Pokémon TCG: Sword and Shield—Brilliant Stars

Official Ban Gardevoir for Worlds 2008 Discussion

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Sorry if I come as blunt on this, but we know that the format change will get rid of a lot of GG issues (no DRE or scramble slows it a bit, and there will be a pool of new cards, so I dontr expect a lot of GG activity on the next rotation), and we know PUI will not errata or ban a card with less than a month to worlds, unless it was mistranslated, which it is not,, so honestly, what is the point of the thread? complain that the card is perhaps overpowered? My point is, do you really think that a thread on the Gym will really make PUI ban a card?

On the other side, I might very well be mistaken, but each year there is this overpowered card everyone complains about, wins everything for a while, call it Blastoise EX, call it Blaziken EX, call it whatever you want, but each year that decks falls short of winning worlds, and please, refrain from explaining me how much overpowered it is compared to possible matches, I have read since 2004 the same threads for the dominant deck of the moment, and they didnt came up on top, this year GG was very dominant, and maybe it will win worlds, but I seriously consider threads like this a tad exagerated, and the word "official" makes it a little bothersome to it; are you seriously asking for the ban? then at least post it on the OFFICIAL forums of PUI, I am sure all the mods here would agree with that.
 
mca3 said:
Colin has a Point! But Banning would Really bring some fussing form A LOT of players.
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uhhhh you realize that lots of people that have played PLOX are saying to ban the card, right?

and another reason to ban the card . . . do you really want THREE PLOX decks for your WOrld Championship reprint decks this year? :tongue: or i guess they can go down to 140th place to get that other deck . . .
 
lol, no but it would NOT surprise me! I still think it is a Childish way to look at it! Didnt people say the same thing about otehr decks, I am just Curious! Besides Slowking and Sneasel from Neos
 
I don't care who is backing it. 1st 2nd 3rd or 4th at Nats, I could really care less. These people are good players, and have done well, but that doesn't make their opinion worth more than anyone else's. The Pokemon community is screaming bloody murder right now! Ban Gardevoir for Wor;lds? Well...

It would be fair to the Worlds players. This is true. Would other stuff take over? Yeah, but then it would be four or five different decks. Not, you know, ONE.

It would not be fair to other plays though, everyone who has had to suffer GG the whole season. I don't think the card should be banned for this reason. It would be like a slap in the face to others that have been calling for it to be banned all year to no effect.
 
IvesRountree said:
Sorry if I come as blunt on this, but we know that the format change will get rid of a lot of GG issues (no DRE or scramble slows it a bit, and there will be a pool of new cards, so I dontr expect a lot of GG activity on the next rotation), and we know PUI will not errata or ban a card with less than a month to worlds, unless it was mistranslated, which it is not,, so honestly, what is the point of the thread? complain that the card is perhaps overpowered? My point is, do you really think that a thread on the Gym will really make PUI ban a card?

On the other side, I might very well be mistaken, but each year there is this overpowered card everyone complains about, wins everything for a while, call it Blastoise EX, call it Blaziken EX, call it whatever you want, but each year that decks falls short of winning worlds, and please, refrain from explaining me how much overpowered it is compared to possible matches, I have read since 2004 the same threads for the dominant deck of the moment, and they didnt came up on top, this year GG was very dominant, and maybe it will win worlds, but I seriously consider threads like this a tad exagerated, and the word "official" makes it a little bothersome to it; are you seriously asking for the ban? then at least post it on the OFFICIAL forums of PUI, I am sure all the mods here would agree with that.
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It's called a discussion. I have a right to petition a ban for it. No, I do not think they will ban it. I never think they will seriously do anything I say. That's unrealistic. I never said they would do it, either.

Yes, that is true about Blastoise ex, Blaziken ex, and yes it also true they were not as dominant as GG. I don't think this is exaggerating at all. Look at all the good players complaining!

It's going to be offiical when I send it into PUI, too. You're not a mod, stop trying to do their job. I don't see anyone else complaining about the title. If they want to change it, they will.
 
