk. two prizes to u. If they do not immediately replace it with another Muk they lose. They deal you 60. You deal them 100 after you attach. Thats taking u down to 2 prizes AND means they need a 3rd Muk. This is by turn 6. Now you just get him on ur bench and attach 2 more energy. So by turn 8 or 9 you KO the next muk. They are FORCED to keep a Muk active too, and it takes 3 hits to KO you. In other words, you simply need to live 9 turns in order to beat Muk EX now. Instead of it utterly destroying the deck, you simply need one card to beat it.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top