Werewolf XVIII: Dimensional Clash: Wolves/Outlaws Win!

[thunderjolt]

Why the sudden drop from HumanDestroyer? I think we should be pressuring all players suspicious at the moment, including HD and Vablakes. I'll not cast another vote just yet as there are some certain players that I wish to hear from first.

StrongRhino--Why do you unvote HD, but then say immediately after that you are suspicious of him, and then do not make any kind of vote of saying as to why your FoS warrants the unvote of HD.

Also, this whole "two teams" thing is really making me think that the wolves are trying to re-direct what the town is trying to achieve in the end. Thus I agree with the FoS on Tables. Does anyone know if the wolves are able to talk during the day, or even before the game started? I thought that I saw it mentioned somewhere in the thread, but I cannot find it.

 

[Crimsonsky]

I'm inclined to believe you, actually. The correct play when given a role such as that is to make its presence known as swiftly as possible. This does not mean you are by any means cleared. You could just as easily be an independent with a "survival" win condition (possibly even a Serial Killer), or any other alignment.

I never intended to be clear, I did what I thought would be best to cause less trouble

First off, it was PIKAJEWEL
I believe that we should keep an eye on his day activity while having night roles steer clear.

completely agreeing with this

The last point is crazy IMO. I have been contributing more than you have, so the same could be said of you. I have been creating conversation. I have been making valid points. I have been trying my best to help us (the town) fish out wolves. I don't know what you find so suspicious about me.

I really hate this part of the post, but what I dislike more is

All right, I was using the "Bad Townie Gambit". It reads:

This
these post completely contradict one another, on the first one, you try to look like a townie and on the next you claim to have pulled a gambit. Also do note, I love playing that gambit and have been lynched D1 countless times for playing. It requires a lot of experience and not an attractive enough play style for a beginner, why did you try pulling it?
and since you did say you pulled it and outed it, I am expecting you to out whatever reads you got from it, if I like your reads, I will not place a vote on you, otherwise expect it coming.

other things to note

Eclipse has a very good point about Shinori
in other words, get out here and make a valuable post Shinori
and also @ Darth Pika, care to give more thoughts into the game instead of some one lines, meta speaks you tend to be useless in most games and would like it if you were doing something productive

Luster - Town. Seems to be fairly new to not understand how scum try their hardest to gain town-cred. Doubtful scum would attack me on that point.

I can't help but laugh at the parts in italics

 

[Human Destroyer]

ProHawk, I'll post my reads when I get out of school. However, I explained that my Unvote was not because of getting voted. My vote remains on PP101 because we have STILL heard absolutely NOTHING of value from him.

I also think that Vablakes is actually playing noobtown and that people should stop worrying about how many scum teams there are.

 

[Sheepbro]

StrongRhino still seems suspicious to me and we'll see what to do about him later on, but for now I feel like Vablakes is a lot more scummy, for reasons I have stated in earlier posts. He also isn't really improving on it. So:
Unvote StrongRhino
Vote: Vablakes

This is a new player post that I like. The "new" doesn't come across as an excuse to state something anti-town. However, stuff like analyzing early wagons helps to find scum who are attempting to push mislynches by hopping on misguided wagons - thus, the nitpicking of votes on people who have accrued a large number of votes.

First of all, thanks for the compliment
Secondly, and I know I'm a bit late replying to this, but whilst I agree bandwagoning should be analysed, we can't really afford to be suspicious of every single person that in some way restates what someone else has said. Sure, they have to explain their own logic behind it, but with 23 required votes, people are going to have reasons that are close to each other.

 

[DarthPika]

@ Darth Pika, care to give more thoughts into the game instead of some one lines, meta speaks you tend to be useless in most games and would like it if you were doing something productive

Excuse me, but I the past few games I've either been stuck with a godawful situation, or night killed before I had a chance to do anything.