The Dusknoir just eliminates all hope for any other counters, i mean. Its already bad enough that your Psylocked, but you can't even drop a basic to suicide. If you do that, your wasting energy for the retreat and opens yourself to warp point. I've played GG in one tourney this year (I dont count Absol/Gallade as GG) during regionals and I did not enjoy it one bit. Why did I play it? I wanted to win, but doesn't magmortar beat gardy back then? No not with Dusknoir.

I support Mr Chad.
 
Scizor said:
It's called a discussion. I have a right to petition a ban for it. No, I do not think they will ban it. I never think they will seriously do anything I say. That's unrealistic. I never said they would do it, either.

Yes, that is true about Blastoise ex, Blaziken ex, and yes it also true they were not as dominant as GG. I don't think this is exaggerating at all. Look at all the good players complaining!

It's going to be offiical when I send it into PUI, too. You're not a mod, stop trying to do their job. I don't see anyone else complaining about the title. If they want to change it, they will.
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so LBS wasnt as dominant? Niniken wasnt as dominant? I guess I must have been alucinating :p

Me doing a Mod job? fat chance, I also am entitled to an opinion and stated that most mods would support, and it was intended to mean that I am not saying that the gym is not an important forum, just that the official one it is not, sad you didnt saw it this way, maybe I will need to expalin it more next time.

Good luck getting the card banned. (nope, thisis not sarcasm, though I do consider it is a waste of time)

And I complained about the title because I find it bothersome to me, and even if noone else complains about it, I am entitled to say I dont like it, and then you are entitled to not caring about my opinion, which is entirely your right.
 
swanton1717 said:
During the discussion about Wormadam, it was brought up that banning it was 'viable' because the Prof Cup was a small, one-time event. Isn't Worlds going to be of similar size or smaller than the Professor Cup? I mean POP has a list of basically ALL the participants, and contacting them wouldn't be much of a hastle. Its not like players will arrive with their Gardevoir decks if an Official Ban would be made with a good amount of notice. I think banning Gardevoir or making some restriction just for Worlds sounds reasonable.

~Colin
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I disagree completely. There is a difference between dropping a message on the official USA website telling all professors that Wormadam will be banned, and having to contact 25+ different countries to tell them that Gardevior is banned.

Not only that, but the two tournaments are totally different. Just because they are both held once a year, and might have similar attendance numbers doesn't mean they are similar. The Professor Cup is more like a Pre-Release, as we get free packs every round and a free gift in the beginning, and we have fun formats to play with. Worlds...well, it's the biggest gathering of the best players in the world (notice the word world, not trying to say this is bigger than Nats, because I know it isn't), and a chance to see who is the best. Not only would it take FOREVER to contact people from 27 countries, but it wouldn't be fair to the players if they banned Gardevior.

Let me explain why it wouldn't be fair. How many of the players that will be playing in Worlds used Gardevior to win some of their games? Without Gardevior, they might not have won as many games. Without Gardevior, Gino L. might not had won Nationals (no disrespect). These people were able to abuse Gardevior to beat people and take away their chance to get to Worlds. How fair would it be to ban it later on, after the damage is already done? "Oh, you've already made it to Worlds, you don't have to worry about donkage, or stalling, that every other player has had to live with the entire format." It wouldn't be fair at all.

We all hate the deck, but it wins, and most likely will be many of the people you listed in your original post's choice for Worlds. That is just how the cookie crumbles. Nothing is going to change. It is good to voice your opinion, but this far into the season, nothing is going to change.

Good luck at Worlds.
 
IvesRountree said:
so LBS wasnt as dominant? Niniken wasnt as dominant? I guess I must have been alucinating :p
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THey definately weren't as dominate as GG is now. first of all, none of those decks have ever topcutted/won EVERY SINGLE EVENT since its release more times than GG has. GG has won Cities, States, Regionals, and NATS. Blaze and Storm!06 (or as you people call it, "LBS") have failed to cinch every single one of these titles.
 
