Public Healthcare is Bad
- Thread starter pat460
- Start date
Well, if we ever get past the style of the original post into a discussion of it's points, we'll see if that happens or not.
Um... the internet was invented by a British man (at least, the internet as we know it today). Nothing to do with defense at first - it was a means for scientists to communicate with each other.
Totally unconnected with the thread (on-topic: finally, you numpty Americans have done the decent thing) but oh well...
Arcanine/Arbok Master
New Member
Posting a copypasta, having it revealed as such, and not having the thread get locked? Thats a new one on me.
@Pat: if you wanted to start a debate, posting that opening is not the way to do it. Thats asking for a war which is kind of happening right now. It set the overall tone of this thread to something that can not handle respectable debate. From the posts we've seen its quite clear that I am right: very little healthcare debate is actually happening. why? Because this first post begs to not be taken seriously. If the mods had any self-respect this would have been locked for "being spammy" about 4 hours ago.
Sorry, everything important was invented in the US.
Marconi?
Tesla?
Sorry, don't know them.
[satire tag]
Actually, I find it fascinating that you keep arguing the process of the debate rather than the issues themselves.
Deja vu!
How about we scrap this topic and start over again from scratch with bipartisanship?
prodigal_fanboy
New Member
"From West Philadelphia born and raised,
On the playground's where I spent most of my days.
"The weather's too cold, son, pack your things;
all of us are going to New Orleans!"
But Katrina came along, winds hammering steady,
so we decided to flee in our beat-up Chevy.
And thank goodness we did, 'cuz down came the levee.
As we made our way through Minnesota,
down came a bridge as we drove over.
Thank goodness we made it to the other side,
before a collapse could end our ride.
We fled calamity to Britain, since America sucks,
cashed in for pounds all of our bucks.
Went to the doctor with a nasty cold
had to wait behind some illiterate Poles.
We all learned Spanish and before you know,
Pops said Venezuela was the way to go.
So again we fled to Chavez' state,
with all the oil revenue it would be great!
... oh wait...
THE END."
Editor's note: the narrator of this epic poem was killed in riots due to a sugar shortage in the nationalized supermarket chain of Venezuela. A shame, considering he missed out on the benefits of the stimulus package!
On the playground's where I spent most of my days.
"The weather's too cold, son, pack your things;
all of us are going to New Orleans!"
But Katrina came along, winds hammering steady,
so we decided to flee in our beat-up Chevy.
And thank goodness we did, 'cuz down came the levee.
As we made our way through Minnesota,
down came a bridge as we drove over.
Thank goodness we made it to the other side,
before a collapse could end our ride.
We fled calamity to Britain, since America sucks,
cashed in for pounds all of our bucks.
Went to the doctor with a nasty cold
had to wait behind some illiterate Poles.
We all learned Spanish and before you know,
Pops said Venezuela was the way to go.
So again we fled to Chavez' state,
with all the oil revenue it would be great!
... oh wait...
THE END."
Editor's note: the narrator of this epic poem was killed in riots due to a sugar shortage in the nationalized supermarket chain of Venezuela. A shame, considering he missed out on the benefits of the stimulus package!
StarrySora
New Member
So I heard that if you don't buy the government approved health care you get fined $25,000 or go to jail...is any of this true or is my dad just buying into the "Obama is going to end the world" stuff? Honestly I don't think the health care is a good idea...obviously Obama has never been to Canada. This $25k fine and possible jail time has me scared to even live anymore.
He's buying into the "death squads".
For the penalty for not having health care to reach $25K, he'd have to have an income of $1 Million!
Yes that is true. Not sure about what the fine will be but you will be fined and face possible jail time. They better get a cell ready for me.
Box of Fail
New Member
I think doing nothing is much better than making the situation worse. Only in Washington can you spend trillions of dollars and claim you are reducing thre defecit. As about the only right-winger posting in this thread, I feel pretty lonely 
Everytime the government has ever done anything big, it has always been a failure. Paint my bridges, fix my potholes, make my public transportation work, save my schools, and correct my contradictory public signs.
Then talk to me about being worthy of running my life better than I can myself.
Everytime the government has ever done anything big, it has always been a failure. Paint my bridges, fix my potholes, make my public transportation work, save my schools, and correct my contradictory public signs.
Then talk to me about being worthy of running my life better than I can myself.
pat460
New Member
Government run healthcare COULD be good. I dont think the bill that was just passed is the way to do it, but there is a way to do it. I hope that is obvious since universal healthcare works all over the world. What we need is a bill that actually makes sense and is thought out well. One of the reasons it passed was pressure from the supporters of the bill, and the American people. the house was so worried about passing a bill to make the people begging for one happy that they passed it to hastily and we get this. But I think it is still a good thing that it passed, because it is a start. I think that Phillip DeFranco summarized it pretty well in his new video in which he talks mostly about healthcare. The basic logic behind it is that even if this doesnt work, we can always fix it, and if it is too messed up to fix, we can scratch it and start over, and just go back to private healthcare for a while while we figure out a better way to do it.
Arcanine/Arbok Master
New Member
The bill is allowing all the positive effects to roll out first but doesnt increase taxes until after the next presidential election. Its quite clear that this is to make the bill seem successful and withhold the outrageous repercussions until after Obama has secured a 2nd term.
I believe republicans are almost equally guilty of this trickery when they have control. the ONLY way for us to have a chance of stopping the government from porkbelly spending and harmful bills it to vote 3rd party. As it is we have a vicious cycle:
the Rs are in office under bush. He starts a war that costs too much money and accomplishes very little. The people get mad at the Rs and vote in a mass majority of Ds, including Obama. They now proceed to spend money on THEIR pet projects and various wastes like the stimulus package which really just succeeded in increasing government debt. Now people are mad and Kennedy's seat goes to the Rs and soon the rest of the gov goes back to the Rs. Now the Rs spend money on pet projects and wars that annoy the public. Do you see the cycle here?
tl;dr The Ds and Rs are way to comfortable right now which is why I voted for Ralph Nader.
bullados
<a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?