I'm not sure what else you want me to post right now. Thus far, I've said what I think is worth being said. There is nothing more which I wish to comment on at the moment. Just because I'm not posting everything that pops into my head, doesn't mean I'm not making any conclusions after looking over the thread. Most of the time, I prefer to wait a while to post those conclusions until there is more evidence to support them.

As I've already stated, (Perhaps Pikamaster would be kind enough to pause the game for a few days during these weeks, since I know many others are in the same situation) I have final papers, end of the semester homework, and finals to deal with from now until the 15th. I'll try to be active as possible, but I'm not going to be a super active poster during this time, or have too much time for the game otherwise. I hate having to make an excuse, but the game started at a relatively poor time, and academics always must come before a game.

 

[Sandslash7]

ProHawk: Yes, scorri has discovered thanks to eclipse point this out that Crimsonsky is a player on Serenes as well so that could explain some of that.

scorri would also like to explain that on Serenes we are usually required to use ##Vote to make it easier for the mod to find votes.

No response? No acknowledgement of your OMGUS vote?

Though I do like that idea. I might implement it into my next game.

I'm not sure what else you want me to post right now. Thus far, I've said what I think is worth being said. There is nothing more which I wish to comment on at the moment. Just because I'm not posting everything that pops into my head, doesn't mean I'm not making any conclusions after looking over the thread. Most of the time, I prefer to wait a while to post those conclusions until there is more evidence to support them.

There is plenty to discuss. Do you think Vablakes is a newb trying hard or do you think he is a wolf trying to get out of the spotlight? What do you think of Scorri and her impediment/Crimsonsky's crumb?

Role in. Lets get to huntin!

Role received.
Looking forward to lynching some wolves.

You two, explain the bold please.

 

[DragonClyne725]

He says best or only. Why would I be the only option? Most of this post is him defending himself against rolefishing, and he only devotes one sentence as to why he voted to me. And half of it was fishy with the whole "best or only" thing. He says he voted for me because I admitted to a misplay. We all make them. I admitted that I did. That isn't very suspicious. He gives no real reason why I am the best or only. It looks like he wants people to think that I'm the only option. There are clearly 45. And others that are acting scummy. I am by no means the only option. Also, earlier in the day, he appeared to be rolefishing. Sorry, just to suspicious for my liking.

If that was the only read you got off of your gambit, I'd say it wasn't very successful.

Could you please share your reads on a couple more people?

I'm not sure what else you want me to post right now. Thus far, I've said what I think is worth being said. There is nothing more which I wish to comment on at the moment/

I understand you're dealing with a ton of schoolwork, but it would be helpful if you could look and see who you think is acting suspicious. What is your opinion on Vablakes? What do you think about Crimsonsky's comment about not wanting to be targeted?

 

[ProHawk]

@SS7 - I am here to lynch wolves, and hunting is the only way I know how. Are you a wolf?

 

[Sandslash7]

No.

We all should be hunting wolves. That is obvious. But what drove you and Sheepbro to state the blatantly obvious before the game started?

Statements like those (similar in vein to Tables' "one usually sees two scum factions at those numbers.") can be mis/leading to members of the village, subconsciously telling them what you want them to believe.

 

[DarthPika]

There is plenty to discuss. Do you think Vablakes is a newb trying hard or do you think he is a wolf trying to get out of the spotlight? What do you think of Scorri and her impediment/Crimsonsky's crumb?

I already stated what I thought Scorri, and what I thought of crimsonsky. I do not believe there is too much to go on for either one of them as of now.

I understand you're dealing with a ton of schoolwork, but it would be helpful if you could look and see who you think is acting suspicious. What is your opinion on Vablakes? What do you think about Crimsonsky's comment about not wanting to be targeted?

I already stated my opinions of both these players. I'll probably try again later tonight for a more comprehensive look at the game. In all honesty, I just haven't had time to do a thorough read through, and don't want to start giving half formed opinions. I have a few things that I MUST get done today, but later either today, or tomorrow I should have time to give a more detailed opinion of what's going on.

