Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Heatran LvX and Moltres

And? You'll still have the set one.

I purposely went after Heatran lv.X at the PR I went to, even though I knew in 2 weeks the tins were going on sale. I love the card and I can have 1 of each kind.
 
I actually think Moltres is one of the lesser cards you could combo with Heatran lv. X for a few reasons:

1.) It is double weak to water, meaning Kingdra among many other cards can get an easy OHKO on it. This is obviously bad.
2.) It is a Basic and thus prone to getting wrecked by Machamp and/or shut down by Mewtwo lv. X.
3.) Its only attack costs 3 energy. Virtually all of the other cards you could pair Heatran lv. X with-- most of which Prime listed-- can attack for fewer energy and also have more options. While the flippy Power may sometimes help offset the expensive nature of the attack, it is not something I'd want to rely on. In this format with fast and economic stage 2s, particularly Kingdra and Gengar, Moltres is actually rather slow and costly.
4.) It can't OHKO much of anything consistently (without damage-enhancers I mean, which quickly run out especially when you're having to lay down 2 PlusPower and a Buck's/3 PlusPower to do the magic 130). Yes, 100 for 3 from a Basic is great, but if it isn't getting a OHKO, it almost may as well just be doing 60 or 70 because it's really the same difference (taking two turns to knock the average big Pokemon out, I mean) and with 100 HP it won't be around long. It's too bad Moltres has no way to inflict Burn... Anyway, MD Infernape and Magmortar can both get OHKOs and deal unlimited damage, the former easier than the latter, and both also have more options at their disposal than Moltres. Magmortar and its lv. X in particular seem made to combo with Heatran lv. X (or perhaps it should be said the other way around since Heatran lv. X came after them) since you can get the benefit of its Body as well as its Power.

After the Blaziken in Galactic's Conquest comes out, I think a deck running 4/2/2/2 Blaziken with Heatran lv. X could be potent. The Galactic's Conquest Blaziken can get OHKOs on 130 HP stuff (100 from attack plus guaranteed 30 from its Burning Power and the lv. X's Body) while the GE one can snipe stuff like Claydol.
 
Right now I'm going to build Heatran with Infernape MD because of the ability to do 80 for FF, with a possible 120 for just 1 discard. Team it up with Plus Power or even better, Buck's Training, and you got the OHKO on most Pokemon.

I agree on the Moltres thing, 100%. I just didn't want to start with it and not be able to do anything for 3 turns. The Power on it is really nice, but if you aren't discarding energy thanks to heatran, what's the use?

Magmortar does look cool and all, but people need to remember that it can't use it's snipe for 100 attack every turn because of the clause on it. I find it's damage per energy ratio to be a lot lower than Infernape's too, now that Infernape doesn't have to discard 2 of those energies.

It would be kind of messed up if Heatran's Powers stacked. Having two Heatan lv.X in play, Infernape could do 160 a turn without discarding energy.
 
Heatran LV.X - The ultimate Tech like Claydol is the ultimate for Draw Power.

I personnaly find Dash SF the best combo since it makes use of both aspects that Heatran LV.X provides.
Downside to Dash is it's horrible HP that can only be bumped to a mere 90 with Unown E.
Dispite that, it can be VERY fast and Snipe T2!
 
Magmortar lv. X can't Flame Buster twice in a row under most circumstances, but with the retrieval from Heatran lv. X it can be doing big damage to the active next turn, getting a KO virtually guaranteed (with the aid of the auto-tails hit-for-30 Burn wracking up 60 between a full turn cycle). With Warp Point and something like Chatot on the bench it actually could break the Flame Buster clause and do it twice. I figure most people playing Heatran lv. X are going to be packing 4 Warp Points and perhaps even a Switch or two because they are not going to want it to remain active after leveling up and its retreat is all but unpayable, so that situation might actually happen once or twice in a game.

Based on the lack of an explicit stipulation on Heat Wave (watch out for a Domino's law suit Heatran!!!!!11111!!!), I don't see why it wouldn't be stackable.

afstandopleren said:
Heatran LV.X - The ultimate Tech like Claydol is the ultimate for Draw Power.

I personnaly find Dash SF the best combo since it makes use of both aspects that Heatran LV.X provides.
Downside to Dash is it's horrible HP that can only be bumped to a mere 90 with Unown E.
Dispite that, it can be VERY fast and Snipe T2!
Click to expand...