I find this exceptionally funny...
Riddle me this, Batboy. How can something be "rushed" if it's been in the works for a "long" time? I believe this particular piece of legislation has been in the works for over a year at this point. How is that a "rushed" piece of legislation?
Oh yeah. this. Did it miss anything?
Riddle me this, Batboy. How can something be "rushed" if it's been in the works for a "long" time? I believe this particular piece of legislation has been in the works for over a year at this point. How is that a "rushed" piece of legislation?
Oh yeah. this. Did it miss anything?
prodigal_fanboy
New Member
Bill: long-debated, narrowly passed in Senate.
House was facing stalemate, so whips scramble to put together a package of approved changes that can buy the vote for "bill if changes accepted" instead of having to win the bill as it stands.
So was the Senate Bill rushed? Maybe, but doubtful.
Was the package of add-ons a rush move to get SOMETHING passed? In my mind, yes. Might just be coincidence/another example of how Washington works.
Nice try though.
bullados
<a href="http://pokegym.net/forums/showthread.php?
It's a lot harder to get something *passed* than it is to get something *changed*. The fact that there is something on the books regarding healthcare reform, even if it isn't perfect, is a step in the right direction. There are several things about this bill that I don't like, such as fining those that don't have health insurance and the overall pricetag. However, the things that I DO like about the bill (overhauling student loans, eliminating premium bumps, stopping dropping due to illness, etc) far outweighs its negatives to me. Those can be worked out in amendments later, much like the Civil Rights and Medicare bills from the 60s.
tl;dr: Is it perfect? No. Is it a step in the right direction? IMO, yes.
tl;dr: Is it perfect? No. Is it a step in the right direction? IMO, yes.
SLOW DECK
New Member
.........
"We the people" tell the government what to do, it doesn't tell us. "We the people" are the driver, the government is the car. And we decide where it should go, and by what route, and how fast. Almost all the world's constitutions are documents in which governments tell the people what their privileges are. Our Constitution is a document in which "We the people" tell the government what it is allowed to do. "We the people" are free. (1984)
...... ....
But at the moment I'd like to talk about another way because this threat is with us and at the moment is more imminent. One of the traditional methods of imposing statism or socialism on a people has been by way of medicine. It's very easy to disguise a medical program as a humanitarian project. . . . Now, the American people, if you put it to them about socialized medicine and gave them a chance to choose, would unhesitatingly vote against it. We have an example of this. Under the Truman administration it was proposed that we have a compulsory health insurance program for all people in the United States, and, of course, the American people unhesitatingly rejected this.(1961)
....
The doctor begins to lose freedom. . . . First you decide that the doctor can have so many patients. They are equally divided among the various doctors by the government. But then doctors aren’t equally divided geographically. So a doctor decides he wants to practice in one town and the government has to say to him, you can't live in that town. They already have enough doctors. You have to go someplace else. And from here it's only a short step to dictating where he will go. . . . All of us can see what happens once you establish the precedent that the government can determine a man's working place and his working methods, determine his employment. From here it's a short step to all the rest of socialism, to determining his pay. And pretty soon your son won't decide, when he's in school, where he will go or what he will do for a living. He will wait for the government to tell him where he will go to work and what he will do. (1961)
....
I have spent most of my life as a Democrat. I recently have seen fit to follow another course. I believe that the issues confronting us cross party lines. (1964)
..........
A recession is when your neighbor loses his job. A depression is when you lose yours. And recovery is when Jimmy Carter loses his. (1980)
......
In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. (1981)
Quotes that are Pastable, because they have been done so already by millions.
"We the people" tell the government what to do, it doesn't tell us. "We the people" are the driver, the government is the car. And we decide where it should go, and by what route, and how fast. Almost all the world's constitutions are documents in which governments tell the people what their privileges are. Our Constitution is a document in which "We the people" tell the government what it is allowed to do. "We the people" are free. (1984)
...... ....
But at the moment I'd like to talk about another way because this threat is with us and at the moment is more imminent. One of the traditional methods of imposing statism or socialism on a people has been by way of medicine. It's very easy to disguise a medical program as a humanitarian project. . . . Now, the American people, if you put it to them about socialized medicine and gave them a chance to choose, would unhesitatingly vote against it. We have an example of this. Under the Truman administration it was proposed that we have a compulsory health insurance program for all people in the United States, and, of course, the American people unhesitatingly rejected this.(1961)
....
The doctor begins to lose freedom. . . . First you decide that the doctor can have so many patients. They are equally divided among the various doctors by the government. But then doctors aren’t equally divided geographically. So a doctor decides he wants to practice in one town and the government has to say to him, you can't live in that town. They already have enough doctors. You have to go someplace else. And from here it's only a short step to dictating where he will go. . . . All of us can see what happens once you establish the precedent that the government can determine a man's working place and his working methods, determine his employment. From here it's a short step to all the rest of socialism, to determining his pay. And pretty soon your son won't decide, when he's in school, where he will go or what he will do for a living. He will wait for the government to tell him where he will go to work and what he will do. (1961)
....
I have spent most of my life as a Democrat. I recently have seen fit to follow another course. I believe that the issues confronting us cross party lines. (1964)
..........
A recession is when your neighbor loses his job. A depression is when you lose yours. And recovery is when Jimmy Carter loses his. (1980)
......
In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem. (1981)
Quotes that are Pastable, because they have been done so already by millions.