City's Is Over, On To States, What Are You Expecting?

[mrdraz07]

Charizard >>>>> Typhlosion.
He has resistance to Donphan, more HP, and a 1-energy attack.
Typlosion's accel sucks cuz u have to put damage counters on to use it, might as well just use MT Typhlo + Stark/playing smart for nrg accel.
Typhlosion Prime's attack sucks cuz it costs 3 and u have to discard 1. If u want to use Kindle so bad y don't u play Flareon MD, at least u can use DCE to power it up.
Plus the non-Prime is next to worthless without a Prime out. Unless u play against Jumpluff his 50 for 2 attack is just underwhelming.

 

[ryanvergel]

I actually think Donphan would yield better results vs a good Luxchomp. SP cards readily have ways to knock out Machamp with Uxie/Lucario. Donphan most definitely isn't going to be one shot and still has the same high damage potential with a memory berry/flail. Not to mention the whole Stage 1 vs Stage 2 deal. Gonna have to side with Donphan on this one.

wouldn't people change from using uxie/X+lucario to using water poke+lucario?

aka empoleon FB or quagsire GL? so now you use a water and colorless instead of a colorless colorless. but you also get the benefit of an SP pokemon and someone who isnt in turn psychic weak, etc.

i dont really think your line of reasoning works. if donphan were to take the place of champ, it would be just as easy to get up a counter pokemon attacking for OHKO (without a crobat either- like uxie X needs with machamp). plus you dont have to devote an unown G to it, so you can attack MUCH more effectively against donphan than machamp.

empoleon FB is also much easier to recover than an unown Gd Uxie X. you can aarons an empoleon FB back immediately and begin attacking, assuming you have prepared. with uxie X, it is a bit more difficult to get all the cards in play and operating (unown G normally, the X, meaning you need an uxie already benched a previous turn, and 2 energy as well) again.

vs machamp your attackers ALL need an extra energy! not the case with donphan, so even when machamp isnt on the field the THREAT of that machamp is still very relevant. the threat of a donphan is not the same.

basically, i completely disagree

 

[Box of Fail]

^I've been looking for a water SP tech for Donphan for awhile now... Empoleon deals 100 for 2 + gain and requires a Supporter. Quagsire deals 60 for 2 + gain. Belting Empoleon would result in an OHKO, but you'd need 3 energies, and Belt isn't searchable apart from DSG. Uxie X makes you need 1 Flash Bite to OHKO. With Empoleon you need 2.

 

[ryanvergel]

i have a 1/1 DGX in my luxchomp. im not a gambling man. i probably should have predicated that

hes so good! what are they going to do to it? extreme attack it with 3 energy to get 1-shotted by a garchomp? kk.



i think theres going to be quite a bit of DCE+X revival.

 

[Qwachansey]

Could I play 4 Kingdras and 1 Kingdra Prime or does Kingdra Prime count as a Kingdra? Thanks!

Edit: Also, could I Rare Candy a Horsea to a Kingdra Prime?

 

[prodigal_fanboy]

Could I play 4 Kingdras and 1 Kingdra Prime or does Kingdra Prime count as a Kingdra? Thanks!

Edit: Also, could I Rare Candy a Horsea to a Kingdra Prime?

As I understand it, 3-and-1, and yes you may candy, although they are to be in the set AFTER this.

 

[Qwachansey]

As I understand it, 3-and-1, and yes you may candy, although they are to be in the set AFTER this.

Kingdra was an example.

Thanks, that's too bad. Though I'm glad I can Candy them.

 

[konopacz]

Fix'd. Donphan is gonna be huge. And people are gonna be trying Feraligatr all sorts of different ways. Plus Charizard.

Maybe, but no way is it gonna be bigger then flygon.

 

[JokerBoi]

I am sorry but I fail to see how Donphan is going to be seriously game-breaking.

It has an amazing body. So does Ampharos PT, Manetric PT, Bronzong MD, Glaceon Lv. X, Luxray LA, and many other pokemon. Many of these pokemon were hyped because of their bodies and ended up failing when it came down to it either because their abilities were only good on paper or because Dialga G shuts them down completely. Donphan's body looks phenomenal on paper but gets shut down by Dialga G and appears that it wouldn't help that much in battles with decks such as Gengar (who tends to place counters) and anything SP which generally plays Dialga.