 

[Vablakes]

Why should anyone believe you now? Also, if you have a play or reveal or whatever just say it. Saying that you have something then waiting is scummy. Until I actually see what this play is you get my vote.

Unvote: PMysterious
Vote: Vablakes

Well, this is the only other small read I get. Not very much reasoning behind it. All of his other posts have been pretty substantial, but this one just gave a couple of sentences that basically said "what you did is scummy". No real reason why it is scummy, he basically says "It is scummy so you get my vote." It honestly isn't nearly as suspicious as a lot of other things going on in this thread, like G Landers and Your_Face.

G Landers was rolefishing earlier, and he seemed like he wanted people to think that I am the only option for some reason, as previously stated. He gives no real reason for voting for me other that me admitting to a misplay and, well, that's it. He then proceeds to state that I am "the best or only" option to lynch. Why am I "the best or only" option for making a "mistake" (which was part of the gambit) early on and admitting it? Scorri posting in third person, HD for practically copy/pasting stuff from compendium to make himself look useful, Tables for posting like he has information that we don't, ect. And I'm the best or only option? Why would anyone want anyone to think that I'm the only option?

I also got these reads, though they have nothing to do with my gambit:

StrongRhino bandwagoned without much reason against HD.

Scorri has posted in non-third person. What townie posts in third person? Why would you? (I am sorry if it is an actual SI.)

PokemonPlayer101 posted a whole lot of nothing.

Human Destroyer jumped on me early game, perhaps trying to start a bandwagon. He posted a bunch of stuff that could have been copy/pasted, and from there his posts have been a whole bunch of nothing.

Your_Face clearly knows this game is still here, he posted twice. Both times had nothing to do with this game. What reason does he have to lurk and then post things that have absolutely nothing to do with this game?

Tables has posted like he has more info than us. Also (I think it was Tables, may have been Kayle) posted that they think that there are two teams. No one has said anything that would lead anyone to believe that. Where did they get that from? Would a wolf want us to believe that there are two teams?

Those reads could be nothing, but they could lead us to wolves. I say that we investigate these people and find out more. I don't mind if people continue to question me, as questioning people is how we find wolves.

@Crimsonsky, I tried this gambit because I am new, and I wanted to prove my worth in this game. I wanted to be really helpful, and I figured I'd try a gambit. I was reading cabd's guide and I saw that he said not to just sit back and let the power players slug it out with the wolves, and I followed his advice. I figured "what better way to learn about the game than trying a gambit! I can even help us win at the same time.".

 

[Shinori]

I have awoken.

Gonna read and get a post up.

 

[G landers]

Well, this is the only other small read I get. Not very much reasoning behind it. All of his other posts have been pretty substantial, but this one just gave a couple of sentences that basically said "what you did is scummy". No real reason why it is scummy, he basically says "It is scummy so you get my vote." It honestly isn't nearly as suspicious as a lot of other things going on in this thread, like G Landers and Your_Face.

G Landers was rolefishing earlier, and he seemed like he wanted people to think that I am the only option for some reason, as previously stated. He gives no real reason for voting for me other that me admitting to a misplay and, well, that's it. He then proceeds to state that I am "the best or only" option to lynch. Why am I "the best or only" option for making a "mistake" (which was part of the gambit) early on and admitting it? Scorri posting in third person, HD for practically copy/pasting stuff from compendium to make himself look useful, Tables for posting like he has information that we don't, ect. And I'm the best or only option? Why would anyone want anyone to think that I'm the only option?

I also got these reads, though they have nothing to do with my gambit:

StrongRhino bandwagoned without much reason against HD.

Scorri has posted in non-third person. What townie posts in third person? Why would you? (I am sorry if it is an actual SI.)

PokemonPlayer101 posted a whole lot of nothing.

Human Destroyer jumped on me early game, perhaps trying to start a bandwagon. He posted a bunch of stuff that could have been copy/pasted, and from there his posts have been a whole bunch of nothing.

Your_Face clearly knows this game is still here, he posted twice. Both times had nothing to do with this game. What reason does he have to lurk and then post things that have absolutely nothing to do with this game?