I'll be playing in Worlds this year and everything Chad had to say is 100% correct. Gardy's nearly impossible to beat during Swiss, having the most disruptive power of any deck we've seen for years (Dark Palm+Psychic Lock+Team Galactic's Wager), and has the ability to push anything it wants out of the opponent's Active spot either weakened (Sonic Blade) or dead (Psychic Cut). Bring Down and Hard Feelings seal up the last few minutes of the match, while Gardevoir and Gallade lock up the early game. It has, literally, a iron grip on the clock that I don't believe anything can reliably break. Any of the three proposals Chad stated for fixing the problem would be fantastic answers to the horribly controlling nature of Gardevoir. Dusknoir is a huge part of the problem, as it doesn't even have to be in play for me to immediately limit my bench to three upon the first turn of the game. Gallade solves the problems that Gardy has (being able to have basics sacrificed to it and things bigger than 2 Psychic Locks can handle).
 
If you are complaining about Gardeviour and how broken it is why don't you play it?
I know it may sound like noobish but if the only thing that can beat gardeviour is a mirror match why not do that. However if gardeviour is played by every player Worlds, will be boring. Or you could just make an anti gardeviour list and defeat everyone.
 
I've played the deck before. And unfortunately, last I checked, a mirror with equal lists/players = a 50/50, aka not a winning matchup! Also, not EVERYONE plays it, so if you run a counter deck and face something other than GG or get a bad hand a few games, you're done.
 
For those who said other decks were as dominant as Gardy:

04 - Blaze was pretty dang dominant for a while. But it didn't even t2 in Nats, and didn't win Worlds.

05 - No deck really stood above the rest.

06 - LBS didn't top 4 Nats or top 8 Worlds.

07 - Metanite didn't even t32 Nats AFAIK, and had a poor showing at Worlds. Also, there were several different decks one could use to win throughout the year.

08 - Gardy/Gallade rolls through CCs, States, Regionals, and claims 3 of the top 4 spots at Nationals. Nearly half of the field was using this deck.

In the Nintendo era, NOTHING has even come close to the dominance of Gardy/Gallade.
 
LBS WASN'T as dominant. Niniken wasn't even a top deck really ever, so that doesn't have merit. BAR was the dominant deck back then, and even that wasn't even close to the dominance of GG these days. Did LBS or Blaziken win US Nats, the 2nd (questionable) biggest tournament during their years? No. If I recall, Delta won the year LBS was dominant and Gardevoir won the year Blaziken was dominant.

Let's take a look at dominant decks in the POP era (when I say dominant, I mean during the regular season, from Cities, States, and Regionals, obviously the top deck will change, but this is general):

03-04: Blaziken was the dominant deck. Gardevoir won Nats and Magma won Worlds

04-05: Many good decks, Rock Lock was probably the most dominant deck out of all of them though. Medicham won Nats and Nidoqueen won Worlds

05-06: LBS was the dominant deck. Delta won Nats and Mewtric won Worlds.

06-07: No real dominant deck, I guess Metanite would be considered the most popular, possibly with Speed Spread up there, but that never really caught on. Speed Spread won Nats and Worlds.

07-08: GG has been the dominant deck since CITIES. Nothing has come close to its dominance all year. It won Nats, what will win Worlds?


There's a breakdown of the past 5 seasons for you. I'm sure that says something about the dominance of GG.


edit: lol mondak beat me to it
 
ok, no offense, Prime, but I, also, "disagree completely."

Prime said:
I disagree completely. There is a difference between dropping a message on the official USA website telling all professors that Wormadam will be banned, and having to contact 25+ different countries to tell them that Gardevior is banned.

Not only that, but the two tournaments are totally different. Just because they are both held once a year, and might have similar attendance numbers doesn't mean they are similar. The Professor Cup is more like a Pre-Release, as we get free packs every round and a free gift in the beginning, and we have fun formats to play with. Worlds...well, it's the biggest gathering of the best players in the world (notice the word world, not trying to say this is bigger than Nats, because I know it isn't), and a chance to see who is the best. Not only would it take FOREVER to contact people from 27 countries, but it wouldn't be fair to the players if they banned Gardevior.

Because, you know, email takes SOOOOOOO LONG. No one EVER checks their countries forums/website. No one wouldn't hear it from other players. =/

Let me explain why it wouldn't be fair. How many of the players that will be playing in Worlds used Gardevior to win some of their games? Without Gardevior, they might not have won as many games. Without Gardevior, Gino L. might not had won Nationals (no disrespect). These people were able to abuse Gardevior to beat people and take away their chance to get to Worlds. How fair would it be to ban it later on, after the damage is already done? "Oh, you've already made it to Worlds, you don't have to worry about donkage, or stalling, that every other player has had to live with the entire format." It wouldn't be fair at all.