It only does one for 60! Then it can spread a potential 50 damage across your bench. With cards like crobat, garchomp GL, gengar, palkia, and honchcrow in the format... how can that be good? Continuously doing 10 damage to your bench may easily lead to a defeat. Fighting is also a common resistance, which means he 60 can easily be reduced to a mere 1 for 40 damage. One can easily see that his second attack is almost going to be unheard of as it requires 3 Fighting energies to hit for 90 as well as offers little versatility in the cards it can be played with.

It has a x2 :water: weakness and a 4x:colorless: retreat cost. Gyarados laughs in his face and SP decks can easily tech in a water pokemon to counter as they have done likewise with other pokemon. It's retreat cost is so high I almost thought it was resistant to :lightning: and :colorless:. It is pretty much stuck once active. That isn't cute.

Expert Belt might actually make this card scary. Game Breaking? I don't believe so. Even if paired with expert belt he most likely isn't going anywhere with that bagillion retreat cost giving your opponent a definite 2 prizes. But hey with Super Scoop Ups, Expert Belts, Warp Points, and some other cards he might actually end up being decent. I just really don't see it at this point.

 

[elekid_957]

^with manectric it covers the water weakness well. it autlosses to gyarados though, nothing you can do there.. 80 for 1 and no backfire (with manectric) is still pretty good, or instead of manectric you could use queen and have a 140 HP tank reducing 20 and healing 20

 

[Box of Fail]

I think JokerBoi hit the nail on the head. Donphan is NOT going be that great, save the occasional donk.

 

[butlerforhire]

Donphan definitely has great early-game power, being able to instantly evolve via BTS and KO Spiritomb plus a lot of other Basics, including many SPs, with Expert Belt attached. That kind of instant carnage puts pressure on the opponent immediately and can lead to the end of a game before it really gets started, and everyone who has ever played with or against an aggressive turn 1/turn 2 deck already knows that. The Body is also best early game, when the damage being dealt to it typically isn't at the height it will reach as a game progresses, allowing the reduction to actually matter.

However, that 4 retreat cost and double water weakness combined with the generic nature of its primary attack (no one is going to be using Heavy Impact, although even if they did, that attack is generic too) and relatively low max damage output with said attack means it won't have a great end game, and that is a distinct disadvantage to have in this format. It has to run SSU and maybe Blissey or Nidoqueen, and Warp Point is going to be needed as well, but those cards still don't give Donphan the edge that other real beat-down decks like Gyarados, Beedrill, Charizard, Jumpluff, and Kingdra have/should have, and it lacks the control of Gengar, SP, Gardevoir, and Flygon. It's ultimately bland.

Also, since its Body doesn't specify that the damage it reduces has to come from the opponent, Earthquake actually doesn't provide any recoil damage to other Donphan Prime, which is admittedly nice.

 

[Lumpy]

i've tried to play and play against donphan decks(testing) and i think that donphan speed sucks. It is dead if your opponent plays a water deck or draws the game out a little. I als think that donphan/flygon is not that great. You have to set up nidoqueen, donphan flygon, claydol and maybe more techs, so i agree that donphan may not be that great. I bet GG is gonna be great. GG, some SP variants and gengar.

 

[mrdraz07]

Tsk tsk. Figures Pokegym would totally hose one of the best cards in the set. "It's so bland..."
lol.
Healing Donphan, and/or Donphan Flygon, is probably the best way to go. Going for the donk is nice but in the end his body is what makes him so annoying.
U guys must have not read Phanpy, or realized how much better it makes Donphan.

 

[Naki Feralkin]

^ They did it with Flygon too, look how all the naysayers ended up playing it in the end or said it was bad to throw everyone off then play it at another event. While I agree that the gym is normally right on most hype being bad, it doesn't always go that way.

Play test it yourself, don't base your opinion on what other people think.

You have to set up nidoqueen, donphan flygon, claydol and maybe more techs, so i agree that donphan may not be that great.