Tables has posted like he has more info than us. Also (I think it was Tables, may have been Kayle) posted that they think that there are two teams. No one has said anything that would lead anyone to believe that. Where did they get that from? Would a wolf want us to believe that there are two teams?

Those reads could be nothing, but they could lead us to wolves. I say that we investigate these people and find out more. I don't mind if people continue to question me, as questioning people is how we find wolves.

@Crimsonsky, I tried this gambit because I am new, and I wanted to prove my worth in this game. I wanted to be really helpful, and I figured I'd try a gambit. I was reading cabd's guide and I saw that he said not to just sit back and let the power players slug it out with the wolves, and I followed his advice. I figured "what better way to learn about the game than trying a gambit! I can even help us win at the same time.".

I meant as in so far you're the best or only option I can always switch if something better comes along.

 

[Sheepbro]

We all should be hunting wolves. That is obvious. But what drove you and Sheepbro to state the blatantly obvious before the game started?

There's this game, it's called werewolf. Basically, if you're a towny, the objective is to kill all the wolves. You do this by lynching them, unless you have a certain powerrole.

Oh and I didn't feel like typing: "Role received 1717171717."

 

[Shinori]

Here are a few reads I picked up along my catch-up:

Luster - Town. Seems to be fairly new to not understand how scum try their hardest to gain town-cred. Doubtful scum would attack me on that point.

Still reading but I did want to respond to this little thing I happened to see.

Luster isn't new to this game.

 

[Vablakes]

I meant as in so far you're the best or only option I can always switch if something better comes along.

But I am clearly not the only option. Why even put only? Others (including you) have been acting suspicious. You don't really defend why you said only. You don't just throw that word around. For example, you don't tell your girlfriend that she is the best and only person you love, and then go and tell her that you meant that she was the best and only at the time and if something better comes along you might switch. When someone says only, they mean only, not I might switch later on if something better comes along. Here is the definition for only.


a : alone in a class or category : sole <the only one left> <the only known species>

Hmm... Not much room for better things to come along, being the only one in a class or category. You clearly didn't mean that something better might come along, you meant only. And you didn't even really back it up with anything. You could have been trying to plant it in our minds so that subconsiously everyone thinks that I am the only option. There are clearly other options including:
Scorri
Human Destroyer
Tables
Your_Face
StrongRhino
PokemonPlayer101

And I'm the only option?

 

[jellyfisher]

But I am clearly not the only option. Why even put only? Others (including you) have been acting suspicious. You don't really defend why you said only. You don't just throw that word around. For example, you don't tell your girlfriend that she is the best and only person you love, and then go and tell her that you meant that she was the best and only at the time and if something better comes along you might switch. When someone says only, they mean only, not I might switch later on if something better comes along. Here is the definition for only.


a : alone in a class or category : sole <the only one left> <the only known species>

Hmm... Not much room for better things to come along, being the only one in a class or category. You clearly didn't mean that something better might come along, you meant only. And you didn't even really back it up with anything. You could have been trying to plant it in our minds so that subconsiously everyone thinks that I am the only option. There are clearly other options including:
Scorri
Human Destroyer
Tables
Your_Face
StrongRhino
PokemonPlayer101

And I'm the only option?

First off, I think you are starting to look to deep into what people are saying. Do you really think that he is trying to plant an idea into everyone's minds? Seriously, this isn't Inception. Players (I would hope) aren't going to look at that, and believe that you are the only option because G landers planted an idea in their minds. They are going to look at the evidence against you, and any other players that they believe to be suspicious and make their decision off of that. Not off of what G landers said.

Also, I think that you need to start taking a different approach with your defense, because saying that you were attempting a gambit is not working. At least not with me. Why should we assume that you are telling the truth? A few pages back, you started saying that you had a plan, (or something like that) and that you were telling us that so we would know that it was true when you revealed what it was. This however is not what happens in a situation like that. Unless you had said that you were playing like that intentionally before anyone questioned you, you could be lying. We have no way to disprove what you are saying, but we don't have any way to prove it either.