So you're saying that you want some d0nk or some staller to win Worlds? I mean, I understand what you're saying. I might be a little bit upset that the format changes for Worlds if I wasn't in it, but think about it a little bit more. Do you really want an event where there is absolutely NO creativity whatsoever farther than that one tech card in GG? I know that creativity doesn't win games, but there should at least be more than one dominant deck this format. 04 there was gardy to match blaze. 05 there was rock lock, medicham, and ludi. 06 there was Storm!06, Pow! Block, Nidoqueen, Lunasol (ewwww . . .), Mewtric, Delta, and other decks. I don't even need to explain last year. In addition, i believe the format changed for Worlds '02 from Rocket-on to Neo-on.

We all hate the deck, but it wins, and most likely will be many of the people you listed in your original post's choice for Worlds. That is just how the cookie crumbles. Nothing is going to change. It is good to voice your opinion, but this far into the season, nothing is going to change.

you would think a few sets would get rid of such a dominant deck. because, of course, the point of the game is to make money, no? so why in the world would PCL make a few cards that are so broken that no players would ever need to buy another set of cards? obviously, something went a little askew in testing. either our format is suppossed to include a wider variety of cards or PCL just really screwed it up somewhere. Or they just don't care about money, but for some reason, I just don't think that's it. :tongue:

Good luck at Worlds.

I want to give a shout out to Matticus Chinnith. Good luck at the GRINDER, buddy!
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GG is the most dominant deck to be played.period. People say play it,its not fun to play at all,I know people wanna win,but they at least want to have fun playing the game they want to win,thats why people play it,to have fun and to win. Gardevior is broke,no doubt about it,but it aint much we can do about it.

All we can do,is just play the deck we want to play,hope we do well with it and wait for the next format. If GG wins worlds then it will be a big dissapointment.
 
I agree 110% on some sort of restriction, like 4 max between gardy and Gallade, or banning DRE with the 2 or something. But for crying out loud, LIMIT IT!
 
Kenshin's Garde said:
Because, you know, email takes SOOOOOOO LONG. No one EVER checks their countries forums/website. No one wouldn't hear it from other players. =/

LOL, dude, now you just sound ridiculous. How long do you think it would take PUI to mail out 400 emails! Go back and count how many people will be attending Worlds. Oh yeah, and they have to email people from 27 different countries. GET REAL.

So you're saying that you want some d0nk or some staller to win Worlds? I mean, I understand what you're saying. I might be a little bit upset that the format changes for Worlds if I wasn't in it, but think about it a little bit more. Do you really want an event where there is absolutely NO creativity whatsoever farther than that one tech card in GG? I know that creativity doesn't win games, but there should at least be more than one dominant deck this format...

When did I say that I wanted "some d0nk or some staller to win Worlds?" I don't know if you understand what I am saying. It doesn't matter what WE want. WE might not want "no creativity", but WE can't control what happens at Worlds.

You know what? The format is partially to blame for the lack of creativity, but it also falls back on the players too. How many players threw their creativity out the window so they could play the guaranteed win GG deck? The original poster of this thread believed that things could change if one person voiced their opinion. Well, how much would things change if people just chose not to play GG at Worlds for themselves? A lot. And you know what? YOU CAN CONTROL THAT!

You know, I feel bad for the players that have had to put up with GG all year, but they have to accept that by them playing GG themselves all year, they only helped the problem.

Everyone says they want a FUN tournament? Then don't play GG. It's your choice.

you would think a few sets would get rid of such a dominant deck. because, of course, the point of the game is to make money, no? so why in the world would PCL make a few cards that are so broken that no players would ever need to buy another set of cards? obviously, something went a little askew in testing. either our format is suppossed to include a wider variety of cards or PCL just really screwed it up somewhere. Or they just don't care about money, but for some reason, I just don't think that's it. :tongue:

PCL doesn't make cards to suit our format; they make cards to suit there's. Right now, they have so many other cards and answers to Gardevior, that is why it isn't as bad in Japan as it is outside Japan.
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Have fun everyone!
 
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