I THINK I'VE FIGURED OUT WHY THERE'S SUCH DISAGREEMENT!!
We are ALL thinking up DIFFERENT scenarios!
- Some of us are focused on CHILDREN playing.
- Some of us are discussing Master vs. Master
BUT ...
NONE of us have really discussed the subjective nature of OUR OPPONENT and THEN discussed CONDITIONS/SITUATIONS that make the actions OK or NOT OK !
So... this may help the entire thread out a little.
I sat and contemplated my OWN play at States and considered this thread's topic again.
I joke around ALOT when I play with people. Whether I really know them or not. If they're not intense, I'm constantly goofing off... lol
I got to thinking about how many PENALTIES I could catch if other's around me were not familiar with my personality and took my words at FACE VALUE !!
NOW ... there is ONE PIECE that hasn't really been discussed.
IT DEPENDS ON YOUR OPPONENT: Sometimes, it just doesn't matter
Let's flip it around a minute.
This topic IS situational.
and .. Sometimes,
it just doesn't matter.
If I'm playing my wife or someone from league, we may toss in some bluffing or whatever would otherwise be considered 'undesired sportsmanship' (like trash talking) BUT ... we'd be having fun.
If you and your oponent start getting a little silly during the game but there's a MUTUAL agreement about the gameplay, then... it's all about fun.
Noone is LETTING the other win.
Noone is cheating.
You're just having fun.
So.. using DarthPika's example with the condition of FRIENDLY/FAMILIAR OPPONENT in mind,
we get this.
Opponent: says "I'm thinking about dropping an Uxie here"
You say: "OH REALLY ... *holds up a card with evil grin*"
Opponent says: "you'd better NOT have that spray man! ahahahaha! Hmmm ... I'll take my chances. Setup!"
The two are having fun, but they're doing this to each other and they've added a component to THAT game that COULD be called out but since the SPIRIT is GOOD, there's really no harm done.
Both players are willing to live with the outcome of the game whether additional advantages were gained through their "fun little bluffing component" or not.
Does that twist your head up a little?
I KNOW you kind of understand where I'm coming from there though...
I think this is where our disagreement is coming from. The simple fact is, the actions would bother/affect some people while others wouldn't be affected AT ALL. They would simply play how they play REGARDLESS of what you do. Some would even APPRECIATE a little tricky twist or two to keep the game interesting.
The rules are in place to keep things fair and as FREE from disagreement as possible.
If they're both having fun and in agreement with whatever is occuring AND are cool with the outcome, then fun is had and there's no harm done. BUT that's MATCH SPECIFIC and really depends on who your opponent is.
I think THAT's the position that is missing in this entire thread. and THAT's where the tension is coming from.
Some things you just do IN GOOD FUN and there's no intention to be malicious or underhanded at all. Some actions that would, otherwise, be considered outside the boundaries of SOTG are fine when you and your opponent know each other and have an understanding for each other's play.
Another Example: When I'm playing in a tournament against someone from my own league, we get silly and do things like misannounce powers and attacks intentionally in an effort to be Jovial (aka.. kidding around). We still make plays according to the rules, but I couldn't say something like "I'll telepass your Cosmic Power and I'll PASS for the Knockout" to a perfect stranger without him being bothered or thinking I'm up to no good.
So .. i guess...
If you're having fun with someone you know (or are just getting along well with) and there's sort of an "unwritten agreement" as to how your match is being played, then.. no judge will be called and no REAL advantage is gained because your opponent is having fun with the little bluffs or whatever else.
No
game mechanics have been ignored. They're just having fun.
I think THAT's what is on the "Pro" side's minds.
If DarthPika held up that card against a perfect stranger and that person called over a judge, he'd be penalized for deceptive actions not fitting within the boundaries of SOTG.
If Darth and I were having fun and doing this to each other. Although not encouraged, but we're "allowing" it and mutually participating, neither is bothered, and both are mutually cool with the game's outcome, then... no harm done. No need for a ruling. We're just playing.
(is THAT sort of where you were going with that DarthPika?)
So...
As they taught me in School Law:
"The answer ALL of your questions is... It depends.