I would suggest that you start telling us more about the other options we have. If I remember correctly, the only reason you said that we should vote for Scorri is because she is talking in third person. But is that really a good enough reason for voting her? Sure, it is true that she is another option for the lynch, but that does not mean that she is a good option. You could say that I am an option for the lynch, but does that mean that it would be a good idea? Just because there are other options does not mean that they are better then the one being discussed. And that is what I think you need to prove. Convince everyone that there is a better option then yourself for the lynch. And don't attempt to do so by simply pointing out other options. Make arguments against the players that you believe to be a better option for the lynch.

 

[Diaz]

Hey guys, just got back from a long cities trip. First impression: This thread moves really fast. I had been skimming on my phone while I was away, and saw the vote for me. I remember thinking it was for something dumb, but I will give a proper response to whatever it was after I'm caught up on the thread. I'm sure there will be a lot of other things for me to comment on too.

A little housekeeping note - everyone note that this game day ends right in the middle of a cities weekend. I think some players will have the same issue I had this past weekend with difficulty posting. Plan ahead for this. For example, I'll make sure to have my phone with internet access on me, and I'll set an alarm to remind me to check in at around 6pm EST. It's harder to make long posts on a phone. It won't be ideal, but it will hopefully be sufficient. If you know you'll be running around for cities in the critical final hours of the game day, try to fit this game into your schedule.

 

[Vablakes]

sorry wrong tread

can people check out my tread

I would just like to say what the heck. Seriously. He knows this is here, he signed up, and posted random garbage. Your_Face, defend yourself.

First off, I think you are starting to look to deep into what people are saying. Do you really think that he is trying to plant an idea into everyone's minds? Seriously, this isn't Inception. Players (I would hope) aren't going to look at that, and believe that you are the only option because G landers planted an idea in their minds. They are going to look at the evidence against you, and any other players that they believe to be suspicious and make their decision off of that. Not off of what G landers said.

Also, I think that you need to start taking a different approach with your defense, because saying that you were attempting a gambit is not working. At least not with me. Why should we assume that you are telling the truth? A few pages back, you started saying that you had a plan, (or something like that) and that you were telling us that so we would know that it was true when you revealed what it was. This however is not what happens in a situation like that. Unless you had said that you were playing like that intentionally before anyone questioned you, you could be lying. We have no way to disprove what you are saying, but we don't have any way to prove it either.

I would suggest that you start telling us more about the other options we have. If I remember correctly, the only reason you said that we should vote for Scorri is because she is talking in third person. But is that really a good enough reason for voting her? Sure, it is true that she is another option for the lynch, but that does not mean that she is a good option. You could say that I am an option for the lynch, but does that mean that it would be a good idea? Just because there are other options does not mean that they are better then the one being discussed. And that is what I think you need to prove. Convince everyone that there is a better option then yourself for the lynch. And don't attempt to do so by simply pointing out other options. Make arguments against the players that you believe to be a better option for the lynch.

Tables: It seems like he knows something we don't. How could he possibly know whether or not the wolves could talk pregame? What makes him think that there are two teams? He may have played before, but that doesn't explain his knowledge of the wolves pregame activities. How does he know whether or not the wolves talked pregame?

Scorri: She isn't to scummy IMO. I am still suspicious however. She has posted without third person before, so why start faking it now?

StrongRhino bandwagoned without much reason. Not very scummy, but still scummy.

Your_Face was addressed above.

PokemonPlayer101 is sort of eh, not really scummy, but all of his posts have been as useful as a Zubat in a dark cave.

Human Destroyer was pretty much copy/pasting advice in the beginning, attacking me without a very strong reason and has been posting little to nothing recently.

G Landers was rolefishing IMO, and he also did the whole "only" thing. Look at my previous posts for a full analysis of that.