This is a skewed statement. If this were a true element, then why is Machamp so good? Flychamp does pretty much everything you mention above. Setting up Nidoqueen, Machamps, Flygon, Claydol, and so forth, and I've seen it do exceptional in this area, beating some solid SP lists. I agree with some of the above talking about Quaggy/Empoleon being viable techs, since they are quite good attackers for an SP deck. I think the fact thats being missed here isn't that its attack is vanilla, its that this attacker is a Stage 1 instead of a Stage 2, which saves the trouble of wasting candies on it, in addition to having an above average body (Dialga G is solid, but can it really hold its own in this format? Last few cities and GA Marathon seems to say no.) to assist in the tanking process. Issues caused with Gengar can be significantly reduced by having this early attacker to slow down the Gengar lock and get a few extra prizes. Can Machamp say the same? I don't think so. I mean, I don't think I've lost a match using Cursegar to Machamp/Flygon yet. I could be hallucinating though, and considering Cursegar's a pretty solid variant for events to come, thats not something to just scoff at.

Funny that JokerBoi mentioned Manectric being a less than exemplary tech when he's likely to become a star in a format where heavy snipe becomes relevant. (Garchomp C? Relicanth? Even the potential of Entei/Raikou coming out soon..)

 

[Hatter™]

It's more fun that way though. :]
I've found the worst matchup for pluff so far to be Shuppet.

 

[Cetra]

First off, someone commented earlier how you can't recycle DCE, but if you think about it, that's 4 80 snipes...if I were playing, I'd pry be able to whack 4 things off my opponents bench for 4 easy prizes. I don't really see a need to recycle DCE to take 2 more prizes...

But on topic for ME.
I'm going for GIGAS still.

The only REAL con that I can't find an easy way around right now is weakness to fighting, but if it comes down to it I'll just tech Exploud.

The pros on the other side:
-Consistent, all game power lock can kill most everything in the format
-190 max hp while healing 8- each turn is beast
-80-120 a turn isn't bad especially if you're using your snipe damage intelligently
-Downer Lock + Power Lock stomps SP
-Weakness against Flygon/Chomp C/Salamence
-New Cards like Pokemon Collector, Communicator and Reversal make set up and disruption fun and simple
-Techs like Regice can serve as both power techs (for sp) or attacking techs (for Donphan, etc)

Just saying, I did well with it before, and I only see it getting better with HGSS so why not keep it going til the end?

 

[prodigal_fanboy]

Phanpy SW > Phanpy HGSS.

 

[konopacz]

First off, someone commented earlier how you can't recycle DCE, but if you think about it, that's 4 80 snipes...if I were playing, I'd pry be able to whack 4 things off my opponents bench for 4 easy prizes. I don't really see a need to recycle DCE to take 2 more prizes...

But on topic for ME.
I'm going for GIGAS still.

The only REAL con that I can't find an easy way around right now is weakness to fighting, but if it comes down to it I'll just tech Exploud.

The pros on the other side:
-Consistent, all game power lock can kill most everything in the format
-190 max hp while healing 8- each turn is beast
-80-120 a turn isn't bad especially if you're using your snipe damage intelligently
-Downer Lock + Power Lock stomps SP
-Weakness against Flygon/Chomp C/Salamence
-New Cards like Pokemon Collector, Communicator and Reversal make set up and disruption fun and simple
-Techs like Regice can serve as both power techs (for sp) or attacking techs (for Donphan, etc)

Just saying, I did well with it before, and I only see it getting better with HGSS so why not keep it going til the end?

I love gigas, it brought me AWESOME sucsess last season and I really know how to play that deck.

BUT

Flychamp is really popular, which is a terrible matchup for that deck.

Donphan might not be BDIF, but it will see play, and that will be extremely tough.

Power spry kills you. Totally kills you.

 

[Cetra]

I love gigas, it brought me AWESOME sucsess last season and I really know how to play that deck.

BUT

Flychamp is really popular, which is a terrible matchup for that deck.

Donphan might not be BDIF, but it will see play, and that will be extremely tough.

Power spry kills you. Totally kills you.

I've beaten every SP player I've come up against with my build save 1. Power Spray CAN be brutal, but there are way's around it that make it less of a threat for me now.

Everyone I know is trading out their Champs for Phans...

which doesn't really matter because I'm fine losing to something I don't like anyways.

However, I feel confident enough with the deck to do well with it and I have a couple months to figure it all out.