I like Rapidash as well, although I wish it didn't get OHKOed by Kingdra (and a number of other cards) and that Shooting Fire did 70 instead of 60 so that more 2HKOs could be achieved. If it did 70 then with Crobat G in Galactic's Conquest it could take down a Claydol in one turn as well. Its speed, free retreat, sniping ability and Body all are nice though.
 
While Heatran lv X does combo nicely with tons of things, it still won't be a big archtype as long as Kingdras still around. All the fire things that combo with it still get destroyed by a fast Kingdra.
 
Chuck, your totally right. Kingdra was popular at Battle Roads and will probably be just as popular if not more popular at Cities. Even Empoleon is a major threat.

bulterforhire, yeah, decks are going to need to run warp point when running heatran, but I think the magnezone variants and get away with fewer thanks to Magnezone DP's poke-body.
 
I think Heatran lv. X will be pretty big in spite of Kingdra because from what I can see, that is really the only card/deck that truly would pose a problem for it (although Gengar seems like it would be a difficult match-up as well). Without Scramble I think Empoleon is too slow to deal with OHKOs even if it does have the type advantage, and there aren't really any other big water Pokemon out there aside from Froslass, which can't deal big enough damage and can't withstand taking big damage either, or perhaps Feraligatr, although it is slow and dependent on a lot of support which Magmortar lv. X/Blaziken can easily take out.

There aren't many other decks either existing or hyped/inevitable (such as Tyranitar or Machamp) that can take consistent OHKOs. There are also a number of viable grass decks (Scizor, Sceptile variants, Leafeon lv. X variants) as well as Magnezone variants that Big Fire should pose a huge threat to for obvious reasons.
 
I forgot about Feraligatr. People are definitely going to try it with the new Bronzong, even thought it was equally viable before it.

Infernape lv.X not having 2x water weakness FTW...I guess.
 
kingdra, double weakness, gg

unfortunatly fire aint in a possition to make it in a tourney simply because kingdra is running rampant. tho tbh i would be more inclined to use the new blaze, and or two of the GE ones. auto burn works in conjunction with heatrans body, and 100 a turn is of no penatlies. also the older blaze allows you to snipe for 80 without taking the discard penalty. overall i'd say that was better than moltres.
 
afstandopleren said:
*Gets Heatran LV.X in play fast.*

And, what ur gonna do now with insta damage!
Click to expand...

uhh... retreat? you think instant 2 damage is good? why not just play crobat then? instant 2 damage counters and its alot easier to get out, and it doesn't get pooped on as badly against kingdra. just cause its thrown on a shiny lvx you think its good? it 2 damage counters ... its nothing, especially when you can ... wait for it ... retreat :eek:

i know retreating is like sooooo hard to pull off with kingra, like especially when you're setting up your heatran uber fast. luckily i got 4 rare candy and a 1 energy attack to fall back on. i might be able to get a 1 energy stage 2 going by the time you get a lvx with 3 retreat and a stage 1 with 2 energy on it out. you never know tho, if i get lucky i'll get that... other than that those 2 damage counters are game for sure.

man thats so broken i cant believe it, auto burn :eek:, errata it quickly its almost as good as crobat, and crobat is played in ... no decks so heatran will blates be the play cause its nearly as good.

sorry, your auto burn just aint cuttin it
 
lolganium said:
uhh... retreat? you think instant 2 damage is good? why not just play crobat then? instant 2 damage counters and its alot easier to get out, and it doesn't get pooped on as badly against kingdra. just cause its thrown on a shiny lvx you think its good? it 2 damage counters ... its nothing, especially when you can ... wait for it ... retreat :eek:

i know retreating is like sooooo hard to pull off with kingra, like especially when you're setting up your heatran uber fast. luckily i got 4 rare candy and a 1 energy attack to fall back on. i might be able to get a 1 energy stage 2 going by the time you get a lvx with 3 retreat and a stage 1 with 2 energy on it out. you never know tho, if i get lucky i'll get that... other than that those 2 damage counters are game for sure.

man thats so broken i cant believe it, auto burn :eek:, errata it quickly its almost as good as crobat, and crobat is played in ... no decks so heatran will blates be the play cause its nearly as good.

sorry, your auto burn just aint cuttin it
Click to expand...

You're neglecting inbetween turns. 20*2=40 damage, not 20. Puts you closer to getting KOs :/ Sure, a Rapidash alone isn't the end of Kingdra. What does make Kingdra sweat is a Rapidash Snipe folloed by Magmortar spread. Kingdra can't even OHKO Magmortar, and bench spreading to Magmortar is moot due to its body.