And I'm not looking to deep. If looking at "only" is to deep then so is the argument against the word "must" from one of my previous posts. I'll go into more detail on the suspicious characters later, but for now I gotta get stuff done.

 

[Human Destroyer]

Reads, Part 1

I'm going to do this in multiple parts, because I do have homework to do and I want to do as many of these as possible, so let's begin! I'll go in sign up order:

1. Sandslash7

Sandslash, I'm going to address you directly and say you're getting on people for things even more shoddy than my first Vablakes accusation. The fake speech impediment I can kind of understand, but thinking it's suspicious to say "Looking forward to lynching wolves"? I find that a little nitpicky if I do say so myself.

Read: Null

My Questions:

Why are you nitpicking for small details to find scum? If you aren't, please correct me, it just seems like you are.

2. jellyfisher

I also think that votes are being thrown about to readily. Seriously, players are jumping on people for the smallest reasons imaginable. While I don't think that it is flat out hurting the town, I do believe that it needs to be restrained a little.

I agree with this, although I also admit I am partly to blame. He's been actively scumhunting, although I'm a little wary as this is the way he played last game and he was scum. I haven't seen his other games though so this could just be his usual playstyle.

Read: Leans Town

3. PMysterious

Please, PM, listen to the mod. He said the subs had nothing to do with faction, but rather them just obtaining information they weren't supposed to. They could've all been townies communicating outside the game, it could've been a case of a wolf PMing the others by accident. The point is, we don't know. I'd rather not make assumptions based on such a miniscule amount of information.

My Questions:

What are your reads on me? Vablakes? ProHawk?

Read: Null

4. Human Destroyer

I don't need to read myself, because I know what I am.

Read: Confirmed Town

Well, I'm confirmed town to myself, so that counts for something...right?

5. Dragonclyne725

Dragonclyne has brought up some interesting points, such as scorri's thinking of SS7 as scummy but not himself even though they had done the exact same thing, and I don't think a scum would've come right out and said that. He's done a lot of (relevant) question-asking, which I consider pro-town.

Read: Town

6. DarthPika

Lots of posts making excuses for inactivity, although I can't really blame him since he explained that before the game even started. The only vote he's made is for Vablakes, which is doesn't really prove anything since a lot of people have their votes on Vablakes at this point.

Read: Null

My Questions:

What are your reads on Sandslash7? Dragonclyne?

7. Kirbyking

Uh, hey, Kirbyking? Do you plan on posting anything? At all? Ever? This lurking is (as far as I can tell) extremely unlike you, and I find that suspicious.

Read: Leans Scum

Yes, I know it seems like a large accusation to make but lurking is just so unlike him. He could have reasons for being away (Finals maybe?) but if that is the case I would like it if he at least posted to tell us that.

8. Moo2

Has made exactly two posts; his in to replace post and his role received post. Unlike KK, who I have seen play before, I have nothing to get from this. Moo2, please post more!

Read: Null

9. Shinori

Has posted nothing of value. Literally made an RVS vote for Luster Purge, said he would read and promised a post, then didn't post...yet (I just realized as I was typing this he only made that post three hours ago, so forgive me if he ninjas me with a post)

Read: Null

Post more please!

10. Butter nut ninja

This is his only post. Uh yeah, butter nut, you need to post if you're part of the game. Please post more!

Read: Null

I just can't get a read on him until he actually makes some posts.

11. Thunderjolt

I think this post is pretty pro-town. He's right that if you find someone suspicious, you shouldn't just suddenly unvote them and then make no vote whatsoever to justify the unvoting (I was in no danger of being lynched this early in the day, so that isn't an excuse). I also find his jpulice vote proves that he isn't afraid to go against the feelings of other "pro-town" players if he finds someone suspicious. I find that to be a pro-town thing to do.

Read: Leans Town

My Questions:

What are your reads on me and Vablakes? Has anything else jpulice said made your suspicion of him continue?

That's the 10 I'm going to do for now (No, doing a read on yourself doesn't count as 1). I have homework to do, so I'll do another 10-15 after.