Just for fun... A rapidash does 60 to any benched pokemon, right? Magmortar does 40 to the active + 20 to two benched pokemon, right? If you can get off a rapidash followed by Magmortar, you for sure KO Claydol. You deal probably around 80 damage to Kingdra, and you place 20 on something else. Magmortar won't be OHKOed by Dragon Pump, so you can then do another 40 + 20 + 20 to something else (so given the retreat notion, you've probably set 100 damage on a kingdra in two turns, probably 20 or 60 on whatever came active, and KOed a claydol. For a deck that is plenty acceleratable with Stark Mountain. Doesn't sound like an autoloss at all if you're trading damage like that, though I do concede that unless you can get Magmortar out ASAP, you'll have problems)
 
lolganium said:
uhh... retreat? you think instant 2 damage is good? why not just play crobat then? instant 2 damage counters and its alot easier to get out, and it doesn't get pooped on as badly against kingdra. just cause its thrown on a shiny lvx you think its good? it 2 damage counters ... its nothing, especially when you can ... wait for it ... retreat :eek:

i know retreating is like sooooo hard to pull off with kingra, like especially when you're setting up your heatran uber fast. luckily i got 4 rare candy and a 1 energy attack to fall back on. i might be able to get a 1 energy stage 2 going by the time you get a lvx with 3 retreat and a stage 1 with 2 energy on it out. you never know tho, if i get lucky i'll get that... other than that those 2 damage counters are game for sure.

man thats so broken i cant believe it, auto burn :eek:, errata it quickly its almost as good as crobat, and crobat is played in ... no decks so heatran will blates be the play cause its nearly as good.

sorry, your auto burn just aint cuttin it
Click to expand...


Im not in favor to any 1 person on this
but that burn can get a little annoying.

If they had Heatran (lv.x) out when you
attacked that pony, then your forced to
take 20 going to there turn, take a hit,
and 20 more coming back. It might not
be to much, but 40+x can hurt.

I do realize they had to take a ko for this
to happen, but the way I see it. There pony
was active because they brought it active
and just hit somethin for 60 or 70 givin a
plus power and hit active.
Now pokeblower/ warp point may have been
used to make it active but odds are they just
hit with it. So 60 to whatever, Then you OHKO
it, take 20+x+20... Depending on what that X
damage is. Kingdra is knocked out, or badly hurt.

Odds are is that, that match is not favorable to the
Heatran player, but the amount of damage it passes
onto another player will be annoying...
 
Rai said:
You're neglecting inbetween turns. 20*2=40 damage, not 20. Puts you closer to getting KOs :/ Sure, a Rapidash alone isn't the end of Kingdra. What does make Kingdra sweat is a Rapidash Snipe folloed by Magmortar spread. Kingdra can't even OHKO Magmortar, and bench spreading to Magmortar is moot due to its body.

Just for fun... A rapidash does 60 to any benched pokemon, right? Magmortar does 40 to the active + 20 to two benched pokemon, right? If you can get off a rapidash followed by Magmortar, you for sure KO Claydol. You deal probably around 80 damage to Kingdra, and you place 20 on something else. Magmortar won't be OHKOed by Dragon Pump, so you can then do another 40 + 20 + 20 to something else (so given the retreat notion, you've probably set 100 damage on a kingdra in two turns, probably 20 or 60 on whatever came active, and KOed a claydol. For a deck that is plenty acceleratable with Stark Mountain. Doesn't sound like an autoloss at all if you're trading damage like that, though I do concede that unless you can get Magmortar out ASAP, you'll have problems)
Click to expand...

who said anything about mortar? dunno about you, but i'm talking about heatran rapidash here. but if we're throwing random other attackers into the mix, then i'll just empoleon lvx you and snipe you :tongue:

okay, so you wanna run magmortar heatran and rapidash in the same deck? is that gonna be called conviluted.dec ? cause i think magmortar/heatran alone is very chunky, let alone throwing in rapidash. but yeah good luck aswell surviving when GC comes out and you got level max ... the format wont have changed by that point and clunky decks will be the play. no

mag/heat/dash/dol = TOO CLUNKY

especially since regi move will quite ewasily put me in the position of koing a magmortar, though if it levels up, then its buck dragon pump ... eassy money
 
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